Is bottas time up at Mercedes.

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Is Bottas Time Up At Mercedes.

Yes. End of the year. He is gone.
23
85%
Yes. He will go by mid season.
1
4%
No. He will hang on for another contract.
3
11%
 
Total votes: 27

Siao7
Posts: 9473
Joined: Tue May 05, 2009 11:31 am

Re: Is bottas time up at Mercedes.

Post by Siao7 »

Harpo wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 1:12 pm
DOLOMITE wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 8:50 am
Harpo wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 7:30 am
I may be wrong but don't all the contracts between Mercedes and their drivers end this year ? By drivers, I mean not only Hamilton and Bottas, but also Russell and Ocon.
You're not wrong. Hamilton, Bottas, Russel & Ocon. Plus Perez, Stroll, Gasly, Tsunoda, Raikkonen and Giovanazzi.

Very convenient for Mercedes, but at the same time quite the headache. Wolff has been pretty vocal about the importance of harmony within the team and avoiding a another Hamilton/Rosberg implosion.How much of a risk would that be if Russell was to step up. He's a very confident ambitious driver and will feel he;s done his apprenticeship at Williams as requested so surely if he was to make the move, it would be with the expectation (on his part at least) that he was there to win.
I'm not sure it's that convenient for Mercedes. It means that any driver they are contracted with can be signed by another team for next year, and Russell, for instance, can be signed by RBR while Mercedes is still wondering what should or will be their line-up for 2022.
I doubt that RB will go for Russell. They have their young champ material and Russell would not go to Max's team.

I also hope I am sincerely wrong on this, because it would be amazing

pokerman
Posts: 37571
Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:30 pm

Re: Is bottas time up at Mercedes.

Post by pokerman »

Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 10:20 pm
Exediron wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 7:15 pm
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 4:40 pm
(I'm 95% sure that'll be Russell, but if Ocon keeps starting and finishing ahead of Fernando, I do think he will start to get a little consideration).
I think if it's not Russell, they'll dynamite whatever feeble respect their young driver program gets at the moment. Compared to the Ferrari or particularly Red Bull YDAs, they have so far placed a grand total of... 0 drivers at their top team.

If they pass over Russell, who's doing everything that could be reasonably expected of him at the back of the field, for a driver from another team's program, I'd wonder at anyone signing with them in the future.
At least if it were Ocon, there is kind of an argument that Mercedes backed him and got him into F1 etc., and this was just the first realistic opportunity to actually graduate him to the team. It's not the most natural route for a team's young driver to take but at least they're not passing over Russell for someone they've had no investment in whatsoever.

FTR I'd be very, very surprised if Bottas' replacement isn't Russell, but who knows. Maybe Ocon wins a race or something, and Russell continues to fluff the few opportunities he gets at points in a Williams.
Ocon keeps getting a mention but I was hearing that Alpine have first dibs on him for next season.
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pokerman
Posts: 37571
Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:30 pm

Re: Is bottas time up at Mercedes.

Post by pokerman »

DOLOMITE wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 8:44 am
BMWSauber84 wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 12:05 pm
My understanding was that McLaren on the whole wanted Hamilton to stay, but there was a not insignificant minority that felt that Button and a strong number 2 would be a better bet for a title bid for 2013.
Well that's something I've never heard anywhere before.
No me neither, Ron obviously wanted him to stay even though he initially low balled him with money, build the team around Button had to be Whitmarsh.
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Harpo
Posts: 1120
Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2005 8:26 am

Re: Is bottas time up at Mercedes.

Post by Harpo »

Siao7 wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 1:37 pm
Harpo wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 1:12 pm
DOLOMITE wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 8:50 am
Harpo wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 7:30 am
I may be wrong but don't all the contracts between Mercedes and their drivers end this year ? By drivers, I mean not only Hamilton and Bottas, but also Russell and Ocon.
You're not wrong. Hamilton, Bottas, Russel & Ocon. Plus Perez, Stroll, Gasly, Tsunoda, Raikkonen and Giovanazzi.

