To all Americans...

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Asphalt_World
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To all Americans...

Post by Asphalt_World »

May I just say that as a non American, I don't hold Donald Trump as a typical representation of your countries people.
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by Blake »

Thank God!

Trump is an embarrassment in so many ways. It dumbfounds me how so many can see him as "presidential" material... Seriously, I doubt that many do, but are merely humored by his antics. The Democrats would, I suspect, be dancing in the aisles were Trump to get the GOP nomination.
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by minchy »

I'd like to agree with Asphalt, bit the fact that the republican party seem to think that he is a viable candidate for presidency makes me worry a bit. It almost feels like a joke that he has a genuine chance of being in the White House, thank whatever god you want that the president doesn't actually have that much power.
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by Blake »

Minchy,

I sincerely hope that I am wrong, but I don't think that there is any chance that Trump could end up in the white house even if he does get the GOP nomination. He has managed to insult women, hispanics, immigrants, and on and on and on. In addition, he has declared bankruptcy at least twice screwing banks and creditors in the process, yet brags about his sense of business. Nor did interview where he said he had it rough to get started as good old Dad only loaned him a million dollars to get his start in business.... like the middle and lower class American voter can relate to "poor" Donald.

As I said, if he were to get the nomination, I would be money that he will not reside in the white house.

If I am wrong, retirement in Mexico is back on the plate!!! Eiyi, yi, yi... Aqui vengo, Guadalajara. Wait, the would expect me to help Mexico to build the walls he wants on the border and for them to pay for. (however, if we were to eliminate our demand for illegal drugs, the dealers/smugglers wouldn't be there!)
:nod:
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by Saz »

100% with Asphalt here. I would like to think most people would not see him as a representation of America and all its people. How can he be if he insults a good proportion of your population for a start?

From an outsider, it does seem very odd that some (emphasis on some) people seem to take his words seriously. Maybe he does mean them, but its like watching a caricature of a high class man from the 1950's. I just listen to his speeches in wonder that someone could actually think the way he appears to in 2015 in what is a pretty liberal country overall. It would be funny if it wasn't so tragic. Out of curiosity, is he as much of a joke in America as he is in Europe? I know here in the UK everyone I speak to about Trump just laugh about how ridiculous he and his policy's are. That or they compare him to Hilter (which is a bit of a stretch, not sure he's evil, just a moron)
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by minchy »

After Saz said that he's a hike in Europe, I did see this which made me laugh
http://www.buzzfeed.com/alanwhite/trump ... .ctW4pvAPp
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by DaveStebbins »

There is a very small minority of very vocal bigots and idiots who support him. Mainstream republican party members appear mostly embarrassed by him at this point. There are some who like his willingness to ignore political correctness and speak his mind, and others like that he is not a career politician. The problem is that none of the other republican candidates are very popular or have much to distinguish them, so Trump keeps making headlines and is ahead in the republican polls mostly because he is the only name many people recognize. I expect things to change as we get closer to actual voting.

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Re: To all Americans...

Post by Saz »

And now there is a petition to ban Trump from entering the UK under our unacceptable behaviours or extremism exclusion policy. The petition has reached 200,000 signatures in less than 24 hours, which means this will now have to be debated within the UK parliament. This would put him alongside the Wesbro Baptist Church and the Ku Klux Klan if they do decide to ban him.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-35052505

I think a large part of this is the comments about police being afraid to go into parts of London because of 'Radicalisation'. I find this whole thing pretty funny, wonder how that would be reported in the US if the UK did decide to ban him from coming to this country.
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by minchy »

Saz wrote:And now there is a petition to ban Trump from entering the UK under our unacceptable behaviours or extremism exclusion policy. The petition has reached 200,000 signatures in less than 24 hours, which means this will now have to be debated within the UK parliament. This would put him alongside the Wesbro Baptist Church and the Ku Klux Klan if they do decide to ban him.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-35052505

I think a large part of this is the comments about police being afraid to go into parts of London because of 'Radicalisation'. I find this whole thing pretty funny, wonder how that would be reported in the US if the UK did decide to ban him from coming to this country.

