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Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:26 pm
by mikeyg123
F1nut wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:49 pm
mikeyg123 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:24 pm
F1nut wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:21 pm
wire2004 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:00 pm
Schumacher forever#1 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 2:54 pm
Literally. They just promote 90% racing, where any hardship on the tyres would leave them degrading quickly. We badly need tyres that degrade linearly, not based on how hard they're pushed.
There is nothing wrong with the tyres. The teams pushed the tyres past the working life of the tyre.
Excuse me, according to Pirelli the hard tire is good for 60 laps, IIRC. The race was only 52 laps long, started on softs and mediums (which as I noted to another in the past went 38-40 laps when they shouldn't have). Pirelli ain't Bridgestone of past F1 or Goodyear (which handles most American racing) - sometimes they have no clue as to what their tires are capable of and that ain't safe for drivers, especially those that push an F1 car to it's "limit". IMHO
I think they predicted 40 laps for the hard so they were pretty bang on.
They were on C1's today the hardest compound they make which are rated for 60 laps (or were last year, I notice their website omits that information here in 2020). Face it my original statement stands - Pirelli should stick to bicycle and moped tires and folks should stop making excuses for them if for no other reason than driver "SAFETY".
I've looked it up. Pirelli rated the C1's to 40 laps. Looks like they were punctures from debris anyway so none of it is relevant.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:39 pm
by mikeyg123
Was anyone else really frustrated to see Bottas not take a lunge at Vettel in the final chicane? I think he's such a good driver but just lacks that last little 1% and the killer instinct that other top drivers have. I can't see Verstappen, Hamilton or Ricciardo not going for that when they have nothing to lose. Vettel would have been expecting it as well.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:52 pm
by Option or Prime
mikeyg123 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:26 pm
F1nut wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:49 pm
mikeyg123 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:24 pm
F1nut wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:21 pm
wire2004 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:00 pm
There is nothing wrong with the tyres. The teams pushed the tyres past the working life of the tyre.
Excuse me, according to Pirelli the hard tire is good for 60 laps, IIRC. The race was only 52 laps long, started on softs and mediums (which as I noted to another in the past went 38-40 laps when they shouldn't have). Pirelli ain't Bridgestone of past F1 or Goodyear (which handles most American racing) - sometimes they have no clue as to what their tires are capable of and that ain't safe for drivers, especially those that push an F1 car to it's "limit". IMHO
I think they predicted 40 laps for the hard so they were pretty bang on.
They were on C1's today the hardest compound they make which are rated for 60 laps (or were last year, I notice their website omits that information here in 2020). Face it my original statement stands - Pirelli should stick to bicycle and moped tires and folks should stop making excuses for them if for no other reason than driver "SAFETY".
I've looked it up. Pirelli rated the C1's to 40 laps. Looks like they were punctures from debris anyway so none of it is relevant.
Why do you say that then? They were reported as side wall failures. DC was saying the tyres on the Mercedes car were given a heavy battering due to the loading from the engine and heavy driving. VB was always within a second or so of LH.
LN reported his tyres were close to failing which was why he let DR past without a real fight. If that has been reported somewhere fine, but so many failures is unusual isn't it?
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:10 pm
by Alienturnedhuman
Option or Prime wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:52 pm
mikeyg123 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:26 pm
F1nut wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:49 pm
mikeyg123 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:24 pm
F1nut wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:21 pm
Excuse me, according to Pirelli the hard tire is good for 60 laps, IIRC. The race was only 52 laps long, started on softs and mediums (which as I noted to another in the past went 38-40 laps when they shouldn't have). Pirelli ain't Bridgestone of past F1 or Goodyear (which handles most American racing) - sometimes they have no clue as to what their tires are capable of and that ain't safe for drivers, especially those that push an F1 car to it's "limit". IMHO
I think they predicted 40 laps for the hard so they were pretty bang on.
They were on C1's today the hardest compound they make which are rated for 60 laps (or were last year, I notice their website omits that information here in 2020). Face it my original statement stands - Pirelli should stick to bicycle and moped tires and folks should stop making excuses for them if for no other reason than driver "SAFETY".
I've looked it up. Pirelli rated the C1's to 40 laps. Looks like they were punctures from debris anyway so none of it is relevant.
Why do you say that then? They were reported as side wall failures. DC was saying the tyres on the Mercedes car were given a heavy battering due to the loading from the engine and heavy driving. VB was always within a second or so of LH.