Very convenient for Mercedes, but at the same time quite the headache. Wolff has been pretty vocal about the importance of harmony within the team and avoiding a another Hamilton/Rosberg implosion.How much of a risk would that be if Russell was to step up. He's a very confident ambitious driver and will feel he;s done his apprenticeship at Williams as requested so surely if he was to make the move, it would be with the expectation (on his part at least) that he was there to win.
I'm not sure it's that convenient for Mercedes. It means that any driver they are contracted with can be signed by another team for next year, and Russell, for instance, can be signed by RBR while Mercedes is still wondering what should or will be their line-up for 2022.
I doubt that RB will go for Russell. They have their young champ material and Russell would not go to Max's team.

I also hope I am sincerely wrong on this, because it would be amazing
I wrote Russell "for instance", but what I meant is that people at Mercedes have no more the priority on any of their current contracted drivers when it comes to 2022. Contrary to what Pokerman wrote at the end of the previous page, Russell and the 3 other "Mercedes" drivers don't have to ask Mercedes to be released if no offered a Mercedes seat, they already are at the end of the year if Mercedes don't offer them a new contract. As long as someone like me knows it, I suppose the other teams know it. They won't let Mercedes take a precedence that Mercedes no longer has if they ever want to sign one of these drivers.
As my brother said : "I've got the brain of a four year old. I'll bet he was glad to be rid of it".

Siao7
Posts: 9473
Joined: Tue May 05, 2009 11:31 am

Re: Is bottas time up at Mercedes.

Post by Siao7 »

Harpo wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 2:42 pm
Siao7 wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 1:37 pm
Harpo wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 1:12 pm
DOLOMITE wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 8:50 am
Harpo wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 7:30 am
I may be wrong but don't all the contracts between Mercedes and their drivers end this year ? By drivers, I mean not only Hamilton and Bottas, but also Russell and Ocon.
You're not wrong. Hamilton, Bottas, Russel & Ocon. Plus Perez, Stroll, Gasly, Tsunoda, Raikkonen and Giovanazzi.

Very convenient for Mercedes, but at the same time quite the headache. Wolff has been pretty vocal about the importance of harmony within the team and avoiding a another Hamilton/Rosberg implosion.How much of a risk would that be if Russell was to step up. He's a very confident ambitious driver and will feel he;s done his apprenticeship at Williams as requested so surely if he was to make the move, it would be with the expectation (on his part at least) that he was there to win.
I'm not sure it's that convenient for Mercedes. It means that any driver they are contracted with can be signed by another team for next year, and Russell, for instance, can be signed by RBR while Mercedes is still wondering what should or will be their line-up for 2022.
I doubt that RB will go for Russell. They have their young champ material and Russell would not go to Max's team.

I also hope I am sincerely wrong on this, because it would be amazing
I wrote Russell "for instance", but what I meant is that people at Mercedes have no more the priority on any of their current contracted drivers when it comes to 2022. Contrary to what Pokerman wrote at the end of the previous page, Russell and the 3 other "Mercedes" drivers don't have to ask Mercedes to be released if no offered a Mercedes seat, they already are at the end of the year if Mercedes don't offer them a new contract. As long as someone like me knows it, I suppose the other teams know it. They won't let Mercedes take a precedence that Mercedes no longer has if they ever want to sign one of these drivers.
I know mate, it was hypothetical obviously, no need to explain further.

Harpo
Posts: 1120
Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2005 8:26 am

Re: Is bottas time up at Mercedes.

Post by Harpo »

Siao7 wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 3:02 pm
Harpo wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 2:42 pm
Siao7 wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 1:37 pm
Harpo wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 1:12 pm
DOLOMITE wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 8:50 am


You're not wrong. Hamilton, Bottas, Russel & Ocon. Plus Perez, Stroll, Gasly, Tsunoda, Raikkonen and Giovanazzi.

Very convenient for Mercedes, but at the same time quite the headache. Wolff has been pretty vocal about the importance of harmony within the team and avoiding a another Hamilton/Rosberg implosion.How much of a risk would that be if Russell was to step up. He's a very confident ambitious driver and will feel he;s done his apprenticeship at Williams as requested so surely if he was to make the move, it would be with the expectation (on his part at least) that he was there to win.
I'm not sure it's that convenient for Mercedes. It means that any driver they are contracted with can be signed by another team for next year, and Russell, for instance, can be signed by RBR while Mercedes is still wondering what should or will be their line-up for 2022.
I doubt that RB will go for Russell. They have their young champ material and Russell would not go to Max's team.