Maybe he'll call for his Mexican wall to be extended right around the gulf, Florida and up to Maine to keep us out of his country too! I don't think there's much that's too far fetched when it comes to Trump's policies ;-)
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by Prema »

I have to admit, to me as a non-American, it is greatly entertaining to follow this entire circus of presidential candidates campaign, and of course the Republican one stealing all the show (actually, the other side is boring).
Trump, I believe that the man simply can't make a distinction between those reality TV series that he owns and that to be sold to the wide TV audience, and the real world. He must have lost it somewhere, somehow.

I do believe that his apparent popularity is still just due to that, the reality show: it is his campaign, his money, his show, and he can make any fool out of himself as he pleases according to what he believes would please the audience. But when it comes to the real, I doubt greatly that the real people would go making him a real president of them (never mind their probable dissatisfaction with the current political establishment).

But say, it happens. There would be no more of his own reality show to run, and the guy perhaps would not even be aware of that.. A cynic in me, almost wishes to see that real reality show.. :twisted:

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Re: To all Americans...

Post by SnakeSVT2003 »

Asphalt_World wrote:May I just say that as a non American, I don't hold Donald Trump as a typical representation of your countries people.


Thanks. :D

The best part about having such a long election period these days is that it gives the hopelessly slow American voters time to see how much of a psycho Trump is. That said, it took Republicans 7 years to finally see Sarah Palin for the clueless moron that she is, so maybe one year is asking too much.
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by Black_Flag_11 »

Whenever I stumble upon a forum/comment section of Trump supporters I watch this to make me feel better.


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Re: To all Americans...

Post by Biffa »

I think most people realised that Trump is an idiot, a curiosity at best.

It boggles my mind why we (AkA the media) are still talking about him? – still I suppose every country has a rich jester that manages to pay their way into the media (and ‘apparent’ popularity).

But it’s a real worry – especially in a country like the USA – that genuinely competent and intelligent people are being so easily side-lined by a buffoon. Sort it out people or America!! Give that dumb arse-hole his marching orders!!!

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Re: To all Americans...

Post by RaggedMan »

Biffa wrote:I think most people realised that Trump is an idiot, a curiosity at best.

It boggles my mind why we (AkA the media) are still talking about him? – still I suppose every country has a rich jester that manages to pay their way into the media (and ‘apparent’ popularity).

But it’s a real worry – especially in a country like the USA – that genuinely competent and intelligent people are being so easily side-lined by a buffoon. Sort it out people or America!! Give that dumb arse-hole his marching orders!!!

I think at first the novelty of it all was somewhat entertaining to a lot of people, but the farther it goes the scarier it gets.

I have faith that my fellow countrymen will come through when the votes are cast rather than just what they say to a web or phone survey. But damn it's looking shaky right now.
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by Asphalt_World »

I'm hearing rumours that Trump had called Katie Hopkins a respected British journalist! Surely that's not true
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by Schumaker, Seven »

Blake wrote:Minchy,

I sincerely hope that I am wrong, but I don't think that there is any chance that Trump could end up in the white house even if he does get the GOP nomination. He has managed to insult women, hispanics, immigrants, and on and on and on. In addition, he has declared bankruptcy at least twice screwing banks and creditors in the process, yet brags about his sense of business. Nor did interview where he said he had it rough to get started as good old Dad only loaned him a million dollars to get his start in business.... like the middle and lower class American voter can relate to "poor" Donald.

As I said, if he were to get the nomination, I would be money that he will not reside in the white house.

If I am wrong, retirement in Mexico is back on the plate!!! Eiyi, yi, yi... Aqui vengo, Guadalajara. Wait, the would expect me to help Mexico to build the walls he wants on the border and for them to pay for. (however, if we were to eliminate our demand for illegal drugs, the dealers/smugglers wouldn't be there!)
:nod:

Alot of it is that he says what a large chunk of people let slip into their minds but know enough not to expel such garbage from their mouths.
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by Option or Prime »

The only way to make Trump listen is to hit him right where it hurts, on the golf course !

http://money.cnn.com/2015/12/10/news/scotland-trump-golf-course/

I worry for the USA sometimes, the terrorist shooting that took place in San Bernardino was one of over 350 in the last year that would have happened anyway ! It took a while to work out if it was terrorism in the first place.

