2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

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pokerman
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by pokerman »

Which ever drivers jumped the start need points on their licenses.
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Harpo
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by Harpo »

Asphalt_World wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:36 pm
Harpo wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:35 pm
Amateur hour...
I don't think we!ll seee another Mugello GP. Or may be when the drivers get a true racing licence.
I don't see why any of this is Mugello specific.
Never said it was Mugello specific. But for a first it's a success, and I'm not sure the "powers" would want to renew the exercise.
As my brother said : "I've got the brain of a four year old. I'll bet he was glad to be rid of it".

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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by TheGiantHogweed »

Aspar wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:37 pm
What Bottas did was stupid. Even if he did not break any regulation, still it was stupid. Never seen a pilot do this, on the start line in the moment the safety car leaves.
People have to understand that things happen in split of a second and a lot of things are done by instinct and by expectation, that's what the backtrackers did, at one moment, actually Hamilton was so close to Bottas, when LH sped for a second that I thought they would hit.
Bottas doing those "warming" moves in a "slow motion" at the start line on the opening moment was stupid, even if by the rules.
it is a misjudgement of whoever was the first to set off - well before those ahead had gone. So it was down to them and not the leader. There have been plenty of other restarts where drivers at the back could have assumed that the leaders had got going elsewhere on track when infract they hadn't. I can't see how this has any blame on the leaders.

Fiki
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by Fiki »

Aspar wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:37 pm
What Bottas did was stupid. Even if he did not break any regulation, still it was stupid. Never seen a pilot do this, on the start line in the moment the safety car leaves.
People have to understand that things happen in split of a second and a lot of things are done by instinct and by expectation, that's what the backtrackers did, at one moment, actually Hamilton was so close to Bottas, when LH sped for a second that I thought they would hit.
Bottas doing those "warming" moves in a "slow motion" at the start line on the opening moment was stupid, even if by the rules.
Bottas has nothing to do with what happens behind a gap in the midfield, is how I see it at the moment. The restart after a Spectacle Car period isn't new.
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j man
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by j man »

I think it was Latifi that went first, then Giovinazzi and Sainz reacted to him. Whoever it was that put their foot down first needs a hefty penalty, one of the most idiotic pieces of driving I've seen. Worthy of a race ban if you ask me.

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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by UnlikeUday »

The crash that involved Gasly behind Verstappen was so identical o the crash in F3!
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Option or Prime
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by Option or Prime »

Bottas' fault or Safety car not giving sufficient notice of restart? This is a bike circuit, clearing the track is geared up for bike not F1 cars.

mikeyg123
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by mikeyg123 »

TheGiantHogweed wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:41 pm
Aspar wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:37 pm
What Bottas did was stupid. Even if he did not break any regulation, still it was stupid. Never seen a pilot do this, on the start line in the moment the safety car leaves.
People have to understand that things happen in split of a second and a lot of things are done by instinct and by expectation, that's what the backtrackers did, at one moment, actually Hamilton was so close to Bottas, when LH sped for a second that I thought they would hit.
Bottas doing those "warming" moves in a "slow motion" at the start line on the opening moment was stupid, even if by the rules.
it is a misjudgement of whoever was the first to set off - well before those ahead had gone. So it was down to them and not the leader. There have been plenty of other restarts where drivers at the back could have assumed that the leaders had got going elsewhere on track when infract they hadn't. I can't see how this has any blame on the leaders.
What Bottas' did isn't even that unusual. I don't see why it should be any more dangerous to go just before the start/finish line than go earlier. Either way the cars should be bunched up. The only reason it went wrong is because someone at the back got it wrong.

Asphalt_World
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by Asphalt_World »

Option or Prime wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:47 pm
Bottas' fault or Safety car not giving sufficient notice of restart? This is a bike circuit, clearing the track is geared up for bike not F1 cars.
Car races happen at Mugello most weeks. The fact F1 hasn't been here before doesn't make it a bike track.
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Paolo_Lasardi
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by Paolo_Lasardi »

The two "Alfas" have reduced the field quite considerably ...

mikeyg123
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by mikeyg123 »

Option or Prime wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:47 pm
Bottas' fault or Safety car not giving sufficient notice of restart? This is a bike circuit, clearing the track is geared up for bike not F1 cars.
Neither.