I also hope I am sincerely wrong on this, because it would be amazing
I wrote Russell "for instance", but what I meant is that people at Mercedes have no more the priority on any of their current contracted drivers when it comes to 2022. Contrary to what Pokerman wrote at the end of the previous page, Russell and the 3 other "Mercedes" drivers don't have to ask Mercedes to be released if no offered a Mercedes seat, they already are at the end of the year if Mercedes don't offer them a new contract. As long as someone like me knows it, I suppose the other teams know it. They won't let Mercedes take a precedence that Mercedes no longer has if they ever want to sign one of these drivers.
I know mate, it was hypothetical obviously, no need to explain further.
I knew you knew... etc.
As my brother said : "I've got the brain of a four year old. I'll bet he was glad to be rid of it".

Siao7
Posts: 9473
Joined: Tue May 05, 2009 11:31 am

Re: Is bottas time up at Mercedes.

Post by Siao7 »

Harpo wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 3:07 pm
Siao7 wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 3:02 pm
Harpo wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 2:42 pm
Siao7 wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 1:37 pm
Harpo wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 1:12 pm

I'm not sure it's that convenient for Mercedes. It means that any driver they are contracted with can be signed by another team for next year, and Russell, for instance, can be signed by RBR while Mercedes is still wondering what should or will be their line-up for 2022.
I doubt that RB will go for Russell. They have their young champ material and Russell would not go to Max's team.

I also hope I am sincerely wrong on this, because it would be amazing
I wrote Russell "for instance", but what I meant is that people at Mercedes have no more the priority on any of their current contracted drivers when it comes to 2022. Contrary to what Pokerman wrote at the end of the previous page, Russell and the 3 other "Mercedes" drivers don't have to ask Mercedes to be released if no offered a Mercedes seat, they already are at the end of the year if Mercedes don't offer them a new contract. As long as someone like me knows it, I suppose the other teams know it. They won't let Mercedes take a precedence that Mercedes no longer has if they ever want to sign one of these drivers.
I know mate, it was hypothetical obviously, no need to explain further.
I knew you knew... etc.
:thumbup:

pokerman
Posts: 37571
Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:30 pm

Re: Is bottas time up at Mercedes.

Post by pokerman »

Harpo wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 2:42 pm
Siao7 wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 1:37 pm
Harpo wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 1:12 pm
DOLOMITE wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 8:50 am
Harpo wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 7:30 am
I may be wrong but don't all the contracts between Mercedes and their drivers end this year ? By drivers, I mean not only Hamilton and Bottas, but also Russell and Ocon.
You're not wrong. Hamilton, Bottas, Russel & Ocon. Plus Perez, Stroll, Gasly, Tsunoda, Raikkonen and Giovanazzi.

Very convenient for Mercedes, but at the same time quite the headache. Wolff has been pretty vocal about the importance of harmony within the team and avoiding a another Hamilton/Rosberg implosion.How much of a risk would that be if Russell was to step up. He's a very confident ambitious driver and will feel he;s done his apprenticeship at Williams as requested so surely if he was to make the move, it would be with the expectation (on his part at least) that he was there to win.
I'm not sure it's that convenient for Mercedes. It means that any driver they are contracted with can be signed by another team for next year, and Russell, for instance, can be signed by RBR while Mercedes is still wondering what should or will be their line-up for 2022.
I doubt that RB will go for Russell. They have their young champ material and Russell would not go to Max's team.

I also hope I am sincerely wrong on this, because it would be amazing
I wrote Russell "for instance", but what I meant is that people at Mercedes have no more the priority on any of their current contracted drivers when it comes to 2022. Contrary to what Pokerman wrote at the end of the previous page, Russell and the 3 other "Mercedes" drivers don't have to ask Mercedes to be released if no offered a Mercedes seat, they already are at the end of the year if Mercedes don't offer them a new contract. As long as someone like me knows it, I suppose the other teams know it. They won't let Mercedes take a precedence that Mercedes no longer has if they ever want to sign one of these drivers.
Russell is at the end of his Williams contract but not his Mercedes contract.
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DOLOMITE
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Re: Is bottas time up at Mercedes.

