Re: 2021 Spanish Grand Prix Free Practice & Qualifying Thread
Posted: Sat May 08, 2021 2:09 pm
It's a true qualifying battle this year. Bleeding heck!
Here we go... Bottas is a very good qualifier, nothing special in the race though.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:14 pmI doubt the Red Bull is as good as the Merc.... I think the fans and pundits getting a little excited now that Merc has finally some competition..i don't think Bottas is only a tenth off Verstappen
He was 8th. I think it may be related to him messing up his car a little when he went off earlier on.
Based on what? What special things did Bottas do in qualifying before merc? remind me again of any standout performancesF1Tyrant wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:16 pmHere we go... Bottas is a very good qualifier, nothing special in the race though.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:14 pmI doubt the Red Bull is as good as the Merc.... I think the fans and pundits getting a little excited now that Merc has finally some competition..i don't think Bottas is only a tenth off Verstappen
It seems he cant handle being in a big team, doing same things he was doing at Mclaren back then.
I do think Hamilton makes Bottas look worse at qualifying to many. I bet there will be floods of comments (rightly so) pointing out Hamilton's 100 poles. But then they need to remember that Bottas is against this driver. If he managed to beat him around a third of every season in qualifying which usually is the case, it has to be said that Bottas is at least a very good qualifier.F1Tyrant wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:16 pmHere we go... Bottas is a very good qualifier, nothing special in the race though.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:14 pmI doubt the Red Bull is as good as the Merc.... I think the fans and pundits getting a little excited now that Merc has finally some competition..i don't think Bottas is only a tenth off Verstappen
Canada 2013, qualifying 3rd, is one.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:17 pmBased on what? What special things did Bottas do in qualifying before merc? remind me again of any standout performancesF1Tyrant wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:16 pmHere we go... Bottas is a very good qualifier, nothing special in the race though.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:14 pmI doubt the Red Bull is as good as the Merc.... I think the fans and pundits getting a little excited now that Merc has finally some competition..i don't think Bottas is only a tenth off Verstappen
Lol ok... I don't ever remember Bottas being rated as a qualifying specialist a la Russel/Leclerc... He maybe a solid qualifier but never was special... Certainly not anywhere near the speed of Verstappen who has consistently blown away his teammatesAzi wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:21 pmCanada 2013, qualifying 3rd, is one.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:17 pmBased on what? What special things did Bottas do in qualifying before merc? remind me again of any standout performancesF1Tyrant wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:16 pmHere we go... Bottas is a very good qualifier, nothing special in the race though.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:14 pmI doubt the Red Bull is as good as the Merc.... I think the fans and pundits getting a little excited now that Merc has finally some competition..i don't think Bottas is only a tenth off Verstappen
Unnecessary derogatory comments about Bottas, removed by moderation teamTheGiantHogweed wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:20 pmI do think Hamilton makes Bottas look worse at qualifying to many. I bet there will be floods of comments (rightly so) pointing out Hamilton's 100 poles. But then they need to remember that Bottas is against this driver. If he managed to beat him around a third of every season in qualifying which usually is the case, it has to be said that Bottas is at least a very good qualifier.F1Tyrant wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:16 pmHere we go... Bottas is a very good qualifier, nothing special in the race though.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:14 pmI doubt the Red Bull is as good as the Merc.... I think the fans and pundits getting a little excited now that Merc has finally some competition..i don't think Bottas is only a tenth off Verstappen
He might be overrated but your reasoning is ridiculous.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:20 pmOr maybe he is just overrated? Any driver that takes 200 races to win a race is not that good... Period
Bottas put his Williams in the top 4 grid slots 20 times in 4 years. That's excellent given Williams wasn't that great from 2015-.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:17 pmBased on what? What special things did Bottas do in qualifying before merc? remind me again of any standout performances
Ok, let me ask it in a different way..Which top driver have you seen in your lifetime that took 200 races to win a race? Have you heard in F1 the best drivers make it to the best cars... what does it tell you about Perez?JN23 wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:29 pmHe might be overrated but your reasoning is ridiculous.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:20 pmOr maybe he is just overrated? Any driver that takes 200 races to win a race is not that good... Period
Which races in his 200 should he have won before Sakhir last year?