LN reported his tyres were close to failing which was why he let DR past without a real fight. If that has been reported somewhere fine, but so many failures is unusual isn't it?
Verstappen had 50 cuts on his tyres.
https://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12433 ... ppen-tyres
Hamilton is convinced that it was down to debris.
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/hami ... e/4848648/
But also, the fact that Mercedes didn't pit Hamilton would support it being down to debris.
If the hypothesis was that Bottas's tyre failed, then Mercedes would know the data on Bottas's tyre at the moment of failure. They would be able to see relatively where Hamilton's tyre was in its life in comparison. If there was any danger Hamilton was close to the same point they would have pitted at the start of the final lap - because Hamilton had a free stop as Max had pitted the lap before.
Also, factoring in that Bottas was running in Hamilton's dirty air, and that Hamilton is much kinder on his tyres compared to Bottas - it would fit that Hamilton's tyres were indeed in much better condition than Bottas's were.
However - if the catalyst for the failure was the debris on the track - then the picture changes. Yes, worn tyres would be more susceptible - but tyres failing due to wear is something that is nearly always predictable. The fact that 3 cars suffered failures at similar times, suggests there was some additional problem. The front left is the tyre that takes most of the load, but also the front left will see parts of the track that the other tyres don't and if the debris were located in a part that affects the front left more than the others, it would explain why the same tyre was affected by all who suffered problems.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:21 pm
by BMWSauber84
I've seen a few on social media suggest that Hamilton should get a penalty for driving a damaged car all the way around the track without going into the pits on the last lap.
I would suggest that is a load of utter nonsense.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:33 pm
by mikeyg123
BMWSauber84 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:21 pm
I've seen a few on social media suggest that Hamilton should get a penalty for driving a damaged car all the way around the track without going into the pits on the last lap.
I would suggest that is a load of utter nonsense.
Given it's the last lap I would agree. What would Hamilton pitting do for anyone?
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:35 pm
by spiritone
"utter nonsence" But that's the basis for a Formula Forum.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:35 pm
by mikeyg123
Option or Prime wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:52 pm
mikeyg123 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:26 pm
F1nut wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:49 pm
mikeyg123 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:24 pm
F1nut wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:21 pm
Excuse me, according to Pirelli the hard tire is good for 60 laps, IIRC. The race was only 52 laps long, started on softs and mediums (which as I noted to another in the past went 38-40 laps when they shouldn't have). Pirelli ain't Bridgestone of past F1 or Goodyear (which handles most American racing) - sometimes they have no clue as to what their tires are capable of and that ain't safe for drivers, especially those that push an F1 car to it's "limit". IMHO
I think they predicted 40 laps for the hard so they were pretty bang on.
They were on C1's today the hardest compound they make which are rated for 60 laps (or were last year, I notice their website omits that information here in 2020). Face it my original statement stands - Pirelli should stick to bicycle and moped tires and folks should stop making excuses for them if for no other reason than driver "SAFETY".
I've looked it up. Pirelli rated the C1's to 40 laps. Looks like they were punctures from debris anyway so none of it is relevant.
Why do you say that then? They were reported as side wall failures. DC was saying the tyres on the Mercedes car were given a heavy battering due to the loading from the engine and heavy driving. VB was always within a second or so of LH.
LN reported his tyres were close to failing which was why he let DR past without a real fight. If that has been reported somewhere fine, but so many failures is unusual isn't it?
Most people seem to be saying it looks like punctures caused my large amounts of debris from Kimi. I think Hamilton has said he's sure it was a puncture.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:51 pm
by JN23
mikeyg123 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:33 pm
BMWSauber84 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:21 pm
I've seen a few on social media suggest that Hamilton should get a penalty for driving a damaged car all the way around the track without going into the pits on the last lap.
I would suggest that is a load of utter nonsense.
Given it's the last lap I would agree. What would Hamilton pitting do for anyone?
Imagine the uproar had Hamilton gone for the pit lane and won the race in there
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:07 pm
by Option or Prime
mikeyg123 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:35 pm
Option or Prime wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:52 pm
mikeyg123 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:26 pm
F1nut wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:49 pm
mikeyg123 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:24 pm
I think they predicted 40 laps for the hard so they were pretty bang on.
