How will Russell perform against Bottas?

Forum rules
Please read the forum rules

How will Russell perform against Bottas?

Poll ended at Sat Dec 05, 2020 12:41 pm

Russell ahead in qualifying and the race
8
17%
Russell ahead in qualifying, Bottas ahead in the race
2
4%
Bottas ahead in qualifying, Russell ahead in the race
4
8%
Bottas ahead in qualifying and the race
16
33%
Very close in qualifying, Russell ahead in the race
5
10%
Very close in qualifying, Bottas ahead in the race
13
27%
 
Total votes: 48

pokerman
Posts: 36337
Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:30 pm

Re: How will Russell perform against Bottas?

Post by pokerman »

Schermerhorn wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 4:47 pm
Schumacher forever#1 wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 4:23 pm
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 4:16 pm
Schumacher forever#1 wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 4:10 pm
Schermerhorn wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 3:35 pm


Exactly.

I wonder if Lewis zen-like mentality would be disrupted if there was a Max Verstappen next to him?
I don't think so, but I think Bottas's definitely would. Maybe Bottas is not used to driving in the midfield, but he gets gobbled up like a pack of sardines when in a midfield battle.

F1 has so much talent in the midfield right now, that any performance advantage Mercedes lose would really show some true colours.
I think Bottas is not used to racing in the midfield at the moment indeed and it sometimes can show. But at williams, he was good at it. I think the car is not good at overtakeing and hamilton's performance possible suggests it is easier to make a recovery than it actually is. mercedes often say that as the car is set up to be leading the race (clearly very proud of that!), they don't expect to be so far back when the unexpected happens. Bottas admittedly struggles here a lot more than he does when he's 2nd or leading. But I don't think bottas has got worse than he used to be, and he did used to be strong in midfield battles. So I think it is another thing that Hamilton deserves credit for.
That is very true, and Bottas was renowned for his composure for keeping drivers behind him at Williams (Though he was driving the good Williams cars lol). And yeah the Mercedes can be pretty awful in traffic.

I also wonder, and it would be interesting to have a statistical report on it, how much confidence is sucked out of a driver when they're competing with such a strong teammate. Look what happened to Massa (Raikkonen and Vandoorne to some extent as well) over his tenure with Alonso, and Albon and Gasly with Verstappen. It'd be interesting to see some graphics explaining whether having a very competitive teammate improves one's ability (Rosberg could be an example here), or damages their confidence so much that they become worse off.
I'd love to have a discussion of this on here if possible.

The mental aspect of sports, to me anyway, is more interesting than the sport itself.

Where does mental strength come from?

Can a person self-motivate?

Can a person switch on and develop a new personality?

Why are some capable of digging themselves out of a hole while others cannot?

For me, Fernando Alonso is the most mentally strong driver I have seen in the last 20 years. Even in 2007 with all the toxic atmosphere he managed to create he still behaved like an elite elite elite driver while many others would have faltered. That to me suggests he drives purely for himself and uses others as an instrument towards his own goals. Maybe his life of poverty created that inner beast within him? Some things never leave you....

Mike Tyson said it best lately on his podcast "....I cannot perform to the best of my abilities if there is no chance of me being humiliated..."

I thought that was pretty powerful.
Alonso is a mentally strong driver but in 2007 his head clearly exploded, metaphorically speaking.
Lewis Hamilton #44

World Drivers Titles: 7 (1st)
Grand Prix Wins: 95 (1st)
Pole Positions: 98 (1st)
Podiums: 165 (1st)


PF1 Pick 10 Competition
2014: Champion

kleefton
Posts: 4034
Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2012 11:14 pm

Re: How will Russell perform against Bottas?

Post by kleefton »

TheGiantHogweed wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 3:56 pm
Rockie wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 3:37 pm
Alienturnedhuman wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 3:20 pm
Johnson wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 3:02 pm
It wouldn’t completely offset, they would have to pay Bottas his 2021 wages (maybe more for break of contract) and then pay Williams to break George’s contract. Williams demanded $12 million to break Bottas’ contact back in 2017 and Mercedes paid it. I imagine George would be that amount or more.