So you're telling me Bottas was viewed as a qualifying specialist before he joined Merc? Simple yes/no answer..F1Tyrant wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:31 pmBottas put his Williams in the top 4 grid slots 20 times in 4 years. That's excellent given Williams wasn't that great from 2015-.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:17 pmBased on what? What special things did Bottas do in qualifying before merc? remind me again of any standout performances
As for standout performances:
- Canada 2013 - Bottas qualified P3 in a terrible Williams as a rookie. Ahead of Rosberg and Webber.
- Russia 2016 - Bottas qualified P2 ahead of Hamilton.
He didn’t make it to the best car because he isn’t as good as the leading drivers of his generation, but is still imo a very good driver.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:31 pmOk, let me ask it in a different way..Which top driver have you seen in your lifetime that took 200 races to win a race? Have you heard in F1 the best drivers make it to the best cars... what does it tell you about Perez?JN23 wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:29 pmHe might be overrated but your reasoning is ridiculous.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:20 pmOr maybe he is just overrated? Any driver that takes 200 races to win a race is not that good... Period
Which races in his 200 should he have won before Sakhir last year?
F1 grid is unfortunately littered with "very good drivers"JN23 wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:34 pmHe didn’t make it to the best car because he isn’t as good as the leading drivers of his generation, but is still imo a very good driver.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:31 pmOk, let me ask it in a different way..Which top driver have you seen in your lifetime that took 200 races to win a race? Have you heard in F1 the best drivers make it to the best cars... what does it tell you about Perez?JN23 wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:29 pmHe might be overrated but your reasoning is ridiculous.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:20 pmOr maybe he is just overrated? Any driver that takes 200 races to win a race is not that good... Period
Which races in his 200 should he have won before Sakhir last year?
He was unfortunate that his move to a top team last time coincided with the start of McLaren’s downturn.
Anyway, are you going to answer my question?
So you can’t back up your point that any driver who takes 200 races to win a race isn’t good enough? Unsurprising.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:36 pmF1 grid is unfortunately littered with "very good drivers"JN23 wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:34 pmHe didn’t make it to the best car because he isn’t as good as the leading drivers of his generation, but is still imo a very good driver.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:31 pmOk, let me ask it in a different way..Which top driver have you seen in your lifetime that took 200 races to win a race? Have you heard in F1 the best drivers make it to the best cars... what does it tell you about Perez?JN23 wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:29 pmHe might be overrated but your reasoning is ridiculous.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:20 pm
Or maybe he is just overrated? Any driver that takes 200 races to win a race is not that good... Period
Which races in his 200 should he have won before Sakhir last year?
He was unfortunate that his move to a top team last time coincided with the start of McLaren’s downturn.
Anyway, are you going to answer my question?
I'm not going through 200 races of a an average driver to see where he could have won... You can either look at the historical data or pretend like Perez was an anomaly..i prefer the more reasonable explanation..Simply not good enough
JN23 wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:29 pmHe might be overrated but your reasoning is ridiculous.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:20 pmOr maybe he is just overrated? Any driver that takes 200 races to win a race is not that good... Period
Which races in his 200 should he have won before Sakhir last year?
You heard correct.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:28 pmDid i just hear Tsunoda insinuating that his car may not be the same as Gasly!?... Oh boy...this guy has some nerves
Lol, what's your definition of "good enough".. Yes i think he is good enough to be in F1... No i don't think he is good enough to be a consistent race winner or WDC challenger..JN23 wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:39 pmSo you can’t back up your point that any driver who takes 200 races to win a race isn’t good enough? Unsurprising.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:36 pmF1 grid is unfortunately littered with "very good drivers"JN23 wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:34 pmHe didn’t make it to the best car because he isn’t as good as the leading drivers of his generation, but is still imo a very good driver.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:31 pmOk, let me ask it in a different way..Which top driver have you seen in your lifetime that took 200 races to win a race? Have you heard in F1 the best drivers make it to the best cars... what does it tell you about Perez?
He was unfortunate that his move to a top team last time coincided with the start of McLaren’s downturn.
Anyway, are you going to answer my question?