They were on C1's today the hardest compound they make which are rated for 60 laps (or were last year, I notice their website omits that information here in 2020). Face it my original statement stands - Pirelli should stick to bicycle and moped tires and folks should stop making excuses for them if for no other reason than driver "SAFETY".
I've looked it up. Pirelli rated the C1's to 40 laps. Looks like they were punctures from debris anyway so none of it is relevant.
Why do you say that then? They were reported as side wall failures. DC was saying the tyres on the Mercedes car were given a heavy battering due to the loading from the engine and heavy driving. VB was always within a second or so of LH.
LN reported his tyres were close to failing which was why he let DR past without a real fight. If that has been reported somewhere fine, but so many failures is unusual isn't it?
Most people seem to be saying it looks like punctures caused my large amounts of debris from Kimi. I think Hamilton has said he's sure it was a puncture.
OK thanks for the detail, appreciated.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:10 pm
by Option or Prime
JN23 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:51 pm
mikeyg123 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:33 pm
BMWSauber84 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:21 pm
I've seen a few on social media suggest that Hamilton should get a penalty for driving a damaged car all the way around the track without going into the pits on the last lap.
I would suggest that is a load of utter nonsense.
Given it's the last lap I would agree. What would Hamilton pitting do for anyone?
Imagine the uproar had Hamilton gone for the pit lane and won the race in there
Most excellent, good job he wasn't in the Williams garage though, I'm not sure that is past the finish line with garages being allocated on team performance.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:28 pm
by TheGiantHogweed
I seriously doubt debris would cause the trye to come apart so neatly like that somehow. Given 3 drivers go a very similar sort of puncture as well as all struggling on this strategy, I don't see why Hamilton's won't ahve been for the same reason as Bottas's sand Sainz.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:29 pm
by F1_Ernie
Alienturnedhuman wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 5:26 pm
Hamilton could have pitted at the start of the final lap as following Max's pitstop he had a very safe gap. The fact Mercedes elected not to do this meant they were not expecting a tyre failure on his car. I would therefore categorise his tyre failure as being more unlucky than 'luck' that it happened with enough time to make it to the line still in first place.
There was nothing to lose with a pitstop at that moment - Max was around 10 seconds behind when he pitted and he wouldn't have made anywhere near that up on his out lap. With hindsight it seems crazy that Mercedes didn't think there was a credible risk of a tyre failure - but as Bottas was pushing harder than Hamilton and was in the dirty air, not to mention the fact Hamilton is typical able to stretch his tyres much longer than his competitors I think that Mercedes felt it was highly improbable that Hamilton would suffer the same blowout so soon after Bottas.
I know what your saying and its most likely correct but I was pretty dam sure Hamilton was going to get a puncture and I was right. After one Mercedes had a puncture and Mercedes didn't pit Hamilton I honestly knew what was coming but thankfully it didnt change the result.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:33 pm
by Alienturnedhuman
TheGiantHogweed wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:28 pm
I seriously doubt debris would cause the trye to come apart so neatly like that somehow. Given 3 drivers go a very similar sort of puncture as well as all struggling on this strategy, I don't see why Hamilton's won't ahve been for the same reason as Bottas's sand Sainz.
Who said it was only Hamilton's that would have been affected? At least four drivers were affected and the one whose tyre didn't explode had 50 cuts on it.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:40 pm
by mikeyg123
TheGiantHogweed wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:28 pm
I seriously doubt debris would cause the trye to come apart so neatly like that somehow. Given 3 drivers go a very similar sort of puncture as well as all struggling on this strategy, I don't see why Hamilton's won't ahve been for the same reason as Bottas's sand Sainz.
People think they were all punctures caused by debris from Kimi's exploding wing.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 10:19 pm
by Fiki
BMWSauber84 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 8:21 pm
I've seen a few on social media suggest that Hamilton should get a penalty for driving a damaged car all the way around the track without going into the pits on the last lap.
I would suggest that is a load of utter nonsense.
I had to look up which penalty Rosberg got at Zeltweg 2016 for continuing with a damaged car; it was a reprimand. I still don't understand why he got that, but consistency would suggest Hamilton to be up for one too.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 10:22 pm
by JN23
mikeyg123 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:40 pm
TheGiantHogweed wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:28 pm
I seriously doubt debris would cause the trye to come apart so neatly like that somehow. Given 3 drivers go a very similar sort of puncture as well as all struggling on this strategy, I don't see why Hamilton's won't ahve been for the same reason as Bottas's sand Sainz.