I would ask though having stated his position if there were to be a larger attack in America he could gain serious support, the thought of him wielding power worries me greatly, it's all very well saying it will never happen but it could. Or am I misunderstanding the selection process?

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Re: To all Americans...

Post by huggybear »

I do wonder how much of his public profile is actually him, and how much is him trying to pander to the extreme right wing in order to get votes. Politicians will say pretty much anything if they think it will get them elected, and Trump's brand of ridiculousness is very cleverly targeted at immigration, refugees and terrorism, which are all politically relevant topics of debate at the moment. Ben Carson is saying things that are just as crazy, but random. Ben's claiming that the Holocaust wouldn't have happened if Jews had guns, and that transgender people should have separate bathrooms because 'normal' people are weirded out by them.
If he is playing the political game, Trump could pull a masterstroke if he gradually starts to lean more central and more GOP voters take him seriously. The other candidates have tried to play it middle of the road, so when push comes to shove, they are going to have to chance it by appealing to a more extreme voter base, while he wont.

Outside of the presidental race, it's a tad concerning that white supremacists are piggybacking on his comments to try and further their agendas, which I suspect won't end when his campaign does.

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Re: To all Americans...

Post by moby »

What does bother me, and not just in this case but anywhere one of the options is a non option, is that there are less other options.

If for example, the choice was an idiot or a warmonger?

There has to be an element of having to chose what is considered the lesser bad option.

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Re: To all Americans...

Post by minchy »

Asphalt_World wrote:I'm hearing rumours that Trump had called Katie Hopkins a respected British journalist! Surely that's not true

I've just had a quick look through their tweets, and yes it's true!
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by Prema »

moby wrote:What does bother me, and not just in this case but anywhere one of the options is a non option, is that there are less other options.

If for example, the choice was an idiot or a warmonger?

There has to be an element of having to chose what is considered the lesser bad option.


What bothers me, those folks that are apparently rallying behind Trump, they are really hankering after a Putin. But luckily for everybody, there is but this reality-TV clown Donald Dump to fill the shoes. For the time being...

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Re: To all Americans...

Post by moby »

Prema wrote:
moby wrote:What does bother me, and not just in this case but anywhere one of the options is a non option, is that there are less other options.

If for example, the choice was an idiot or a warmonger?

There has to be an element of having to chose what is considered the lesser bad option.


What bothers me, those folks that are apparently rallying behind Trump, they are really hankering after a Putin. But luckily for everybody, there is but this reality-TV clown Donald Dump to fill the shoes. For the time being...


Just think though. If his minders had trained him to not blirt out and stick to the script he is given, he could still be a consideration, just no one would know the real him

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Re: To all Americans...

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moby wrote:What does bother me, and not just in this case but anywhere one of the options is a non option, is that there are less other options.

If for example, the choice was an idiot or a warmonger?

There has to be an element of having to chose what is considered the lesser bad option.

A direct consequence of only having two political parties I assume. I've always found it strange; how can you categorize the American people in two political groups?
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by Prema »

moby wrote:
Prema wrote:
moby wrote:What does bother me, and not just in this case but anywhere one of the options is a non option, is that there are less other options.

If for example, the choice was an idiot or a warmonger?

There has to be an element of having to chose what is considered the lesser bad option.


What bothers me, those folks that are apparently rallying behind Trump, they are really hankering after a Putin. But luckily for everybody, there is but this reality-TV clown Donald Dump to fill the shoes. For the time being...


Just think though. If his minders had trained him to not blirt out and stick to the script he is given, he could still be a consideration, just no one would know the real him


Well, that's what makes him that what he is: he can't be coached. And those who would actually attempt to such, they would quickly be the receivers of his "You're fired!" And the people around him that are on his payroll, are not that stupid. That's a pit-hole of people like Trump: they keep close only those people that tell them what they want to hear, not what they need to hear.

