Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

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Alienturnedhuman
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Alienturnedhuman »

Covalent wrote:
Alienturnedhuman wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Alienturnedhuman wrote:
pokerman wrote:Should we really be trading with a country like China?

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/coronavi ... d=SK216DHP
We love our iPhones too much to stop doing that.
More like big international companies like to use cheap labour?
Chicken or egg? Consumers require a price point, that price point dictates the labour cost.

I'm not defending organisations, but it wouldn't be possible to sell the phones at the price they are sold at now if they were suddenly made in a country at Western minimum wage levels.
Apple are reporting a quarterly profit of over 20 billion dollars. In 2019 they sold about 40 million iPhones. So by reducing their profits they could reduce their phone prices by up to $2000. I know I'm over-simplifying the situation here, but they don't have their production abroad solely for the good of the customers.
I never said it was for the good of the customers, and Apple is a bad example as their products are over priced due to the badge. But it's not possible to produce these products in the west for a price people are willing to pay. However Apple's most lucrative profits don't really come from its hardware division, it comes from the 30% cut they take on digital sales from third parties through its stores which is essentially money for nothing. But this is massively off topic.

China's government has covered up a lot over coronavirus in order to avoid economic damage, but so have many Western governments too. There is arguably even worse crimes being done by the Trump administration as it delayed rolling out tests to Americans in order to hand the contract for test kit manufacturing to Ivanka Trump's husband's brother, for a value of 3 times the price per kit as the WHO kit would have cost. The website went to Ivanka Trump's husband. Literal profiteering off of a pandemic killing Americans.

We then have German car manufacturers lobbying to return to work before its ready because they want to start making cars again, various failings by the British government, the Japanese government originally planned to hand out vouchers for companies that were friends of the Prime Minister's... all the governments across the world initially tried to play down the scale of the problem in their countries because admitting it early was bad for their image. It's no different to China. Until the weekend Trump was still claiming the USA would be opening for business on Easter.

As for clamping down on health workers. American hospitals are firing doctors and nurses who publicly criticise the hospital they work for. The British government has fired NHS workers who criticise the lack of PPE they have received. This is during a pandemic situation when qualified medical professionals is at a premium and they are losing their lives in the fight.

Maybe it's not as extreme as what China has done. But it's certainly an extremely hypocritical, holier than thou attitude.

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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by SteveW »

Siao7 wrote:
SteveW wrote:
Siao7 wrote:I generally don't have much time left now that we have to work from home, it is so weird!
On a slightly different note, how many of you working from home during all of this are finding that actually, you're working far more hours than you normally would in the office?

I'm definitely doing that. And I'm salaried so it makes no difference to my wages, but I'm still finding myself doing it!

My wife on the other hand gets paid overtime and works for a Life Assurance company on Death Claims. Because they've closed down the offshore offices in India they are getting offered overtime and she's been doing on average about 20 hours extra a week, spread over the weekdays and five hours each on Saturday and Sunday. So we're bringing in a fair bit more money at the moment and not being able to spend it - which is good :)

I very much appreciate we are a couple of the lucky ones that haven't had financial implications to deal with on top of everything else going on right now!
For the last two days I had meetings running from 12:00 until 16:00, right through lunch time. People do not have enough time in the day, we spend all the time on the phone and not achieving much, it is very unproductive in terms of actual work. I work easily 20% more hours than before, unpaid like yourself.
We are trying to keep meetings to a minimum, but obviously sometimes it can't be avoided. I'm just finding it hard to switch off. If I was working at the office today I would have left 20 minutes ago, but here I am still sat at my desk at home and working. OK, I'm typing on a forum, but you know what I mean :lol:
Biffa wrote:I love working from home, been doing it for years. The trick for me is I need to be super disciplined else things can easily get away from me e.g. have a dedicated space and a proper work day schedule, I won't work outside normal working hours unless there are exceptional circumstances and absolutely no working in PJs and no glasses of wine during working hours ;-) It's easy for work and home life to get blurred if you're not careful and that is not good for your state of mind.
I have worked from home before, but it's only ever been a day at a time if I've needed to be at home, or when I'm on call and I have to log in to fix issues, so I'm not used to it on a daily basis.

I have made sure I've got dressed into proper clothes so I feel like I am awake so to speak, but I don't have a dedicated space as although we have a four bed house, all of our rooms are occupied by the kids (who are all old enough not to bother us, the youngest is 17 - so that's one good thing.), so I'm on the dining table with monitors and laptop working away there.