And loads of car races happen here. The reason why recovery takes a long time is that there are less marshalls working with social distancing.

pokerman
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by pokerman »

j man wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:44 pm
I think it was Latifi that went first, then Giovinazzi and Sainz reacted to him. Whoever it was that put their foot down first needs a hefty penalty, one of the most idiotic pieces of driving I've seen. Worthy of a race ban if you ask me.
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Fiki
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by Fiki »

mikeyg123 wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:48 pm
TheGiantHogweed wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:41 pm
Aspar wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:37 pm
What Bottas did was stupid. Even if he did not break any regulation, still it was stupid. Never seen a pilot do this, on the start line in the moment the safety car leaves.
People have to understand that things happen in split of a second and a lot of things are done by instinct and by expectation, that's what the backtrackers did, at one moment, actually Hamilton was so close to Bottas, when LH sped for a second that I thought they would hit.
Bottas doing those "warming" moves in a "slow motion" at the start line on the opening moment was stupid, even if by the rules.
it is a misjudgement of whoever was the first to set off - well before those ahead had gone. So it was down to them and not the leader. There have been plenty of other restarts where drivers at the back could have assumed that the leaders had got going elsewhere on track when infract they hadn't. I can't see how this has any blame on the leaders.
What Bottas' did isn't even that unusual. I don't see why it should be any more dangerous to go just before the start/finish line than go earlier. Either way the cars should be bunched up. The only reason it went wrong is because someone at the back got it wrong.
I don't know by heart what the rules say about this at the moment, but cars used to have to follow the one in front within 5 car lengths. Which wasn't without its problems either. It was a factor in the collision between Schumacher and Montoya in the tunnel at Monaco.
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Aspar
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by Aspar »

I don't excuse the guys at the back, just saying that Bottas has his share in the cause of the incident. According to the rules the leader, who essentially becomes the safety car decides when to restart, BUT overtakes may start to happen when cars pass the safety line car. Where is it on this track on the start line? Also, according to the rules the leader still has to act in a safe and relatively predictive manner.

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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by mikeyg123 »

I guess whoever went first was trying to anticipate the restart and it went all wrong.

mikeyg123
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by mikeyg123 »

Aspar wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:52 pm
I don't excuse the guys at the back, just saying that Bottas has his share in the cause of the incident. According to the rules the leader, who essentially becomes the safety car decides when to restart, BUT overtakes may start to happen when cars pass the safety line car. Where is it on this track on the start line? Also, according to the rules the leader still has to act in a safe and relatively predictive manner.
Bottas did act in a safe manor. He pretty much held a constant speed until he went. He wasn't doing loads of dummy starts or anything.

Fiki
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by Fiki »

Option or Prime wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:47 pm
Bottas' fault or Safety car not giving sufficient notice of restart? This is a bike circuit, clearing the track is geared up for bike not F1 cars.
The only thing that makes a track a bike track is the configuration of the kerb stones.
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Option or Prime
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by Option or Prime »

mikeyg123 wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:50 pm
Option or Prime wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:47 pm
Bottas' fault or Safety car not giving sufficient notice of restart? This is a bike circuit, clearing the track is geared up for bike not F1 cars.
Neither.

And loads of car races happen here. The reason why recovery takes a long time is that there are less marshalls working with social distancing.
Yes but the point is its narrow, there is nowhere to go but up the rear of the car in front!

Fiki
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by Fiki »

Apologies for a double post.
Last edited by Fiki on Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Aspar
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by Aspar »

mikeyg123 wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:54 pm
Aspar wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:52 pm
I don't excuse the guys at the back, just saying that Bottas has his share in the cause of the incident. According to the rules the leader, who essentially becomes the safety car decides when to restart, BUT overtakes may start to happen when cars pass the safety line car. Where is it on this track on the start line? Also, according to the rules the leader still has to act in a safe and relatively predictive manner.
Bottas did act in a safe manor. He pretty much held a constant speed until he went. He wasn't doing loads of dummy starts or anything.
Wouldn't say that, he did so fierce zig-zag slow motion, that Hamilton, who started driving straight because the line was coming and obviously anticipating to restart, had to move and slow down suddenly to avoid a hit.

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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by Asphalt_World »

Option or Prime wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:55 pm
mikeyg123 wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:50 pm
Option or Prime wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:47 pm
Bottas' fault or Safety car not giving sufficient notice of restart? This is a bike circuit, clearing the track is geared up for bike not F1 cars.
Neither.

And loads of car races happen here. The reason why recovery takes a long time is that there are less marshalls working with social distancing.
Yes but the point is its narrow, there is nowhere to go but up the rear of the car in front!
The start / finish straight isn't narrow at all.
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Fiki
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by Fiki »

Asphalt_World wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:58 pm
Option or Prime wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:55 pm
mikeyg123 wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:50 pm
Option or Prime wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:47 pm
Bottas' fault or Safety car not giving sufficient notice of restart? This is a bike circuit, clearing the track is geared up for bike not F1 cars.
Neither.

And loads of car races happen here. The reason why recovery takes a long time is that there are less marshalls working with social distancing.
Yes but the point is its narrow, there is nowhere to go but up the rear of the car in front!
The start / finish straight isn't narrow at all.
And when they race on wide tracks, they can't even stay on the track but actually race on the kerbs.
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A_Game_A_Day
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by A_Game_A_Day »

Timid Bottas at turn 1.