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Re: To all Americans...

Post by Prema »

Covalent wrote:
moby wrote:What does bother me, and not just in this case but anywhere one of the options is a non option, is that there are less other options.

If for example, the choice was an idiot or a warmonger?

There has to be an element of having to chose what is considered the lesser bad option.

A direct consequence of only having two political parties I assume. I've always found it strange; how can you categorize the American people in two political groups?


And yet, those two parties aren't that much different either. In the essence, they both serve the same goal: being but instrumental to the maintenance of the current economical system. The differences are like the choosing of what color of decoration on the cake you want this time.. ah, we have had red these last two times, let's make a change to a blue!

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Re: To all Americans...

Post by Covalent »

Prema wrote:
Covalent wrote:
moby wrote:What does bother me, and not just in this case but anywhere one of the options is a non option, is that there are less other options.

If for example, the choice was an idiot or a warmonger?

There has to be an element of having to chose what is considered the lesser bad option.

A direct consequence of only having two political parties I assume. I've always found it strange; how can you categorize the American people in two political groups?


And yet, those two parties aren't that much different either. In the essence, they both serve the same goal: being but instrumental to the maintenance of the current economical system. The differences are like the choosing of what color of decoration on the cake you want this time.. ah, we have had red these last two times, let's make a change to a blue!

That too :thumbup:
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Re: To all Americans...

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What I can't understand is that Trump can say what he has been saying, without the party distancing itself from him, or distancing him from it. If the GOP (I had to look up what that is supposed to mean) allows such people to stand for election under its banner, then perhaps that means as much about the Republican party, as it does about Trump. But possibly also about the United States. And that I find seriously worrying.
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Re: To all Americans...

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Many in the Republican (self titled GOP [Grand Ole Party]) have been trying to distance themselves from trump, and he recently accused the party hierarchy of shenanigans to do that as well. Just last week, there was an article indicating that both trump and another candidate, Carson, have floated the idea that they may go on their own, not as republicans.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/09/politics/donald-trump-republican-party-warning/

There are many such articles out there on it right now, some claiming that the negotiated "peace" between the GOP and Trump that called for him to stay in the party in exchange for them not attacking him has obviously been negated by the attacks of his fellow republicans (how could they not given the controversial comments he makes)... thereby making trump "free" to leave.

As I said earlier, the Democrats must be absolutely loving this!!!

BTW, there are other political parties in the US (Libertarian, Green, etc), but they simply do not have the following to make an impact at this point.
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by Balibari »

minchy wrote:I'd like to agree with Asphalt, bit the fact that the republican party seem to think that he is a viable candidate for presidency makes me worry a bit. It almost feels like a joke that he has a genuine chance of being in the White House, thank whatever god you want that the president doesn't actually have that much power.

I get the feeling it's a case of them preferring Trump to be on the inside 'urinating' out than on the outside 'urinating' in. Ironically I think Lyndon Johnson coined that phrase, though without the anti-swearing substitutions.

Even the far right of the right wing party of a fairly right wing country seems to be struggling with some of his latest gems. He may well win the nomination but does anyone actually see him getting elected? I've always been fascinated by US politics but it's sometimes hard to get a read on public feeling from here in the UK.
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by Fiki »

Blake wrote:Many in the Republican (self titled GOP [Grand Ole Party]) have been trying to distance themselves from trump, and he recently accused the party hierarchy of shenanigans to do that as well. Just last week, there was an article indicating that both trump and another candidate, Carson, have floated the idea that they may go on their own, not as republicans.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/09/politics/donald-trump-republican-party-warning/

There are many such articles out there on it right now, some claiming that the negotiated "peace" between the GOP and Trump that called for him to stay in the party in exchange for them not attacking him has obviously been negated by the attacks of his fellow republicans (how could they not given the controversial comments he makes)... thereby making trump "free" to leave.

As I said earlier, the Democrats must be absolutely loving this!!!