Post by DOLOMITE »

pokerman wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 3:48 pm
Harpo wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 2:42 pm
Siao7 wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 1:37 pm
Harpo wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 1:12 pm
DOLOMITE wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 8:50 am


You're not wrong. Hamilton, Bottas, Russel & Ocon. Plus Perez, Stroll, Gasly, Tsunoda, Raikkonen and Giovanazzi.

Very convenient for Mercedes, but at the same time quite the headache. Wolff has been pretty vocal about the importance of harmony within the team and avoiding a another Hamilton/Rosberg implosion.How much of a risk would that be if Russell was to step up. He's a very confident ambitious driver and will feel he;s done his apprenticeship at Williams as requested so surely if he was to make the move, it would be with the expectation (on his part at least) that he was there to win.
I'm not sure it's that convenient for Mercedes. It means that any driver they are contracted with can be signed by another team for next year, and Russell, for instance, can be signed by RBR while Mercedes is still wondering what should or will be their line-up for 2022.
I doubt that RB will go for Russell. They have their young champ material and Russell would not go to Max's team.

I also hope I am sincerely wrong on this, because it would be amazing
I wrote Russell "for instance", but what I meant is that people at Mercedes have no more the priority on any of their current contracted drivers when it comes to 2022. Contrary to what Pokerman wrote at the end of the previous page, Russell and the 3 other "Mercedes" drivers don't have to ask Mercedes to be released if no offered a Mercedes seat, they already are at the end of the year if Mercedes don't offer them a new contract. As long as someone like me knows it, I suppose the other teams know it. They won't let Mercedes take a precedence that Mercedes no longer has if they ever want to sign one of these drivers.
Russell is at the end of his Williams contract but not his Mercedes contract.
Are you sure? I could not find much on the web that was clear on this, but the two sites i found that made the distinction said his merc contract was also up.
"I'd rather lose a race going fast enough to win it, than win one going slow enough to lose it".
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A.J.
Posts: 1148
Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2005 11:37 am

Re: Is bottas time up at Mercedes.

Post by A.J. »

DOLOMITE wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 4:46 pm
pokerman wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 3:48 pm
Harpo wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 2:42 pm
Siao7 wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 1:37 pm
Harpo wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 1:12 pm

I'm not sure it's that convenient for Mercedes. It means that any driver they are contracted with can be signed by another team for next year, and Russell, for instance, can be signed by RBR while Mercedes is still wondering what should or will be their line-up for 2022.
I doubt that RB will go for Russell. They have their young champ material and Russell would not go to Max's team.

I also hope I am sincerely wrong on this, because it would be amazing
I wrote Russell "for instance", but what I meant is that people at Mercedes have no more the priority on any of their current contracted drivers when it comes to 2022. Contrary to what Pokerman wrote at the end of the previous page, Russell and the 3 other "Mercedes" drivers don't have to ask Mercedes to be released if no offered a Mercedes seat, they already are at the end of the year if Mercedes don't offer them a new contract. As long as someone like me knows it, I suppose the other teams know it. They won't let Mercedes take a precedence that Mercedes no longer has if they ever want to sign one of these drivers.
Russell is at the end of his Williams contract but not his Mercedes contract.
Are you sure? I could not find much on the web that was clear on this, but the two sites i found that made the distinction said his merc contract was also up.
From what I have read Russell has a 10 yr contract with Mercedes, from whenever he was inducted into their junior driver program (so from 2016), which means he's contracted to them until the end of 2025.

Jenson's Understeer
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Re: Is bottas time up at Mercedes.

Post by Jenson's Understeer »

pokerman wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 1:42 pm
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 10:20 pm
Exediron wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 7:15 pm
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 4:40 pm
(I'm 95% sure that'll be Russell, but if Ocon keeps starting and finishing ahead of Fernando, I do think he will start to get a little consideration).
I think if it's not Russell, they'll dynamite whatever feeble respect their young driver program gets at the moment. Compared to the Ferrari or particularly Red Bull YDAs, they have so far placed a grand total of... 0 drivers at their top team.

