How safe are your roads?

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Alienturnedhuman
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How safe are your roads?

Post by Alienturnedhuman »

I came across this map of the world with road death rates per capita and it makes for quite interesting viewing. It is certainly interesting to compare perception against reality.

http://roadskillmap.com/

Many people in the UK think that our roads are very dangerous, yet we have the fourth safest after Iceland, Sweden and Andorra. Given that Andorra and Iceland are micronations, and Sweden has a very low population density, (and the numbers aren't that different, Iceland 2.8 per 100,000, Sweden 3.0 per 100,000, Andorra 3,0 per 100,000 and the UK 3.7 per 100,000) this is a remarkable result and certainly puts things into perspective when you hear all the moaning.

To put it into perpective, the death rate on UK roads is 25% less than Germany, nearly half of France and one third of the death rate in the United States. What's particularly astounding about the last one is that the US has a fraction of the population density of the UK, with wider straighter roads, meaning you would expect it to be the other way around.

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f1madman
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by f1madman »

Just goes to show the UK produces some of the best drivers which is why we produced the most WDC :)
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Harpo
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by Harpo »

f1madman wrote:Just goes to show the UK produces some of the best drivers which is why we produced the most WDC :)
May be it just shows UK produced the slowest and dullest drivers, which is why some felt obliged to get a revenge on race tracks...
As my brother said : "I've got the brain of a four year old. I'll bet he was glad to be rid of it".

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f1madman
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by f1madman »

Slow and steady wins the race...
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moby
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by moby »

I wonder if the % is of pop or drivers?

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f1madman
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by f1madman »

It'll be by population as even if you don't drive... you're actually more likily to be the fatality in a car accident.
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minchy
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by minchy »

It does show that a more developed society will be more likely to have less fatalities on the roads. Whether this is due to it's citizens being more law abiding, better testing with a harder pass grade, better policing to enforce the laws or something entirely different is another debate.
There is no theory of evolution, just a list of animals that Chuck Norris allows to live.

painless
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by painless »

minchy wrote: It does show that a more developed society will be more likely to have less fatalities on the roads. Whether this is due to it's citizens being more law abiding, better testing with a harder pass grade, better policing to enforce the laws or something entirely different is another debate.
And maybe safer cars instead of bean-tin deathtraps!
I live in a city of about 7000 and we had a fatality last week which not only made the news but probably put all the statistics out of whack!

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f1madman
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by f1madman »

painless wrote:
minchy wrote: It does show that a more developed society will be more likely to have less fatalities on the roads. Whether this is due to it's citizens being more law abiding, better testing with a harder pass grade, better policing to enforce the laws or something entirely different is another debate.
And maybe safer cars instead of bean-tin deathtraps!
I live in a city of about 7000 and we had a fatality last week which not only made the news but probably put all the statistics out of whack!
7000?... That's not a city, more like a very small town.
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moby
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by moby »

Or even better separation. that is pavements/sidewalks for pedestrians, road markings and well defined right of way and road boundaries.

I also suspect the driving test would have an effect too

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minchy
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by minchy »

f1madman wrote:
painless wrote:
minchy wrote: It does show that a more developed society will be more likely to have less fatalities on the roads. Whether this is due to it's citizens being more law abiding, better testing with a harder pass grade, better policing to enforce the laws or something entirely different is another debate.
And maybe safer cars instead of bean-tin deathtraps!
I live in a city of about 7000 and we had a fatality last week which not only made the news but probably put all the statistics out of whack!
7000?... That's not a city, more like a very small town.
Very true, there's a town just outside the city I live with a population of around 9,000 and until about 20 years ago, it was classed as a village.
There is no theory of evolution, just a list of animals that Chuck Norris allows to live.

painless
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by painless »

f1madman wrote:
painless wrote:
minchy wrote:
7000?... That's not a city, more like a very small town.

Sorry to disappoint guys but it really is a city ( a very small city) Definition is tied up with tax status not population
http://www.city.iqaluit.nu.ca/i18n/english/index.html

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moby
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by moby »

minchy wrote:
f1madman wrote:
painless wrote:
minchy wrote: It does show that a more developed society will be more likely to have less fatalities on the roads. Whether this is due to it's citizens being more law abiding, better testing with a harder pass grade, better policing to enforce the laws or something entirely different is another debate.
And maybe safer cars instead of bean-tin deathtraps!
I live in a city of about 7000 and we had a fatality last week which not only made the news but probably put all the statistics out of whack!
7000?... That's not a city, more like a very small town.
Very true, there's a town just outside the city I live with a population of around 9,000 and until about 20 years ago, it was classed as a village.

I live in a 'town' of 80,000 and it is thought of as the houses near the bypass :twisted:

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f1madman
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by f1madman »

painless wrote:
f1madman wrote:
painless wrote:
minchy wrote:
7000?... That's not a city, more like a very small town.