So to get George in the car next year is probably $12 million to Bottas, $12 million to Williams and $5 million to George (wages). George is going to be approx $17 million more than keeping Bottas. I just don’t see it happening for 2021 when they can get him for free in 2022
Right, especially as Bottas isn’t under performing. Bottas is second in the championship, and Mercedes easily got the WDC and WCC. They’ve literally maximised their result. If he was doing an Albon then there would be a reason to pay big bucks to fast track George.
Bottas is actually doing an Albon just the dominance of the Mercedes has masked it, hence why if he gets swallowed on the first lap he never recovers.
I think very few will think Bottas is performing as bad as albon. Most of Bottas's very negative results have been down to very bad luck. Albon is terrible in qualifying and the gap between him and Verstappen is also usually a lot bigger in races than Hamilton and Bottas. It should also be an indication that Albon has never outraced Verstappen on merit. Don't really know how anyone can come to the conclusion that Bottas is performing as badly as Albon.

Like everyone else it seems you have forgotten that Albon was matching Kvyat as a rookie. The same Kvyat who could occasionally outqualify and outrace Daniel Ricciardo. The same Ricciardo whom the much higher rated Esteban Ocon has yet to outqualify in dry conditions. It doesn't take a genius to see that Albon is better than what he is currently showing at Redbull. He was actually better when he first arrived at the team, then progressively his performances have gone from average to terrible. But imho his current performances at RB are not a reflection of his true driving ability. Albon has become everyone's favourite whipping boy, including you, the one who usually defends all the struggling drivers, for whatever reason.

JN23
Posts: 2865
Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2016 11:14 am

Re: How will Russell perform against Bottas?

Post by JN23 »

kleefton wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 8:58 pm
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 3:56 pm
Rockie wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 3:37 pm
Alienturnedhuman wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 3:20 pm
Johnson wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 3:02 pm
It wouldn’t completely offset, they would have to pay Bottas his 2021 wages (maybe more for break of contract) and then pay Williams to break George’s contract. Williams demanded $12 million to break Bottas’ contact back in 2017 and Mercedes paid it. I imagine George would be that amount or more.

So to get George in the car next year is probably $12 million to Bottas, $12 million to Williams and $5 million to George (wages). George is going to be approx $17 million more than keeping Bottas. I just don’t see it happening for 2021 when they can get him for free in 2022
Right, especially as Bottas isn’t under performing. Bottas is second in the championship, and Mercedes easily got the WDC and WCC. They’ve literally maximised their result. If he was doing an Albon then there would be a reason to pay big bucks to fast track George.
Bottas is actually doing an Albon just the dominance of the Mercedes has masked it, hence why if he gets swallowed on the first lap he never recovers.
I think very few will think Bottas is performing as bad as albon. Most of Bottas's very negative results have been down to very bad luck. Albon is terrible in qualifying and the gap between him and Verstappen is also usually a lot bigger in races than Hamilton and Bottas. It should also be an indication that Albon has never outraced Verstappen on merit. Don't really know how anyone can come to the conclusion that Bottas is performing as badly as Albon.

Like everyone else it seems you have forgotten that Albon was matching Kvyat as a rookie. The same Kvyat who could occasionally outqualify and outrace Daniel Ricciardo. The same Ricciardo whom the much higher rated Esteban Ocon has yet to outqualify. It doesn't take a genius to see that Albon is better than what he is currently showing at Redbull. He was actually better when he first arrived at the team, then progressively his performances have gone from average to terrible. But imho his current performances at RB are not a reflection of his true driving ability. Albon has become everyone's favourite whipping boy, including you, the one who usually defends all the struggling drivers, for whatever reason.
Yeah I agree with you on this kleefton :thumbup: It's partly why I'd like to see Albon given another go at Alpha Tauri but that isn't going to happen now, and Gasly would have been a good yardstick for him. He might get a chance back at AT in 2022.

User avatar
Schermerhorn
Posts: 257
Joined: Mon Aug 10, 2020 3:02 pm

Re: How will Russell perform against Bottas?