If they pass over Russell, who's doing everything that could be reasonably expected of him at the back of the field, for a driver from another team's program, I'd wonder at anyone signing with them in the future.
At least if it were Ocon, there is kind of an argument that Mercedes backed him and got him into F1 etc., and this was just the first realistic opportunity to actually graduate him to the team. It's not the most natural route for a team's young driver to take but at least they're not passing over Russell for someone they've had no investment in whatsoever.

FTR I'd be very, very surprised if Bottas' replacement isn't Russell, but who knows. Maybe Ocon wins a race or something, and Russell continues to fluff the few opportunities he gets at points in a Williams.
Ocon keeps getting a mention but I was hearing that Alpine have first dibs on him for next season.
Can't see that being any barrier to Merc getting him if they want him, though. Same would be true for every driver on the grid not named Max or Charles.
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WHoff78
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Re: Is bottas time up at Mercedes.

Post by WHoff78 »

Seems the most likely alternative, but who knows if Red Bull would actually be interested. Guess a lot of that will depend on Perez over the next half of the season. Still, doesn't seem like many other options.

Dazza1976
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Re: Is bottas time up at Mercedes.

Post by Dazza1976 »

Bottas needs to go, for his own sake as well as Mercedes. He’s actually doing an ok job some of the time, well over one lap he’s great, but mentally he’s broken. He will never ever match Hamilton over season, if anything he’s falling further behind over race distances.

I’m sure he could do a good job for midfield team somewhere. As for his replacement seems straight up choice between Ocon or Russell. I’d like to see Russell in the seat but they could go Ocon, in which case Russell should leave their programme.

For the sake of F1 they need someone to push Lewis, say that as huge Hamilton fan, he’s been amazing. When he is pushed he shows how great he truly is. We see snippets here and there, wet weather races, pole positions against the odds, great passing moves, beating Ferrari when they had the better car etc. Now we need to see another intra team rivalry, the other teams just can’t beat Mercedes as a whole (lewis included in that, he’ll have much more input into the direction of car design than his detractors will admit), Verstappen and red bull are the only ones remotely close.

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tootsie323
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Re: Is bottas time up at Mercedes.

Post by tootsie323 »

Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 8:55 pm
pokerman wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 1:42 pm
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 10:20 pm
Exediron wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 7:15 pm
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 4:40 pm
(I'm 95% sure that'll be Russell, but if Ocon keeps starting and finishing ahead of Fernando, I do think he will start to get a little consideration).
I think if it's not Russell, they'll dynamite whatever feeble respect their young driver program gets at the moment. Compared to the Ferrari or particularly Red Bull YDAs, they have so far placed a grand total of... 0 drivers at their top team.

If they pass over Russell, who's doing everything that could be reasonably expected of him at the back of the field, for a driver from another team's program, I'd wonder at anyone signing with them in the future.
At least if it were Ocon, there is kind of an argument that Mercedes backed him and got him into F1 etc., and this was just the first realistic opportunity to actually graduate him to the team. It's not the most natural route for a team's young driver to take but at least they're not passing over Russell for someone they've had no investment in whatsoever.

FTR I'd be very, very surprised if Bottas' replacement isn't Russell, but who knows. Maybe Ocon wins a race or something, and Russell continues to fluff the few opportunities he gets at points in a Williams.
Ocon keeps getting a mention but I was hearing that Alpine have first dibs on him for next season.
Can't see that being any barrier to Merc getting him if they want him, though. Same would be true for every driver on the grid not named Max or Charles.
If Alpine nail the new regs, and Ocon continues to have the upper hand over Alonso, would he want to move? He could well be the de facto team leader in a car that is genuinely capable of challenging for titles. This is a big if, but worth considering.
Where I'm going, I don't need roads

karas
Posts: 4
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Re: Is bottas time up at Mercedes.