With 13 cars left, I could imagine Rosberg would have taken the tactical chance on running Hamilton out wide or even tagging him.

Asphalt_World
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by Asphalt_World »

Credit Leclerc for just about getting Stroll out of DRS, for the time being at least.
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by F1_Ernie »

A_Game_A_Day wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 2:03 pm
Timid Bottas at turn 1.

With 13 cars left, I could imagine Rosberg would have taken the tactical chance on running Hamilton out wide or even tagging him.
Bottas couldnt run Hamilton out unless you want to drive across the track against a car in front and smash you both out. Something Rosberg probably would do.
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by mikeyg123 »

Bottas' biggest crime today is letting Hamilton out brake him into turn 1 when he knows a 2nd place is worthless.

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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by TheGiantHogweed »

Well Hamilton did do a better start this time, but He still was pretty fortunate. After two starts where Bottas got or stayed ahead of him, he got given another chance.

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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by A_Game_A_Day »

F1_Ernie wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 2:04 pm
A_Game_A_Day wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 2:03 pm
Timid Bottas at turn 1.

With 13 cars left, I could imagine Rosberg would have taken the tactical chance on running Hamilton out wide or even tagging him.
Bottas couldnt run Hamilton unless you want to drive across the track against a car in front and smash you both out. Something Rosberg probably would do.
I recognise it would be highly risky & unethical.

However if ambitious for a title, to catch Hamilton may require that aggression. Rosberg played mind games.

I'm hypothesising that removing your championship rival, when you're in a Mercedes with 50 racing laps ahead, would be a calculated risk. Even with a penalty you'd be confident of gaining good points.
Last edited by A_Game_A_Day on Sun Sep 13, 2020 2:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

pokerman
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by pokerman »

F1_Ernie wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 2:04 pm
A_Game_A_Day wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 2:03 pm
Timid Bottas at turn 1.

With 13 cars left, I could imagine Rosberg would have taken the tactical chance on running Hamilton out wide or even tagging him.
Bottas couldnt run Hamilton out unless you want to drive across the track against a car in front and smash you both out. Something Rosberg probably would do.
That's what some people want to happen.
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by F1_Ernie »

Bottas had a better start both times, just the way the slipstream works.
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mikeyg123
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by mikeyg123 »

pokerman wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 2:08 pm
F1_Ernie wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 2:04 pm
A_Game_A_Day wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 2:03 pm
Timid Bottas at turn 1.

With 13 cars left, I could imagine Rosberg would have taken the tactical chance on running Hamilton out wide or even tagging him.
Bottas couldnt run Hamilton out unless you want to drive across the track against a car in front and smash you both out. Something Rosberg probably would do.
That's what some people want to happen.
Would have made a more interesting race. We would have just seen a pass for the lead.

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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by Asphalt_World »

Another day of easy DRS passes.
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Johnson
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by Johnson »

That restart mess was caused by somebody in the midfield leaving a huge space to the car in front and then accelerating into it suddenly which made the guys behind think it was time to go. Not sure who it was though?

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Johnson
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by Johnson »

Asphalt_World wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 2:12 pm
Another day of easy DRS passes.

I’m not sure, I just think the Ferrari is so slow it’s looking easy.

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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by lucifers »

riccardo vs stroll for 3rd

pokerman
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by pokerman »

Why is Leclerc on softs?
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A_Game_A_Day
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by A_Game_A_Day »

Johnson wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 2:13 pm
Asphalt_World wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 2:12 pm
Another day of easy DRS passes.

I’m not sure, I just think the Ferrari is so slow it’s looking easy.
There's a strong correlation between the common factors so far!

Feel for LeClerc.

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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by Fiki »

F1_Ernie wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 2:04 pm
A_Game_A_Day wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 2:03 pm
Timid Bottas at turn 1.

With 13 cars left, I could imagine Rosberg would have taken the tactical chance on running Hamilton out wide or even tagging him.
Bottas couldnt run Hamilton out unless you want to drive across the track against a car in front and smash you both out. Something Rosberg probably would do.
Don't be silly.
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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by Paolo_Lasardi »

Oh Ferrari ...

Leclerc tumbling down the order - and Vettel struggling to get close to a Williams ...

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Re: 2020 Tuscan GP Race thread

Post by pokerman »

mikeyg123 wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 2:11 pm
pokerman wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 2:08 pm
F1_Ernie wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 2:04 pm
A_Game_A_Day wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 2:03 pm
Timid Bottas at turn 1.

With 13 cars left, I could imagine Rosberg would have taken the tactical chance on running Hamilton out wide or even tagging him.
Bottas couldnt run Hamilton out unless you want to drive across the track against a car in front and smash you both out. Something Rosberg probably would do.
That's what some people want to happen.
Would have made a more interesting race. We would have just seen a pass for the lead.
It would have made an interesting crash.
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