I'm not going through 200 races of a an average driver to see where he could have won... You can either look at the historical data or pretend like Perez was an anomaly..i prefer the more reasonable explanation..Simply not good enough
He’s just below that top level and imo that’s a pretty high level.
Exactly... Malaysia 2012 too. They were brilliant performances rather than delivering the expected result.kleefton wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:40 pmJN23 wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:29 pmHe might be overrated but your reasoning is ridiculous.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:20 pmOr maybe he is just overrated? Any driver that takes 200 races to win a race is not that good... Period
Which races in his 200 should he have won before Sakhir last year?
He sort of challenged for the win at Monza 2012 after doing brilliant tire managing and catching the eventual race winner Hamilton in the later stages but besides that he never had the car to win until this year. Perez is a good driver.
He's just suffering from the famed RB#2 curse.kleefton wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:40 pmJN23 wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:29 pmHe might be overrated but your reasoning is ridiculous.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:20 pmOr maybe he is just overrated? Any driver that takes 200 races to win a race is not that good... Period
Which races in his 200 should he have won before Sakhir last year?
He sort of challenged for the win at Monza 2012 after doing brilliant tire managing and catching the eventual race winner Hamilton in the later stages but besides that he never had the car to win until this year. Perez is a good driver.
And who was his teammate again during that time? Oh i see his teammate was shoved out of F1...JN23 wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:42 pmExactly... Malaysia 2012 too. They were brilliant performances rather than delivering the expected result.kleefton wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:40 pmJN23 wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:29 pmHe might be overrated but your reasoning is ridiculous.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:20 pmOr maybe he is just overrated? Any driver that takes 200 races to win a race is not that good... Period
Which races in his 200 should he have won before Sakhir last year?
He sort of challenged for the win at Monza 2012 after doing brilliant tire managing and catching the eventual race winner Hamilton in the later stages but besides that he never had the car to win until this year. Perez is a good driver.
Olivier Panis won a race too, that too in Monaco..JN23 wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:42 pmExactly... Malaysia 2012 too. They were brilliant performances rather than delivering the expected result.kleefton wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:40 pmJN23 wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:29 pmHe might be overrated but your reasoning is ridiculous.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:20 pmOr maybe he is just overrated? Any driver that takes 200 races to win a race is not that good... Period
Which races in his 200 should he have won before Sakhir last year?
He sort of challenged for the win at Monza 2012 after doing brilliant tire managing and catching the eventual race winner Hamilton in the later stages but besides that he never had the car to win until this year. Perez is a good driver.
Button vs Perez has been done a lot on this forum, especially in the last year. Perez didn’t look average vs Button.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:44 pmAnd who was his teammate again during that time? Oh i see his teammate was shoved out of F1...JN23 wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:42 pmExactly... Malaysia 2012 too. They were brilliant performances rather than delivering the expected result.kleefton wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:40 pmJN23 wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:29 pmHe might be overrated but your reasoning is ridiculous.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:20 pm
Or maybe he is just overrated? Any driver that takes 200 races to win a race is not that good... Period
Which races in his 200 should he have won before Sakhir last year?
He sort of challenged for the win at Monza 2012 after doing brilliant tire managing and catching the eventual race winner Hamilton in the later stages but besides that he never had the car to win until this year. Perez is a good driver.
Looked very average against a decent teammate like Button and now again Verstappen...
I'm not going to hide that I like Bottas, and will openly admit that I sometimes defend him too much (similar with most drivers that people support)schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:26 pmUnnecessary derogatory comments about Bottas, removed by moderation teamTheGiantHogweed wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:20 pmI do think Hamilton makes Bottas look worse at qualifying to many. I bet there will be floods of comments (rightly so) pointing out Hamilton's 100 poles. But then they need to remember that Bottas is against this driver. If he managed to beat him around a third of every season in qualifying which usually is the case, it has to be said that Bottas is at least a very good qualifier.F1Tyrant wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:16 pmHere we go... Bottas is a very good qualifier, nothing special in the race though.schumilegend wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 2:14 pmI doubt the Red Bull is as good as the Merc.... I think the fans and pundits getting a little excited now that Merc has finally some competition..i don't think Bottas is only a tenth off Verstappen