Post by Schermerhorn »

kleefton wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 8:58 pm
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 3:56 pm
Rockie wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 3:37 pm
Alienturnedhuman wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 3:20 pm
Johnson wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 3:02 pm
It wouldn’t completely offset, they would have to pay Bottas his 2021 wages (maybe more for break of contract) and then pay Williams to break George’s contract. Williams demanded $12 million to break Bottas’ contact back in 2017 and Mercedes paid it. I imagine George would be that amount or more.

So to get George in the car next year is probably $12 million to Bottas, $12 million to Williams and $5 million to George (wages). George is going to be approx $17 million more than keeping Bottas. I just don’t see it happening for 2021 when they can get him for free in 2022
Right, especially as Bottas isn’t under performing. Bottas is second in the championship, and Mercedes easily got the WDC and WCC. They’ve literally maximised their result. If he was doing an Albon then there would be a reason to pay big bucks to fast track George.
Bottas is actually doing an Albon just the dominance of the Mercedes has masked it, hence why if he gets swallowed on the first lap he never recovers.
I think very few will think Bottas is performing as bad as albon. Most of Bottas's very negative results have been down to very bad luck. Albon is terrible in qualifying and the gap between him and Verstappen is also usually a lot bigger in races than Hamilton and Bottas. It should also be an indication that Albon has never outraced Verstappen on merit. Don't really know how anyone can come to the conclusion that Bottas is performing as badly as Albon.

Like everyone else it seems you have forgotten that Albon was matching Kvyat as a rookie. The same Kvyat who could occasionally outqualify and outrace Daniel Ricciardo. The same Ricciardo whom the much higher rated Esteban Ocon has yet to outqualify in dry conditions. It doesn't take a genius to see that Albon is better than what he is currently showing at Redbull. He was actually better when he first arrived at the team, then progressively his performances have gone from average to terrible. But imho his current performances at RB are not a reflection of his true driving ability. Albon has become everyone's favourite whipping boy, including you, the one who usually defends all the struggling drivers, for whatever reason.
F1 is such a tough and mental sport.

If your confidence and support system falls apart and you become "persona non grata" you can easily sink into irreversible decline.

I agree with you.

In 2015, Kvyat looked stellar and the match of Ricciardo. Then in 2016 he was outed of Red Bull and has been mentally buried since.

Kvyat is now seen as washed up whereas Ricciardo is seen as elite.
You’re not in a fight until there’s pressure. Resistance. Overcoming something. Otherwise, it’s just an exhibition.

User avatar
Schermerhorn
Posts: 257
Joined: Mon Aug 10, 2020 3:02 pm

Re: How will Russell perform against Bottas?

Post by Schermerhorn »

pokerman wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 8:09 pm
Schermerhorn wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 4:47 pm
Schumacher forever#1 wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 4:23 pm
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 4:16 pm
Schumacher forever#1 wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 4:10 pm


I don't think so, but I think Bottas's definitely would. Maybe Bottas is not used to driving in the midfield, but he gets gobbled up like a pack of sardines when in a midfield battle.

F1 has so much talent in the midfield right now, that any performance advantage Mercedes lose would really show some true colours.
I think Bottas is not used to racing in the midfield at the moment indeed and it sometimes can show. But at williams, he was good at it. I think the car is not good at overtakeing and hamilton's performance possible suggests it is easier to make a recovery than it actually is. mercedes often say that as the car is set up to be leading the race (clearly very proud of that!), they don't expect to be so far back when the unexpected happens. Bottas admittedly struggles here a lot more than he does when he's 2nd or leading. But I don't think bottas has got worse than he used to be, and he did used to be strong in midfield battles. So I think it is another thing that Hamilton deserves credit for.
That is very true, and Bottas was renowned for his composure for keeping drivers behind him at Williams (Though he was driving the good Williams cars lol). And yeah the Mercedes can be pretty awful in traffic.

I also wonder, and it would be interesting to have a statistical report on it, how much confidence is sucked out of a driver when they're competing with such a strong teammate. Look what happened to Massa (Raikkonen and Vandoorne to some extent as well) over his tenure with Alonso, and Albon and Gasly with Verstappen. It'd be interesting to see some graphics explaining whether having a very competitive teammate improves one's ability (Rosberg could be an example here), or damages their confidence so much that they become worse off.
I'd love to have a discussion of this on here if possible.