Maybe it will get easier the longer I have to do it. I'm just worried that working extra like I have been, sometimes purely unintentionally is going to set a precedent for when we're all back in the office. And I do not want that! :lol:

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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Siao7 »

SteveW wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
SteveW wrote:
Siao7 wrote:I generally don't have much time left now that we have to work from home, it is so weird!
On a slightly different note, how many of you working from home during all of this are finding that actually, you're working far more hours than you normally would in the office?

I'm definitely doing that. And I'm salaried so it makes no difference to my wages, but I'm still finding myself doing it!

My wife on the other hand gets paid overtime and works for a Life Assurance company on Death Claims. Because they've closed down the offshore offices in India they are getting offered overtime and she's been doing on average about 20 hours extra a week, spread over the weekdays and five hours each on Saturday and Sunday. So we're bringing in a fair bit more money at the moment and not being able to spend it - which is good :)

I very much appreciate we are a couple of the lucky ones that haven't had financial implications to deal with on top of everything else going on right now!
For the last two days I had meetings running from 12:00 until 16:00, right through lunch time. People do not have enough time in the day, we spend all the time on the phone and not achieving much, it is very unproductive in terms of actual work. I work easily 20% more hours than before, unpaid like yourself.
We are trying to keep meetings to a minimum, but obviously sometimes it can't be avoided. I'm just finding it hard to switch off. If I was working at the office today I would have left 20 minutes ago, but here I am still sat at my desk at home and working. OK, I'm typing on a forum, but you know what I mean :lol:
Biffa wrote:I love working from home, been doing it for years. The trick for me is I need to be super disciplined else things can easily get away from me e.g. have a dedicated space and a proper work day schedule, I won't work outside normal working hours unless there are exceptional circumstances and absolutely no working in PJs and no glasses of wine during working hours ;-) It's easy for work and home life to get blurred if you're not careful and that is not good for your state of mind.
I have worked from home before, but it's only ever been a day at a time if I've needed to be at home, or when I'm on call and I have to log in to fix issues, so I'm not used to it on a daily basis.

I have made sure I've got dressed into proper clothes so I feel like I am awake so to speak, but I don't have a dedicated space as although we have a four bed house, all of our rooms are occupied by the kids (who are all old enough not to bother us, the youngest is 17 - so that's one good thing.), so I'm on the dining table with monitors and laptop working away there.

Maybe it will get easier the longer I have to do it. I'm just worried that working extra like I have been, sometimes purely unintentionally is going to set a precedent for when we're all back in the office. And I do not want that! :lol:
I am afraid that for me the precedent would be to go to the office wearing hoodies and sweatpants instead of office attire!

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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Harpo »

I have been working at home since a very long time and what I can tell is that the lock-down didn't change too many things for me, as I was trained for years. Except for the silence thickening day by day in the area and not leaving home as often as I did, if not at all.

Difference is I worked a lot more before the lock-down (late in the evening, early in the morning and too often during the week-ends) and I'll soon have no work coming from the outside (I'll do personnal works instead) : my clients, who for 3 weeks had moved their office to their own home, are starting to be laid off...
As my brother said : "I've got the brain of a four year old. I'll bet he was glad to be rid of it".

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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by j man »

Alienturnedhuman wrote:As for clamping down on health workers. American hospitals are firing doctors and nurses who publicly criticise the hospital they work for. The British government has fired NHS workers who criticise the lack of PPE they have received.[/color]
Do you have a link for this? It's shocking if true, but a quick Google search has revealed nothing.

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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Alienturnedhuman »

j man wrote:
Alienturnedhuman wrote:As for clamping down on health workers. American hospitals are firing doctors and nurses who publicly criticise the hospital they work for. The British government has fired NHS workers who criticise the lack of PPE they have received.[/color]
Do you have a link for this? It's shocking if true, but a quick Google search has revealed nothing.
Ok, so the NHS event doesn't say 'firing' but rather 'disciplinary action' and 'sent home' - which at best is a suspension - but still pretty bad (I read it late so I guess I remembered it as being the same as the US version).

https://www.theguardian.com/society/202 ... -shortages

However the US Hospitals have told doctors they will be fired:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... k-to-press

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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Siao7 »

j man wrote:
Alienturnedhuman wrote:As for clamping down on health workers. American hospitals are firing doctors and nurses who publicly criticise the hospital they work for. The British government has fired NHS workers who criticise the lack of PPE they have received.[/color]
Do you have a link for this? It's shocking if true, but a quick Google search has revealed nothing.
Yeah, I haven't heard anything like this (not doubting Alien, just saying that I haven't heard this in the news), but it is very worrying if this is true.