BTW, there are other political parties in the US (Libertarian, Green, etc), but they simply do not have the following to make an impact at this point.
Thanks Blake. I'm a little bit less worried now. But just a little bit, mind you.
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by RaggedMan »

Fiki wrote:
Blake wrote:Many in the Republican (self titled GOP [Grand Ole Party]) have been trying to distance themselves from trump, and he recently accused the party hierarchy of shenanigans to do that as well. Just last week, there was an article indicating that both trump and another candidate, Carson, have floated the idea that they may go on their own, not as republicans.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/09/politics/donald-trump-republican-party-warning/

There are many such articles out there on it right now, some claiming that the negotiated "peace" between the GOP and Trump that called for him to stay in the party in exchange for them not attacking him has obviously been negated by the attacks of his fellow republicans (how could they not given the controversial comments he makes)... thereby making trump "free" to leave.

As I said earlier, the Democrats must be absolutely loving this!!!

BTW, there are other political parties in the US (Libertarian, Green, etc), but they simply do not have the following to make an impact at this point.
Thanks Blake. I'm a little bit less worried now. But just a little bit, mind you.

Part of the problem with mounting a campaign as an Independent or third party candidate, outside very local races, is the way campaign finance laws are set up.

It's very easy for the 2 established parties to move funds around to different candidates in various districts, and then there are all of the Political Action Committees (PAC's) that can put money where it's needed to fend off upstart candidates. And there's also the odd bit where the more money you raise for yourself the more money the FEC (Federal Election Commission) gives you in matching funds.

The thing that's bothered me over the last several years is that I've been registered as an independent since I first registered to vote in 1982 since I don't buy into either of the 2 main parties platforms fully. (even though I do tend to vote Democrat) But then the whole Tea Party movement kind of took over that realm and if I tell someone now, who doesn't know me otherwise, that I'm a registered independent they will automatically assume I'm a far right nut job.

Edit: That was all very simplified of course. I just mentioned a couple of things that really irk me about the current campaign finance laws.
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by Blake »

RaggedMan wrote:The thing that's bothered me over the last several years is that I've been registered as an independent since I first registered to vote in 1982 since I don't buy into either of the 2 main parties platforms fully. (even though I do tend to vote Democrat) But then the whole Tea Party movement kind of took over that realm and if I tell someone now, who doesn't know me otherwise, that I'm a registered independent they will automatically assume I'm a far right nut job.

Edit: That was all very simplified of course. I just mentioned a couple of things that really irk me about the current campaign finance laws.


Interestingly, I registered as an independent myself about 30 years ago when I became disillusioned with the direction of the Democratic party. They still were closer to my view on things than the Republicans who, even then, seemed to be to top 10% oriented and not enough concern about the people. Ironically, when I say that I am an independent, the assumption is the exact opposite than your reaction, as I am assumed to be a far LEFT nut job. Of course, living in one of the most Republican of all states (Nebraska), anyone right-center to the left is "far left" (including independents) and of little value to mankind.
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by minchy »

Blake wrote:
RaggedMan wrote:The thing that's bothered me over the last several years is that I've been registered as an independent since I first registered to vote in 1982 since I don't buy into either of the 2 main parties platforms fully. (even though I do tend to vote Democrat) But then the whole Tea Party movement kind of took over that realm and if I tell someone now, who doesn't know me otherwise, that I'm a registered independent they will automatically assume I'm a far right nut job.

Edit: That was all very simplified of course. I just mentioned a couple of things that really irk me about the current campaign finance laws.