The mental aspect of sports, to me anyway, is more interesting than the sport itself.

Where does mental strength come from?

Can a person self-motivate?

Can a person switch on and develop a new personality?

Why are some capable of digging themselves out of a hole while others cannot?

For me, Fernando Alonso is the most mentally strong driver I have seen in the last 20 years. Even in 2007 with all the toxic atmosphere he managed to create he still behaved like an elite elite elite driver while many others would have faltered. That to me suggests he drives purely for himself and uses others as an instrument towards his own goals. Maybe his life of poverty created that inner beast within him? Some things never leave you....

Mike Tyson said it best lately on his podcast "....I cannot perform to the best of my abilities if there is no chance of me being humiliated..."

I thought that was pretty powerful.
Alonso is a mentally strong driver but in 2007 his head clearly exploded, metaphorically speaking.

I think he became a much better driver as a result of it.
You’re not in a fight until there’s pressure. Resistance. Overcoming something. Otherwise, it’s just an exhibition.

User avatar
Alienturnedhuman
Posts: 4031
Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2003 9:39 pm

Re: How will Russell perform against Bottas?

Post by Alienturnedhuman »


TheGiantHogweed
Posts: 3109
Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2014 10:15 am

Re: How will Russell perform against Bottas?

Post by TheGiantHogweed »

JN23 wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 9:02 pm
kleefton wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 8:58 pm
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 3:56 pm
Rockie wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 3:37 pm
Alienturnedhuman wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 3:20 pm


Right, especially as Bottas isn’t under performing. Bottas is second in the championship, and Mercedes easily got the WDC and WCC. They’ve literally maximised their result. If he was doing an Albon then there would be a reason to pay big bucks to fast track George.
Bottas is actually doing an Albon just the dominance of the Mercedes has masked it, hence why if he gets swallowed on the first lap he never recovers.
I think very few will think Bottas is performing as bad as albon. Most of Bottas's very negative results have been down to very bad luck. Albon is terrible in qualifying and the gap between him and Verstappen is also usually a lot bigger in races than Hamilton and Bottas. It should also be an indication that Albon has never outraced Verstappen on merit. Don't really know how anyone can come to the conclusion that Bottas is performing as badly as Albon.

Like everyone else it seems you have forgotten that Albon was matching Kvyat as a rookie. The same Kvyat who could occasionally outqualify and outrace Daniel Ricciardo. The same Ricciardo whom the much higher rated Esteban Ocon has yet to outqualify. It doesn't take a genius to see that Albon is better than what he is currently showing at Redbull. He was actually better when he first arrived at the team, then progressively his performances have gone from average to terrible. But imho his current performances at RB are not a reflection of his true driving ability. Albon has become everyone's favourite whipping boy, including you, the one who usually defends all the struggling drivers, for whatever reason.
Yeah I agree with you on this kleefton :thumbup: It's partly why I'd like to see Albon given another go at Alpha Tauri but that isn't going to happen now, and Gasly would have been a good yardstick for him. He might get a chance back at AT in 2022.
Well in that case, Bottas got far more praise at williams and probably was considered better by many back then.

I still don't know how albon can be considered better than Bottas at the moment though.

Schumacher forever#1
Posts: 3089
Joined: Sun Oct 28, 2012 7:29 pm

Re: How will Russell perform against Bottas?

Post by Schumacher forever#1 »

Alienturnedhuman wrote:
Tue Dec 08, 2020 4:37 am
Interestingly, Alonso and Ocon both follow George Russell, but only Ocon follows Bottas.

Russell -> Team Principle at Renault and Bottas -> Mercedes junior driver???
"Always believe you will become the best, but never believe you have done so"

JN23
Posts: 2865
Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2016 11:14 am

Re: How will Russell perform against Bottas?

Post by JN23 »

TheGiantHogweed wrote:
Tue Dec 08, 2020 7:35 am
JN23 wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 9:02 pm
kleefton wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 8:58 pm
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 3:56 pm
Rockie wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 3:37 pm


Bottas is actually doing an Albon just the dominance of the Mercedes has masked it, hence why if he gets swallowed on the first lap he never recovers.
I think very few will think Bottas is performing as bad as albon. Most of Bottas's very negative results have been down to very bad luck. Albon is terrible in qualifying and the gap between him and Verstappen is also usually a lot bigger in races than Hamilton and Bottas. It should also be an indication that Albon has never outraced Verstappen on merit. Don't really know how anyone can come to the conclusion that Bottas is performing as badly as Albon.