People think they were all punctures caused by debris from Kimi's exploding wing.
Speaking of Kimi’s wing, anyone know what happened?
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 11:18 pm
by Option or Prime
JN23 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 10:22 pm
mikeyg123 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:40 pm
TheGiantHogweed wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:28 pm
I seriously doubt debris would cause the trye to come apart so neatly like that somehow. Given 3 drivers go a very similar sort of puncture as well as all struggling on this strategy, I don't see why Hamilton's won't ahve been for the same reason as Bottas's sand Sainz.
People think they were all punctures caused by debris from Kimi's exploding wing.
Speaking of Kimi’s wing, anyone know what happened?
According to the BBC he got a puncture!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/53631557
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 11:24 pm
by Option or Prime
If they were a series of punctures why did so many cars complain of vibration, Bottas, Sainz, Norris?
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 12:26 am
by LBET
TSN, here in jolly old Canada, has included 5 or 6 F1 channels showing alternative data. Today they had Max's in car cam. It was one of the most uneventful bits of video i've ever seen. Mercs getting farther and farther away until it was like real racing 3 after you've passed the pack. All that was missing was the a bit of the Eric Carmen song.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 2:45 am
by F1_Ernie
Option or Prime wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 11:24 pm
If they were a series of punctures why did so many cars complain of vibration, Bottas, Sainz, Norris?
I know Bottas was complaining before Kimi's wing broke. Also if anyone has seen the picture of Hamiltons car, the front right looks like it's about to go aswell. Maybe the on screen graphics was right for a change which had Hamiltons front left red and 10%.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 6:54 am
by bourbon19
Well this race was a complete waste of time for Sebastian fans. The only moment of worth was him keeping his 10th place against Bottas at the end. Still not sure how he was able to do so. The live timing showed Bottas passing at some point, but they didn't show that - or I missed it. Anyway - imagine the bright moment of the wee hours of the morning being Seb managing to remain 10th. Shaking my head. Good on Lewis for hanging in there for the win. I don't blame RB or Max for the pit stop - hindsight is 20/20, but RB has gotten bit by the last minute tire blow out too many times to risk it.
Hopefully they give Sebastian a car instead of a truck next weekend or I shall not bother.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 7:39 am
by TheGiantHogweed
bourbon19 wrote: ↑Mon Aug 03, 2020 6:54 am
Well this race was a complete waste of time for Sebastian fans. The only moment of worth was him keeping his 10th place against Bottas at the end. Still not sure how he was able to do so. The live timing showed Bottas passing at some point, but they didn't show that - or I missed it. Anyway - imagine the bright moment of the wee hours of the morning being Seb managing to remain 10th. Shaking my head. Good on Lewis for hanging in there for the win. I don't blame RB or Max for the pit stop - hindsight is 20/20, but RB has gotten bit by the last minute tire blow out too many times to risk it.
Hopefully they give Sebastian a car instead of a truck next weekend or I shall not bother.
Yea i am not sure what is happening with Vettel's car. When was the last time a driver had a car with a fault in all 3 practice sessions. And not fixing a problem between friday and Saturday is especially poor. With the lack of running he had, I don't think I can compare him fairly to Leclerc this time out. Some think Bottas should have got by Vettel. He did get extremely close, but I think Vettel did a really good defence and kept his points finish.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 7:51 am
by BMWSauber84
Where was the pace of the Racing Point in the race? I appreciate that Stroll's strategy advantage was neutralised by the second safety car, but I expected them to be higher up.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 8:01 am
by Zazu
Was just looking at the driving standings and 22 and 20 points for the Racing Point drivers is a shambles given the pace the car has shown
Can anyone explain why the drivers kept trying (and failing) to overtake on the outside of Stowe? Need a huge advantage to pass as going very long way round and theres tonnes of marbles off the racing line
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 8:11 am
by TheGiantHogweed
BMWSauber84 wrote: ↑Mon Aug 03, 2020 7:51 am
Where was the pace of the Racing Point in the race? I appreciate that Stroll's strategy advantage was neutralised by the second safety car, but I expected them to be higher up.