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Alienturnedhuman
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Alienturnedhuman »

Siao7 wrote:
j man wrote:
Alienturnedhuman wrote:As for clamping down on health workers. American hospitals are firing doctors and nurses who publicly criticise the hospital they work for. The British government has fired NHS workers who criticise the lack of PPE they have received.[/color]
Do you have a link for this? It's shocking if true, but a quick Google search has revealed nothing.
Yeah, I haven't heard anything like this (not doubting Alien, just saying that I haven't heard this in the news), but it is very worrying if this is true.
I think we posted in the same time, the links are in the post just above yours.

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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Siao7 »

Alienturnedhuman wrote:
Siao7 wrote:
j man wrote:
Alienturnedhuman wrote:As for clamping down on health workers. American hospitals are firing doctors and nurses who publicly criticise the hospital they work for. The British government has fired NHS workers who criticise the lack of PPE they have received.[/color]
Do you have a link for this? It's shocking if true, but a quick Google search has revealed nothing.
Yeah, I haven't heard anything like this (not doubting Alien, just saying that I haven't heard this in the news), but it is very worrying if this is true.
I think we posted in the same time, the links are in the post just above yours.
:thumbup:

Thanks Alien!

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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Tufty »

Alien, I really wish you'd been wrong about that. I've heard of NHS workers being evicted from flat shares to prevent their landlords catching coronavirus from them because the legislation against evictions doesn't seem to cover that sort of tenancy. Nor is it being properly enforced from what I'm hearing, although that's just what I'm hearing from experiences of friends of friends, so not gospel.
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Blake »

Alienturnedhuman wrote:
Covalent wrote:
Alienturnedhuman wrote: Chicken or egg? Consumers require a price point, that price point dictates the labour cost.

I'm not defending organisations, but it wouldn't be possible to sell the phones at the price they are sold at now if they were suddenly made in a country at Western minimum wage levels.
Apple are reporting a quarterly profit of over 20 billion dollars. In 2019 they sold about 40 million iPhones. So by reducing their profits they could reduce their phone prices by up to $2000. I know I'm over-simplifying the situation here, but they don't have their production abroad solely for the good of the customers.
I never said it was for the good of the customers, and Apple is a bad example as their products are over priced due to the badge. But it's not possible to produce these products in the west for a price people are willing to pay. However Apple's most lucrative profits don't really come from its hardware division, it comes from the 30% cut they take on digital sales from third parties through its stores which is essentially money for nothing. But this is massively off topic.

China's government has covered up a lot over coronavirus in order to avoid economic damage, but so have many Western governments too. There is arguably even worse crimes being done by the Trump administration as it delayed rolling out tests to Americans in order to hand the contract for test kit manufacturing to Ivanka Trump's husband's brother, for a value of 3 times the price per kit as the WHO kit would have cost. The website went to Ivanka Trump's husband. Literal profiteering off of a pandemic killing Americans.

We then have German car manufacturers lobbying to return to work before its ready because they want to start making cars again, various failings by the British government, the Japanese government originally planned to hand out vouchers for companies that were friends of the Prime Minister's... all the governments across the world initially tried to play down the scale of the problem in their countries because admitting it early was bad for their image. It's no different to China. Until the weekend Trump was still claiming the USA would be opening for business on Easter.

As for clamping down on health workers. American hospitals are firing doctors and nurses who publicly criticise the hospital they work for. The British government has fired NHS workers who criticise the lack of PPE they have received. This is during a pandemic situation when qualified medical professionals is at a premium and they are losing their lives in the fight.

Maybe it's not as extreme as what China has done. But it's certainly an extremely hypocritical, holier than thou attitude.
Alien,
I had not heard of the Trump testing issue that you described, but I wouldn't deny it in the least. It certainly sounds like Trump in every way. Do you have any links to that story...maybe I can even wake up a trumpie or two (OK, I realize it isn't likely, but I can try!)
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Alienturnedhuman
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Alienturnedhuman »

Blake wrote:
Alienturnedhuman wrote:
Covalent wrote:
Alienturnedhuman wrote: Chicken or egg? Consumers require a price point, that price point dictates the labour cost.