Post by karas »

He seemed to be effected by fans reactions toward him. He should find a drive somewhere else and reinvent himself. Let someone else try that merc second seat see if they can do any better.
Last edited by karas on Thu May 13, 2021 9:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

pokerman
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Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:30 pm

Re: Is bottas time up at Mercedes.

Post by pokerman »

Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 8:55 pm
pokerman wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 1:42 pm
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 10:20 pm
Exediron wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 7:15 pm
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 4:40 pm
(I'm 95% sure that'll be Russell, but if Ocon keeps starting and finishing ahead of Fernando, I do think he will start to get a little consideration).
I think if it's not Russell, they'll dynamite whatever feeble respect their young driver program gets at the moment. Compared to the Ferrari or particularly Red Bull YDAs, they have so far placed a grand total of... 0 drivers at their top team.

If they pass over Russell, who's doing everything that could be reasonably expected of him at the back of the field, for a driver from another team's program, I'd wonder at anyone signing with them in the future.
At least if it were Ocon, there is kind of an argument that Mercedes backed him and got him into F1 etc., and this was just the first realistic opportunity to actually graduate him to the team. It's not the most natural route for a team's young driver to take but at least they're not passing over Russell for someone they've had no investment in whatsoever.

FTR I'd be very, very surprised if Bottas' replacement isn't Russell, but who knows. Maybe Ocon wins a race or something, and Russell continues to fluff the few opportunities he gets at points in a Williams.
Ocon keeps getting a mention but I was hearing that Alpine have first dibs on him for next season.
Can't see that being any barrier to Merc getting him if they want him, though. Same would be true for every driver on the grid not named Max or Charles.
Well I would be comparing with Russell who will be completely free for next season.
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Jenson's Understeer
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Re: Is bottas time up at Mercedes.

Post by Jenson's Understeer »

tootsie323 wrote:
Thu May 13, 2021 6:44 am
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 8:55 pm
pokerman wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 1:42 pm
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 10:20 pm
Exediron wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 7:15 pm


I think if it's not Russell, they'll dynamite whatever feeble respect their young driver program gets at the moment. Compared to the Ferrari or particularly Red Bull YDAs, they have so far placed a grand total of... 0 drivers at their top team.

If they pass over Russell, who's doing everything that could be reasonably expected of him at the back of the field, for a driver from another team's program, I'd wonder at anyone signing with them in the future.
At least if it were Ocon, there is kind of an argument that Mercedes backed him and got him into F1 etc., and this was just the first realistic opportunity to actually graduate him to the team. It's not the most natural route for a team's young driver to take but at least they're not passing over Russell for someone they've had no investment in whatsoever.

FTR I'd be very, very surprised if Bottas' replacement isn't Russell, but who knows. Maybe Ocon wins a race or something, and Russell continues to fluff the few opportunities he gets at points in a Williams.
Ocon keeps getting a mention but I was hearing that Alpine have first dibs on him for next season.
Can't see that being any barrier to Merc getting him if they want him, though. Same would be true for every driver on the grid not named Max or Charles.
If Alpine nail the new regs, and Ocon continues to have the upper hand over Alonso, would he want to move? He could well be the de facto team leader in a car that is genuinely capable of challenging for titles. This is a big if, but worth considering.
He wouldn't know that until after the opportunity with Merc has passed, though. But you're right, if the stars align and Alpine are in the title fight next year then based on current form, he'd have the upper hand on his teammate. Of course, in a more competitive car and with a season back in F1 under his belt, maybe that tips things back Fernando's way?
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Jenson's Understeer
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Re: Is bottas time up at Mercedes.

Post by Jenson's Understeer »

pokerman wrote:
Thu May 13, 2021 1:24 pm
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 8:55 pm
pokerman wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 1:42 pm
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 10:20 pm
Exediron wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 7:15 pm


I think if it's not Russell, they'll dynamite whatever feeble respect their young driver program gets at the moment. Compared to the Ferrari or particularly Red Bull YDAs, they have so far placed a grand total of... 0 drivers at their top team.

If they pass over Russell, who's doing everything that could be reasonably expected of him at the back of the field, for a driver from another team's program, I'd wonder at anyone signing with them in the future.
At least if it were Ocon, there is kind of an argument that Mercedes backed him and got him into F1 etc., and this was just the first realistic opportunity to actually graduate him to the team. It's not the most natural route for a team's young driver to take but at least they're not passing over Russell for someone they've had no investment in whatsoever.