Like everyone else it seems you have forgotten that Albon was matching Kvyat as a rookie. The same Kvyat who could occasionally outqualify and outrace Daniel Ricciardo. The same Ricciardo whom the much higher rated Esteban Ocon has yet to outqualify. It doesn't take a genius to see that Albon is better than what he is currently showing at Redbull. He was actually better when he first arrived at the team, then progressively his performances have gone from average to terrible. But imho his current performances at RB are not a reflection of his true driving ability. Albon has become everyone's favourite whipping boy, including you, the one who usually defends all the struggling drivers, for whatever reason.
Yeah I agree with you on this kleefton :thumbup: It's partly why I'd like to see Albon given another go at Alpha Tauri but that isn't going to happen now, and Gasly would have been a good yardstick for him. He might get a chance back at AT in 2022.
Well in that case, Bottas got far more praise at williams and probably was considered better by many back then.

I still don't know how albon can be considered better than Bottas at the moment though.
I can’t speak for kleefton, but nothing I’ve said suggests I think Albon is better than Bottas because I don’t think that. Just that I think Albon is currently being made to look worse than he actually is and for that reason I’d like to see him have another chance.

stevey
Posts: 1616
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2012 8:31 am

Re: How will Russell perform against Bottas?

Post by stevey »

If you look at Bottas latest statement on F1 it really seems like going up against Lewis for the last few years has completely destroyed him mentally. I'm not surprised by his poor performance this race, since the WDC went he just seems like there's no fight left in him at this stage. He needs a full mental reset. I can't remember which athlete said but think it was from tennis that they personally immediately move on and do not dwell on a poor result. Whether it be a tournament, match, or a single point. If its a poor one they mentally say to themselves to forget it entirely as it has no outcome on what comes next. I understand this may be hard to do unless practiced but I feel Lewis does it now, Max as well. I think its a mentality that needs to be adopted by Valteri

BMWSauber84
Posts: 837
Joined: Sat Oct 14, 2017 1:19 pm

Re: How will Russell perform against Bottas?

Post by BMWSauber84 »

An overlooked aspect of this is the fact that Russell isn't an ideal fit for that Merc chassis as it is, and can't apply full brake pressure. Yas Marina is has some far more technical sections than outer layout at Sakhir and that would surely make it difficult for George to be competitive.

The fact he was able to do what he did last race is still a minor miracle, but you couldn't choose a better circuit to have those limitations on. George wouldn't make any excuses, he'd have adapted as well as possible and he wouldn't embarrass himself. But there is every chance he'd have been three tenths or more off Bottas here due to circumstances out of his control. This outcome keeps his stock high. Especially if Bottas can pull out a win over Hamilton.

KingVoid
Posts: 3004
Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2015 7:54 am

Re: How will Russell perform against Bottas?

Post by KingVoid »

What Russell did to Bottas in Sakhir 2020 proves nothing about Hamilton's career from 2007-2018, but what it does show is that his 2019 and 2020 titles probably weren't that difficult to win. If your closest competitor is Bottas, winning a title is fairly easy for any elite driver.

Would Russell have won the 2019 and 2020 titles if he drove the Mercedes instead of Hamilton? I think he would have. He wouldn't have won the races where Hamilton made the difference (Mexico 2019 and Turkey 2020 come to mind), but he'd still have more than enough in reserve to win the title.

For that reason alone, Verstappen was my driver of the season in 2019. What he did in 2019 (beating Vettel and Leclerc with an inferior car) was actually difficult, significantly more difficult than only having to beat Bottas in the same car.

User avatar
Exediron
Posts: 8481
Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2014 3:53 am
Location: Michigan, USA
Contact:

Re: How will Russell perform against Bottas?