Interestingly, I registered as an independent myself about 30 years ago when I became disillusioned with the direction of the Democratic party. They still were closer to my view on things than the Republicans who, even then, seemed to be to top 10% oriented and not enough concern about the people. Ironically, when I say that I am an independent, the assumption is the exact opposite than your reaction, as I am assumed to be a far LEFT nut job. Of course, living in one of the most Republican of all states (Nebraska), anyone right-center to the left is "far left" (including independents) and of little value to mankind.
;)

As a side note from a foreigner here, if someone told me they were independent, I would assume they were more liberal/left than the main parties.
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by Blake »

to me it just means that neither party really meets my vision of what this country should be doing. Interestingly, it is the Independents that are usually the deciding factor in the elections as the Repubs and the Dems tend to vote party loyal and that about evens out. Both parties find themselfs trying desperately to woo the Independent and undecided vote... usually with campaign rhetoric that tries to make us believe that they are centrist... then once elected they go about their normal pattern... ie party line.
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by RaggedMan »

Blake wrote:to me it just means that neither party really meets my vision of what this country should be doing. Interestingly, it is the Independents that are usually the deciding factor in the elections as the Repubs and the Dems tend to vote party loyal and that about evens out. Both parties find themselfs trying desperately to woo the Independent and undecided vote... usually with campaign rhetoric that tries to make us believe that they are centrist... then once elected they go about their normal pattern... ie party line.
:?

That's what it meant to me at the time I registered as such. It seems to just confuse the hell out of people these days.

Lately most folks I've encountered lately seem to associate it with either Tea Party or Libertarian. However I'm quite centrist, but leaning left especially on social issues.
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Prema
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by Prema »

Does one in the US has to register oneself as this or that party's supporter in order to vote for this or that candidate?

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Blake
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by Blake »

Hi, Prema,

No... one has to register in order to vote, but if you don't select a party, then you are independent (not a party). As an independent you cannot, however, vote in the primary elections where the parties select their candidates. In the general (final) one can vote for any candidate, regardless of party affiliation or independent status
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by Saz »

Another question for the ignorant Brit here Blake if you don't mind:

Are there equivalents in the USA to the local elections here?

In the UK, every few years there is a local election for a particular area (called a constituency) that is either a whole or part of a county. This election decides who represents that constituency in the Parliament. So for example, there might be a local election for East Cambridgeshire (my constituency) and whichever individual wins the election, has a seat as the East Cambridgeshire representative regardless of the 'official' leading party. So as a hypothetical, say a Labour representative got elected, he would sit in the parliament, even if the ruling part was still Tory.
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RaggedMan
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by RaggedMan »

Blake wrote:Hi, Prema,

No... one has to register in order to vote, but if you don't select a party, then you are independent (not a party). As an independent you cannot, however, vote in the primary elections where the parties select their candidates. In the general (final) one can vote for any candidate, regardless of party affiliation or independent status
:)

Some states do have open primaries where everyone votes for which ever candidate they want regardless of party, although they are few, sadly Maryland isn't one of them.

Then there are the states like Iowa that use a caucus system where each district selects members to vote in their stead to give votes to a candidate for the party. It can all be a bit confusing.
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RaggedMan
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Re: To all Americans...

Post by RaggedMan »

Saz wrote:Another question for the ignorant Brit here Blake if you don't mind:

Are there equivalents in the USA to the local elections here?

In the UK, every few years there is a local election for a particular area (called a constituency) that is either a whole or part of a county. This election decides who represents that constituency in the Parliament. So for example, there might be a local election for East Cambridgeshire (my constituency) and whichever individual wins the election, has a seat as the East Cambridgeshire representative regardless of the 'official' leading party. So as a hypothetical, say a Labour representative got elected, he would sit in the parliament, even if the ruling part was still Tory.

I'm not Blake, obviously, but another American.

Congress has 2 houses just like Parliament. The House of Representatives (The House) and the Senate.

Elections for The House is much like you describe for the House of Commons, and each state has a different number of representatives depending on the population of the state. More people, more representatives. While in the Senate each state regardless of size or population gets 2 representatives each.

Elections for both houses are by popular vote within their individual districts, or in the case of Senators they are elected by statewide popular vote. Representatives in the House are elected to 4 year terms and Senators 6 years.

The system is set up so that neither chamber will have 100% turn over in a given election cycle, which is why you'll sometimes hear about mid-term elections. These are elections held in between Presidential elections and can see up to 50% change in a given chamber swaying the majority in for or against the sitting presidents party.

Edit: To actually answer your question. :blush:
The person elected in their district serves regardless of which party currently has the majority in congress.
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