FTR I'd be very, very surprised if Bottas' replacement isn't Russell, but who knows. Maybe Ocon wins a race or something, and Russell continues to fluff the few opportunities he gets at points in a Williams.
Ocon keeps getting a mention but I was hearing that Alpine have first dibs on him for next season.
Can't see that being any barrier to Merc getting him if they want him, though. Same would be true for every driver on the grid not named Max or Charles.
Well I would be comparing with Russell who will be completely free for next season.
George definitely makes the most sense, I just don't see contracts being a barrier if Merc decided they want someone else. Especially if you're correct and George is still contracted to them until the end of '25 as, ironically, that means they could offer him as a potential replacement.
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tootsie323
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Re: Is bottas time up at Mercedes.

Post by tootsie323 »

Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Fri May 14, 2021 8:48 am
tootsie323 wrote:
Thu May 13, 2021 6:44 am
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 8:55 pm
pokerman wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 1:42 pm
Jenson's Understeer wrote:
Tue May 11, 2021 10:20 pm


At least if it were Ocon, there is kind of an argument that Mercedes backed him and got him into F1 etc., and this was just the first realistic opportunity to actually graduate him to the team. It's not the most natural route for a team's young driver to take but at least they're not passing over Russell for someone they've had no investment in whatsoever.

FTR I'd be very, very surprised if Bottas' replacement isn't Russell, but who knows. Maybe Ocon wins a race or something, and Russell continues to fluff the few opportunities he gets at points in a Williams.
Ocon keeps getting a mention but I was hearing that Alpine have first dibs on him for next season.
Can't see that being any barrier to Merc getting him if they want him, though. Same would be true for every driver on the grid not named Max or Charles.
If Alpine nail the new regs, and Ocon continues to have the upper hand over Alonso, would he want to move? He could well be the de facto team leader in a car that is genuinely capable of challenging for titles. This is a big if, but worth considering.
He wouldn't know that until after the opportunity with Merc has passed, though. But you're right, if the stars align and Alpine are in the title fight next year then based on current form, he'd have the upper hand on his teammate. Of course, in a more competitive car and with a season back in F1 under his belt, maybe that tips things back Fernando's way?
I actually hope so - in much the same way that I was desperate to see Michael Schumacher II win, or podium in the Merc (having, admittedly, not been a big fan of MS I - it took the II version for me to appreciate what he did in his previous stint!).
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yodasarmpit
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Re: Is bottas time up at Mercedes.

Post by yodasarmpit »

Mercedes need to be thinking about succession planning, Bottas - whilst a solid and on his day fast driver - is not a team leader, just not at that level. I really think they need to get George in now, along with Lewis, and think about the next 6 years or so.

TheGiantHogweed
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Re: Is bottas time up at Mercedes.

Post by TheGiantHogweed »

yodasarmpit wrote:
Fri May 14, 2021 10:19 am
Mercedes need to be thinking about succession planning, Bottas - whilst a solid and on his day fast driver - is not a team leader, just not at that level. I really think they need to get George in now, along with Lewis, and think about the next 6 years or so.
I think Mercedes would rather focus on winning this year rather than thinking about the following years. Disrupting the current teams line up could effect the rest of this year quite badly like it too often has with red bull. This isn't related to the driver line up, but just to think that Verstappen could very likely be leading the driver standings if it wasn't for Bottas getting knocked out in Imola by Russell and saving Hamilton. Funnily enough you could even potentially go as far as saying it is down to Russell that Hamilton is still leading, but for the wrong reasons. There would be nothing wrong with Mercedes going for Russell next year, but they should keep both teams as they are for the rest of this season.

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yodasarmpit
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Re: Is bottas time up at Mercedes.

Post by yodasarmpit »

Mercedes need to be thinking about succession planning, Bottas - whilst a solid and on his day fast driver - is not a team leader, just not at that level. I really think they need to get George in now, along with Lewis, and think about the next 6 years or so.

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