I do actually think it seems that this team doesn't have the same advantage it had in Hungary. I don't think the practice was a realistic impression of the performance. I think the team were right to risk what they did with Stroll doing Q2 on the mediums to try a different strategy, but his advantage got ruined by that safety car. Still, his driving didn't look that good today.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 8:20 am
by Covalent
TheGiantHogweed wrote: ↑Mon Aug 03, 2020 8:11 am
BMWSauber84 wrote: ↑Mon Aug 03, 2020 7:51 am
Where was the pace of the Racing Point in the race? I appreciate that Stroll's strategy advantage was neutralised by the second safety car, but I expected them to be higher up.
I do actually think it seems that this team doesn't have the same advantage it had in Hungary. I don't think the practice was a realistic impression of the performance. I think the team were right to risk what they did with Stroll doing Q2 on the mediums to try a different strategy, but his advantage got ruined by that safety car. Still, his driving didn't look that good today.
I wouldn't downplay the importance of having an experienced teammate to trade setup data during the practice sessions. I'm pretty sure the lacklustre pace of Stroll was a direct effect of Perez' absence.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 9:26 am
by Badger36
Dull race until the last couple of laps.
F1 has became very homogenous strategy wise.
Unfortunately I fear that after race 4..... that's pretty much the season over at the front end.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 9:46 am
by Covalent
Yes unfortunately this will probably be what ultimately sealed the championship in Hamilton's favour. With a car this dominant you can't afford a 0p race as you know your teammate will win.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 10:04 am
by F1_Ernie
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 10:05 am
by Option or Prime
Remember it was nearly a 0p race for both of them. Plus hulks 'won't start' Mercedes engine. Reliability could still have a say in this, yes ..... I realise its a bit of straw clutching but just trying to kept it interesting!
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 10:42 am
by tim3003
Option or Prime wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 11:24 pm
If they were a series of punctures why did so many cars complain of vibration, Bottas, Sainz, Norris?
Watching the replays the tyres did not look punctured by debris. In that case they would have gone down fast and/or exploded quickly. What happened was a structural failure in the side-walls, which meant the tyre slowly came apart but kept its basic shape, allowing Hamilton and Bottas to keep rolling on around the lap. The fact that the whole of the treaded parts stayed in one piece, attached to the flayed sidewalls, shows that they weren't compromised by cuts. I don't ever remember seeing punctured tyres stay in one piece like that before. And as it was the same front left tyre on all 3 cars it's pretty unlikely they were cut by debris.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 10:45 am
by Herb
And some context on the speeds:
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 10:49 am
by Covalent
tim3003 wrote: ↑Mon Aug 03, 2020 10:42 am
Option or Prime wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 11:24 pm
If they were a series of punctures why did so many cars complain of vibration, Bottas, Sainz, Norris?
Watching the replays the tyres did not look punctured by debris. In that case they would have gone down fast and/or exploded quickly. What happened was a structural failure in the side-walls, which meant the tyre slowly came apart but kept its basic shape, allowing Hamilton and Bottas to keep rolling on around the lap. The fact that the whole of the treaded parts stayed in one piece, attached to the flayed sidewalls, shows that they weren't compromised by cuts. I don't ever remember seeing punctured tyres stay in one piece like that before. And as it was the same front left tyre on all 3 cars it's pretty unlikely they were cut by debris.
Indeed and I think it's quite unlikely Kimi's puncture was caused by debris by his own front wing. His was also the front left.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 11:04 am
by pc27b
tim3003 wrote: ↑Mon Aug 03, 2020 10:42 am
Option or Prime wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 11:24 pm
If they were a series of punctures why did so many cars complain of vibration, Bottas, Sainz, Norris?
Watching the replays the tyres did not look punctured by debris. In that case they would have gone down fast and/or exploded quickly. What happened was a structural failure in the side-walls, which meant the tyre slowly came apart but kept its basic shape, allowing Hamilton and Bottas to keep rolling on around the lap. The fact that the whole of the treaded parts stayed in one piece, attached to the flayed sidewalls, shows that they weren't compromised by cuts. I don't ever remember seeing punctured tyres stay in one piece like that before. And as it was the same front left tyre on all 3 cars it's pretty unlikely they were cut by debris.
i agree, the way the tire came apart, it wasn't punctures. did das have something to do with it ?
mercedes have built an utterly dominant machine. development frozen for next year too
ferrari should be further embarrassed. the guy with no name on his drivers suit car doesn't run most of practice ??