Sorry to disappoint guys but it really is a city ( a very small city) Definition is tied up with tax status not population
http://www.city.iqaluit.nu.ca/i18n/english/index.html
My mistake my town is only 30,000 small.
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Argentum
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by Argentum »

My town - 200,000+ Still not a city.

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Covalent
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by Covalent »

I only have one road and AFAIK no-one's ever been killed on it :lol:

flyboy10
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by flyboy10 »

I was surprised UK was so low. Is there anywhere lower than Iceland? I wonder if there are any stats for where people enjoy driving the most?

Argentum
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by Argentum »

flyboy10 wrote:I was surprised UK was so low. Is there anywhere lower than Iceland? I wonder if there are any stats for where people enjoy driving the most?
Sark? ;)

flyboy10
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by flyboy10 »

Argentum wrote:
flyboy10 wrote:I was surprised UK was so low. Is there anywhere lower than Iceland? I wonder if there are any stats for where people enjoy driving the most?
Sark? ;)
No, no sark, being genuine ;)

Is Sark one of the islands that completely prohibits cars?

Argentum
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by Argentum »

flyboy10 wrote:
Argentum wrote:
flyboy10 wrote:I was surprised UK was so low. Is there anywhere lower than Iceland? I wonder if there are any stats for where people enjoy driving the most?
Sark? ;)
No, no sark, being genuine ;)

Is Sark one of the islands that completely prohibits cars?

Lol.

Yes it is, though who knows, they might have dozens of accidents involving bikes?

Harpo
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by Harpo »

Seriously now (be merciful, I'm not used to...).

When I started driving in the seventies' there were more than 12 000 deaths (and almost 17 000 ! in 1972 - since 1973, the numbers have decreased every year) in road accidents in France, and you couldn't travel without seeing recently crashed cars on the side of the road, or accidents happening... Nowadays there's twice the number of cars than then on the roads, and the death toll is under 4 000.

From my own experience, there are a few obvious explanations : Better roads, more highways, better and safer cars and drastic control of the speed limits (and I have to say that I don't drive as fast as I did, though having to check my speed more than often... Hopefully there are still roads where driving at the speed limit is driving fast).
And I don't see anymore the same amount of criminal stupidities I could see when I was younger, like overtakes in blind curves or with thick mist, or drivers overtaking a whole line of cars, and crossing the line if necessary. I can't believe people get smarter and more aware of the dangers (but I hope I'm wrong).
Numbers began decreasing with mandatory safety belts... My father always had seat belts in his cars since early sixties, after he witnessed and accident in which the only survivors had seat belts. It was so rare that the first ones he got in his car were plane safety belts with an Air France mark on the locks... It took more than 10 years to get them mandatory in new cars, and soon after even in used cars...

About safer cars : I only had one accident in my life, and entirely my own fault. I dozed off while driving after working all night, and got very lucky. I crossed the road, a road usually full of trucks but it was lunchtime, and ended stuck sideways in the opposite large ditch after bumping every side of the car against whatever part of earth it could meet. My car was sent to the bin, but all I got was the blue print of the safety belt on my shoulder. I won't bet that 10 years earlier I wouldn't have been sent to the bin along with my car... And now I would even make your Queen wait for me if i feel I'm not awaken enough to drive to meet her in time...
As my brother said : "I've got the brain of a four year old. I'll bet he was glad to be rid of it".

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minchy
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by minchy »

Argentum wrote:My town - 200,000+ Still not a city.
And my City >200,000! We have a cathedral though, which is one of the defining criteria in the UK. Also not much chance of road accidents within the city limits as most of the roads were built by the Romans and then the Vikings, not much future planning on their part for cars so there's lots of traffic lights and one way streets and my normal average speed from a full tank of petrol is about 16 mph (including the occasional 50-70mph run out of the city) the traffic's that bad!

It's some fair points from Harpo, enforced speed limits, mandatory seat belts, good roads and cars are all important factors. Also, the French learning how to use a roundabout may have helped their numbers a bit too!
There is no theory of evolution, just a list of animals that Chuck Norris allows to live.

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moby
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by moby »

minchy wrote:
Argentum wrote:My town - 200,000+ Still not a city.
And my City >200,000! We have a cathedral though, which is one of the defining criteria in the UK. Also not much chance of road accidents within the city limits as most of the roads were built by the Romans and then the Vikings, not much future planning on their part for cars so there's lots of traffic lights and one way streets and my normal average speed from a full tank of petrol is about 16 mph (including the occasional 50-70mph run out of the city) the traffic's that bad!

It's some fair points from Harpo, enforced speed limits, mandatory seat belts, good roads and cars are all important factors. Also, the French learning how to use a roundabout may have helped their numbers a bit too!

I read that the average speed to cross London in a fast cab in 1813 was 7 mph.