Post by Exediron »

KingVoid wrote:
Fri Dec 11, 2020 4:49 am
For that reason alone, Verstappen was my driver of the season in 2019. What he did in 2019 (beating Vettel and Leclerc with an inferior car) was actually difficult, significantly more difficult than only having to beat Bottas in the same car.
I'd say Max is a fair shout for driver of the season in 2019, but Leclerc and Vettel beat themselves in large part. If they'd driven even decently all season long, Max would have been nowhere near - that Ferrari was simply too quick. It was only multiple driver-error DNFs (for Leclerc) and spins (for Vettel) that put Max in striking range.
PICK 10 COMPETITION (6 wins, 18 podiums): 3rd in 2016
TOP THREE CHAMPIONSHIP (No Limit Excedrin Racing): Champions in 2015 & 2018 | 2nd in 2017 & 2019
AUTOSPORT GP PREDICTOR: 2017 USA & P-F1 Champion

KingVoid
Posts: 3004
Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2015 7:54 am

Re: How will Russell perform against Bottas?

Post by KingVoid »

Exediron wrote:
Fri Dec 11, 2020 7:35 am
KingVoid wrote:
Fri Dec 11, 2020 4:49 am
For that reason alone, Verstappen was my driver of the season in 2019. What he did in 2019 (beating Vettel and Leclerc with an inferior car) was actually difficult, significantly more difficult than only having to beat Bottas in the same car.
I'd say Max is a fair shout for driver of the season in 2019, but Leclerc and Vettel beat themselves in large part. If they'd driven even decently all season long, Max would have been nowhere near - that Ferrari was simply too quick. It was only multiple driver-error DNFs (for Leclerc) and spins (for Vettel) that put Max in striking range.
You could discredit Hamilton’s 2018 season with the exact same logic.

“Hamilton didn’t beat Vettel, Vettel beat himself with all those mistakes”

At the end of the day, through a combination of brilliant driving and consistency, Verstappen beat both Ferrari drivers in 2019 with a clearly inferior car.

pokerman
Posts: 36337
Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:30 pm

Re: How will Russell perform against Bottas?

Post by pokerman »

stevey wrote:
Thu Dec 10, 2020 5:39 pm
If you look at Bottas latest statement on F1 it really seems like going up against Lewis for the last few years has completely destroyed him mentally. I'm not surprised by his poor performance this race, since the WDC went he just seems like there's no fight left in him at this stage. He needs a full mental reset. I can't remember which athlete said but think it was from tennis that they personally immediately move on and do not dwell on a poor result. Whether it be a tournament, match, or a single point. If its a poor one they mentally say to themselves to forget it entirely as it has no outcome on what comes next. I understand this may be hard to do unless practiced but I feel Lewis does it now, Max as well. I think its a mentality that needs to be adopted by Valteri
I think the only driver that really was able to stand up to Hamilton mentally was Jenson Button, he wasn't phased by Alonso either.
Lewis Hamilton #44

World Drivers Titles: 7 (1st)
Grand Prix Wins: 95 (1st)
Pole Positions: 98 (1st)
Podiums: 165 (1st)


PF1 Pick 10 Competition
2014: Champion

pokerman
Posts: 36337
Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:30 pm

Re: How will Russell perform against Bottas?

Post by pokerman »

Exediron wrote:
Fri Dec 11, 2020 7:35 am
KingVoid wrote:
Fri Dec 11, 2020 4:49 am
For that reason alone, Verstappen was my driver of the season in 2019. What he did in 2019 (beating Vettel and Leclerc with an inferior car) was actually difficult, significantly more difficult than only having to beat Bottas in the same car.
I'd say Max is a fair shout for driver of the season in 2019, but Leclerc and Vettel beat themselves in large part. If they'd driven even decently all season long, Max would have been nowhere near - that Ferrari was simply too quick. It was only multiple driver-error DNFs (for Leclerc) and spins (for Vettel) that put Max in striking range.
Yes I was going to say the same and by extension they made the Mercedes look better than it was, not that I'm saying that Mercedes was not the best car but they could have made things a lot more difficult for them.
Lewis Hamilton #44

World Drivers Titles: 7 (1st)
Grand Prix Wins: 95 (1st)
Pole Positions: 98 (1st)
Podiums: 165 (1st)


PF1 Pick 10 Competition
2014: Champion

Post Reply