like others have posted, i'm hoping some teams have the driver pushing to the max, and 2-3 stops, instead of driving to a delta. otherwise we are in for another snoozefest
just give the trophies to hamilton and mercedes while in silverstone
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 11:12 am
by tootsie323
Zazu wrote: ↑Mon Aug 03, 2020 8:01 am
Was just looking at the driving standings and 22 and 20 points for the Racing Point drivers is a shambles given the pace the car has shown
Can anyone explain why the drivers kept trying (and failing) to overtake on the outside of Stowe? Need a huge advantage to pass as going very long way round and theres tonnes of marbles off the racing line
I think that it wasn't actually too 'marbly,' plus the support races (F2, F3) had some examples of successful passes around the outside of that corner.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 11:26 am
by pokerman
tootsie323 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:20 pm
pokerman wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:18 pm
tootsie323 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:16 pm
Just a couple of points. Firstly, Red Bull pitted Verstappen before Hamilton had his tyre failure. Hindsight is indeed wonderful. Secondly, my impression is the it's generally accepted that Hamilton can look after hus tyres better than Bottas so there may have been little reason to suspect that Hamilton's tyre may have gone before finishing the race.
Aside that, huge kudos to Riccardo for his result and what the four-and-a-half with Grosjean's idea of defending his position?
Grosjean needs to retire.
I've defended that guy in the past and I'd still rate him as a decent driver, given a decent car. But that today... he needs to take a long hard look at his race replay.
Apparently he has no regrets about what he did he's the driver representative in matters such as safety.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 11:30 am
by pokerman
mikeyg123 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:24 pm
F1nut wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:21 pm
wire2004 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:00 pm
Schumacher forever#1 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 2:54 pm
F1nut wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 2:49 pm
Pirelli tires suck.
Literally. They just promote 90% racing, where any hardship on the tyres would leave them degrading quickly. We badly need tyres that degrade linearly, not based on how hard they're pushed.
There is nothing wrong with the tyres. The teams pushed the tyres past the working life of the tyre.
Excuse me, according to Pirelli the hard tire is good for 60 laps, IIRC. The race was only 52 laps long, started on softs and mediums (which as I noted to another in the past went 38-40 laps when they shouldn't have). Pirelli ain't Bridgestone of past F1 or Goodyear (which handles most American racing) - sometimes they have no clue as to what their tires are capable of and that ain't safe for drivers, especially those that push an F1 car to it's "limit". IMHO
I think they predicted 40 laps for the hard so they were pretty bang on.
Not really they only needed to do 34 racing laps, the SC restart was on lap 18.
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 11:33 am
by pokerman
Schumacher forever#1 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:45 pm
pokerman wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:26 pm
mikeyg123 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:24 pm
pokerman wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:24 pm
mikeyg123 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:20 pm
Why? I would much rather see people pushing and doing 5 stops than cruising and doing 1.
In reality it will be a 2/3 stop race.
The cars will be cruising even more because of the tyre allocation.
They wouldn't if they made 5 stops.
Which would be a farce, but then again if you love watching pitstops.
Why should one stop races be considered the fastest? In my opinion, a two stop strategy should be quicker than a one stop strategy, to encourage teams to perform an aggressive strategy that will hopefully make up for the loss of track position. Either that or allow teams to run only one tyre. Because, right now, one stoppers are always the quickest and it means everyone runs the same tyre strategy.
And, anyways. We need something to spice things up. This season is as good as done, so we might as well have some chaos.
I'm talking about having to race on tyres that will only last 10 laps but like you say you're happy for the races to be chaotic, best chance of stopping Mercedes from winning I guess?
Re: 2020 British Grand Prix Race Thread
Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2020 11:34 am
by Badger36
Covalent wrote: ↑Mon Aug 03, 2020 9:46 am
Yes unfortunately this will probably be what ultimately sealed the championship in Hamilton's favour. With a car this dominant you can't afford a 0p race as you know your teammate will win.
Bottas only chance of a championship win is to drive well and get better luck than Hamilton.
He is a quick and tidy driver, but he just lacks a cutting edge when it matters. A perfect "wingman" really.
This looks like being Hamiltons easiest championship, and a credit to Mercedes - they are just a winning machine. You don't need to think too hard to remember the races since 2014 where they haven't had at least 1 driver on the podium. Even in this era, that's an awesome a achievement.