Today, it is, errm 7mph


(Cant recall the ororiginl place I saw it, I looked it up and there are several places with conflicting information, but it is all quite close)

enchantment25
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by enchantment25 »

Argentum wrote:
flyboy10 wrote:
Argentum wrote:
flyboy10 wrote:I was surprised UK was so low. Is there anywhere lower than Iceland? I wonder if there are any stats for where people enjoy driving the most?
Sark? ;)
No, no sark, being genuine ;)

Is Sark one of the islands that completely prohibits cars?

Lol.

Yes it is, though who knows, they might have dozens of accidents involving bikes?
Not a bike but a horse...
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... anned.html

Fiki
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by Fiki »

Belgium is one of the worst places in W-Europe. Every time I drive my car or motorbike, I am amazed by the number of people who seem to think that getting home 5 minutes earlier is fundamental to their sanity. They should buy a satnav and actually pay attention to how little time can be gained by having an insanely expensive driving style. And although it would be nice to drive in a more sporty way, neither the traffic density, the state of the roads or the stupidity of other drivers allows it.

I occasionally drive in England, and every time it strikes me how well organized traffic is there. On the few occasions I rode my bike on the motorways in Germany, I never felt endangered by other drivers, even well above 200km/h. Surprising, that. Still, even there traffic isn't what it used to be.
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painless
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by painless »

enchantment25 wrote:Belgium is one of the worst places in W-Europe
Quite agree. Once saw some dumbass reversing on the motorway because he'd missed his exit! Puts Spa in a whole different light doesn't it?

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Tufty
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by Tufty »

When we were in Belgium for the GP last year we had a lorry drift into our lane, nearly crushing us against the concrete barrier. We also saw a man reading a magazine while driving, paying no attention at all to the motorway.
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Argentum
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by Argentum »

Tufty wrote:When we were in Belgium for the GP last year we had a lorry drift into our lane, nearly crushing us against the concrete barrier. We also saw a man reading a magazine while driving, paying no attention at all to the motorway.

A bit off-topic, but that reminded me of something I saw a couple of years back.

There is a four lane road near me (40 limit) with a speed camera on it, which the police had amusingly hidden behind a road sign.

Since all the locals know it's there, most of the traffic travels at 50, slows for 100m or so, then goes safely on it's way again at 50.

I was once going past this camera (at 40), overtaking a car doing about 35mph, the driver of which was on the phone, had a map on the steering wheel, and was writing on a piece of paper on top of the map. (I guess, taking directions from whoever was on the phone).

It just struck me that, if I had been doing 50 and set the camera off, I would be the one considered a dangerous driver.

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moby
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by moby »

Argentum wrote:
Tufty wrote:When we were in Belgium for the GP last year we had a lorry drift into our lane, nearly crushing us against the concrete barrier. We also saw a man reading a magazine while driving, paying no attention at all to the motorway.

A bit off-topic, but that reminded me of something I saw a couple of years back.

There is a four lane road near me (40 limit) with a speed camera on it, which the police had amusingly hidden behind a road sign.

Since all the locals know it's there, most of the traffic travels at 50, slows for 100m or so, then goes safely on it's way again at 50.

I was once going past this camera (at 40), overtaking a car doing about 35mph, the driver of which was on the phone, had a map on the steering wheel, and was writing on a piece of paper on top of the map. (I guess, taking directions from whoever was on the phone).

It just struck me that, if I had been doing 50 and set the camera off, I would be the one considered a dangerous driver.

Have you seen the TV add for ( I thinkn it is) LV insurance? Are you a safe driver?

The girl driving the car whan the object falls off the truck in front of her just snatches the wheel and dives into the outside lane,,,, without even looking in her mirror.

Is that good driving, or would leaving a longer gap be better? It seems that even the people showing us what is good driving dont know the difference between good driving and good reactions

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Black_Flag_11
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by Black_Flag_11 »

moby wrote: Have you seen the TV add for ( I thinkn it is) LV insurance? Are you a safe driver?

The girl driving the car whan the object falls off the truck in front of her just snatches the wheel and dives into the outside lane,,,, without even looking in her mirror.

Is that good driving, or would leaving a longer gap be better? It seems that even the people showing us what is good driving dont know the difference between good driving and good reactions
The advert was about keeping the no claim bonus, which she would have done with that incident.

But I thought the exact same thing, anything could have been in the lane to left of her, that certainly not an example of good driving. If anything that just gave the impression that keeping your no claims bonus is more down to luck in situations like that, rather than good driving.

Poor advert.

vikz22
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by vikz22 »

Black_Flag_11 wrote:
moby wrote: Have you seen the TV add for ( I thinkn it is) LV insurance? Are you a safe driver?

The girl driving the car whan the object falls off the truck in front of her just snatches the wheel and dives into the outside lane,,,, without even looking in her mirror.