I'm not defending organisations, but it wouldn't be possible to sell the phones at the price they are sold at now if they were suddenly made in a country at Western minimum wage levels.
Apple are reporting a quarterly profit of over 20 billion dollars. In 2019 they sold about 40 million iPhones. So by reducing their profits they could reduce their phone prices by up to $2000. I know I'm over-simplifying the situation here, but they don't have their production abroad solely for the good of the customers.
I never said it was for the good of the customers, and Apple is a bad example as their products are over priced due to the badge. But it's not possible to produce these products in the west for a price people are willing to pay. However Apple's most lucrative profits don't really come from its hardware division, it comes from the 30% cut they take on digital sales from third parties through its stores which is essentially money for nothing. But this is massively off topic.

China's government has covered up a lot over coronavirus in order to avoid economic damage, but so have many Western governments too. There is arguably even worse crimes being done by the Trump administration as it delayed rolling out tests to Americans in order to hand the contract for test kit manufacturing to Ivanka Trump's husband's brother, for a value of 3 times the price per kit as the WHO kit would have cost. The website went to Ivanka Trump's husband. Literal profiteering off of a pandemic killing Americans.

We then have German car manufacturers lobbying to return to work before its ready because they want to start making cars again, various failings by the British government, the Japanese government originally planned to hand out vouchers for companies that were friends of the Prime Minister's... all the governments across the world initially tried to play down the scale of the problem in their countries because admitting it early was bad for their image. It's no different to China. Until the weekend Trump was still claiming the USA would be opening for business on Easter.

As for clamping down on health workers. American hospitals are firing doctors and nurses who publicly criticise the hospital they work for. The British government has fired NHS workers who criticise the lack of PPE they have received. This is during a pandemic situation when qualified medical professionals is at a premium and they are losing their lives in the fight.

Maybe it's not as extreme as what China has done. But it's certainly an extremely hypocritical, holier than thou attitude.
Alien,
I had not heard of the Trump testing issue that you described, but I wouldn't deny it in the least. It certainly sounds like Trump in every way. Do you have any links to that story...maybe I can even wake up a trumpie or two (OK, I realize it isn't likely, but I can try!)
Ok, I read about that at the start of the US infections back when Trump was claiming there were only a handful of cases etc, and it seems in retrospect that it's only partially true, the website part - https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/kushner-oscar-covid/ - I had seen the story distributed so widely but hadn't personally checked up on it, which I normally do and I should have made sure of it before posting it here.

However, the reason it did get so widely distributed is because the US government chose not to use the WHO test and instead develop their own more expensive test. This is the reason for the delay in getting tests available for Americans, and thus when I heard - the incorrect news - that it was because the contract had been handed to OSCAR, that fit so well with the existing incompetence.

I mean, the whole thing still stinks, it's going to be down to health care companies lobbying for a test they can charge more for (because there's nothing like a pandemic to make Americans want to pay more for a test) - of course this was back when they didn't realise the virus was going to actually become an uncontrolled epidemic in the US, and were hoping to cash in on hypochondriacs wanting to take the coronatest.

Unfortunately, there's no smoking gun for that. But why develop a less accurate, more expensive and harder to deploy test than the WHO one that they could have used immediately?

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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by pokerman »

Alienturnedhuman wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Alienturnedhuman wrote:
pokerman wrote:Should we really be trading with a country like China?

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/coronavi ... d=SK216DHP
We love our iPhones too much to stop doing that.
More like big international companies like to use cheap labour?
Chicken or egg? Consumers require a price point, that price point dictates the labour cost.

I'm not defending organisations, but it wouldn't be possible to sell the phones at the price they are sold at now if they were suddenly made in a country at Western minimum wage levels.
I'm sure they would still be doing alright but the greed is at the consumer end, I'm not so sure about that?
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Blake »

Alienturnedhuman wrote:
Blake wrote:
Alienturnedhuman wrote:
Covalent wrote:
Alienturnedhuman wrote: Chicken or egg? Consumers require a price point, that price point dictates the labour cost.

I'm not defending organisations, but it wouldn't be possible to sell the phones at the price they are sold at now if they were suddenly made in a country at Western minimum wage levels.
Apple are reporting a quarterly profit of over 20 billion dollars. In 2019 they sold about 40 million iPhones. So by reducing their profits they could reduce their phone prices by up to $2000. I know I'm over-simplifying the situation here, but they don't have their production abroad solely for the good of the customers.
I never said it was for the good of the customers, and Apple is a bad example as their products are over priced due to the badge. But it's not possible to produce these products in the west for a price people are willing to pay. However Apple's most lucrative profits don't really come from its hardware division, it comes from the 30% cut they take on digital sales from third parties through its stores which is essentially money for nothing. But this is massively off topic.