Is that good driving, or would leaving a longer gap be better? It seems that even the people showing us what is good driving dont know the difference between good driving and good reactions
The advert was about keeping the no claim bonus, which she would have done with that incident.

But I thought the exact same thing, anything could have been in the lane to left of her, that certainly not an example of good driving. If anything that just gave the impression that keeping your no claims bonus is more down to luck in situations like that, rather than good driving.

Poor advert.

OMG i thought i was the only one! i thought what the hell she just swerved without looking!

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Alienturnedhuman
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by Alienturnedhuman »

vikz22 wrote:
Black_Flag_11 wrote:
moby wrote: Have you seen the TV add for ( I thinkn it is) LV insurance? Are you a safe driver?

The girl driving the car whan the object falls off the truck in front of her just snatches the wheel and dives into the outside lane,,,, without even looking in her mirror.

Is that good driving, or would leaving a longer gap be better? It seems that even the people showing us what is good driving dont know the difference between good driving and good reactions
The advert was about keeping the no claim bonus, which she would have done with that incident.

But I thought the exact same thing, anything could have been in the lane to left of her, that certainly not an example of good driving. If anything that just gave the impression that keeping your no claims bonus is more down to luck in situations like that, rather than good driving.

Poor advert.

OMG i thought i was the only one! i thought what the hell she just swerved without looking!
To be fair, a good driver will be aware of what is around them and would know if they could swerve into that lane or not.

But a good driver wouldn't be that close to a truck, so she probably wasn't... well her fictional character in the fictional scenario wasn't.

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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by DrG »

enchantment25 wrote:
Argentum wrote:
flyboy10 wrote:
Argentum wrote:
flyboy10 wrote:I was surprised UK was so low. Is there anywhere lower than Iceland? I wonder if there are any stats for where people enjoy driving the most?
Sark? ;)
No, no sark, being genuine ;)

Is Sark one of the islands that completely prohibits cars?

Lol.

Yes it is, though who knows, they might have dozens of accidents involving bikes?
Not a bike but a horse...
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... anned.html
Goodness me, that story makes Sark sound really dangerous. I lived in Jersey in the Channel Islands for 2 years & spent time on all the islands & I found Sark to be quite amazing because it is so different without any motorised transport, so to speak. It's like living in another age. Personally I would find it boring to live there all year round cause I do love my cars :D

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moby
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by moby »

Alienturnedhuman wrote:
vikz22 wrote:
Black_Flag_11 wrote:
moby wrote: Have you seen the TV add for ( I thinkn it is) LV insurance? Are you a safe driver?

The girl driving the car whan the object falls off the truck in front of her just snatches the wheel and dives into the outside lane,,,, without even looking in her mirror.

Is that good driving, or would leaving a longer gap be better? It seems that even the people showing us what is good driving dont know the difference between good driving and good reactions
The advert was about keeping the no claim bonus, which she would have done with that incident.

But I thought the exact same thing, anything could have been in the lane to left of her, that certainly not an example of good driving. If anything that just gave the impression that keeping your no claims bonus is more down to luck in situations like that, rather than good driving.

Poor advert.

OMG i thought i was the only one! i thought what the hell she just swerved without looking!
To be fair, a good driver will be aware of what is around them and would know if they could swerve into that lane or not.

But a good driver wouldn't be that close to a truck, so she probably wasn't... well her fictional character in the fictional scenario wasn't.

The thing that fell of seemed to be inflatable anyway and far safer to hit it than swerve.

I did the same thing several years ago to avoid being squashed between two large vehicles. I did look first, but TBH it was in the lap of the gods if I made it or not. I may have stopped before hitting the vehicle in front of me, but I still recall with horror looking in my mirror and seeing the Volvo behind me (before I swapped lanes) slam into the back of the stationary car hard enough to spin them both across the road. I would have been a smudge by then

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runningman67
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by runningman67 »

Maybe in the UK we have really good pedestrians.

Angel De La Muerte
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Re: How safe are your roads?

Post by Angel De La Muerte »

Never had the experience of driving abroad but here in the UK I think what sets the bar is our main roads, look at the structures, the street furniture, even the posts that hold the signs up are slowly being replaced by more safer versions.

Having seen a far few accidents in my job, I think street lay out and furniture plays a bigger role than many think, have you even seen someone hit a traffic light? they bend like crazy but this absorbs the impact, railings are an exception, they can of course prevent traffic hitting pedestrians, but the design of them needs to be improved, the top part can come off, leaving sharp metal spikes, ready to penetrate the bottom of cars..

I really think the next big thing should be glow in the dark road markings, along with some sort of colour change when temp reaches below a certain amount..

Talking of road furniture, is there not a way to put fans at the exit of tunnels, nice draft there could be used to make a small amount of electricity?

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