China's government has covered up a lot over coronavirus in order to avoid economic damage, but so have many Western governments too. There is arguably even worse crimes being done by the Trump administration as it delayed rolling out tests to Americans in order to hand the contract for test kit manufacturing to Ivanka Trump's husband's brother, for a value of 3 times the price per kit as the WHO kit would have cost. The website went to Ivanka Trump's husband. Literal profiteering off of a pandemic killing Americans.

We then have German car manufacturers lobbying to return to work before its ready because they want to start making cars again, various failings by the British government, the Japanese government originally planned to hand out vouchers for companies that were friends of the Prime Minister's... all the governments across the world initially tried to play down the scale of the problem in their countries because admitting it early was bad for their image. It's no different to China. Until the weekend Trump was still claiming the USA would be opening for business on Easter.

As for clamping down on health workers. American hospitals are firing doctors and nurses who publicly criticise the hospital they work for. The British government has fired NHS workers who criticise the lack of PPE they have received. This is during a pandemic situation when qualified medical professionals is at a premium and they are losing their lives in the fight.

Maybe it's not as extreme as what China has done. But it's certainly an extremely hypocritical, holier than thou attitude.
Alien,
I had not heard of the Trump testing issue that you described, but I wouldn't deny it in the least. It certainly sounds like Trump in every way. Do you have any links to that story...maybe I can even wake up a trumpie or two (OK, I realize it isn't likely, but I can try!)
Ok, I read about that at the start of the US infections back when Trump was claiming there were only a handful of cases etc, and it seems in retrospect that it's only partially true, the website part - https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/kushner-oscar-covid/ - I had seen the story distributed so widely but hadn't personally checked up on it, which I normally do and I should have made sure of it before posting it here.

However, the reason it did get so widely distributed is because the US government chose not to use the WHO test and instead develop their own more expensive test. This is the reason for the delay in getting tests available for Americans, and thus when I heard - the incorrect news - that it was because the contract had been handed to OSCAR, that fit so well with the existing incompetence.

I mean, the whole thing still stinks, it's going to be down to health care companies lobbying for a test they can charge more for (because there's nothing like a pandemic to make Americans want to pay more for a test) - of course this was back when they didn't realise the virus was going to actually become an uncontrolled epidemic in the US, and were hoping to cash in on hypochondriacs wanting to take the coronatest.

Unfortunately, there's no smoking gun for that. But why develop a less accurate, more expensive and harder to deploy test than the WHO one that they could have used immediately?
I agree 100%, my friend. It is disgraceful, and if provable, it is likely criminal. However, just as with every other Trump "game", they will get away with it. So discouraging. Thanks.
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Fiki »

Blake wrote:Do you have any links to that story...maybe I can even wake up a trumpie or two (OK, I realize it isn't likely, but I can try!)
Isn't that dangerous, Blake? I would suggest you apply double the safe social distancing rule before you even start! ;)
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Option or Prime »

I suspect our Donnie has a finger in many a coronavirus pie, the ones he isn't will get the wrath of his tongue in one of his rallies/CV press conferences.
His incompetence will simply soak up the world's coronavirus resources and end up not only killing his own citizens but many in the rest of the world as well!
I genuinely think he is an ongoing menace to the world.
Last edited by Option or Prime on Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

pc27b
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by pc27b »

there are too many conspiracy theories for me to bother wasting time on right now. heck, some are claiming 5g causes coronavirus ?? having said that, there isn't much i would put past governments and greedy corporations doing to retain/get more power, or get more money.
i think the time to deal with that, is after we get though the next few months. but our president here won't even lock down all the states or recommend masks in public

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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Alienturnedhuman »

pc27b wrote:there are too many conspiracy theories for me to bother wasting time on right now. heck, some are claiming 5g causes coronavirus ?? having said that, there isn't much i would put past governments and greedy corporations doing to retain/get more power, or get more money.
i think the time to deal with that, is after we get though the next few months. but our president here won't even lock down all the states or recommend masks in public
People in the UK are burning down 5G masts, a woman angrily confronted some broadband engineers telling them they were responsible for installing the equipment that was killing people, making everyone sick causing the lockdown and that the new hospital in London was actually a death camp for people infected with 5G radiation.
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/ ... nspiracies

When i lived in the UK, everyone would laugh at all the stories coming out of America, how stupid Americans are for all the stupid stuff you hear going on in there. Since moving out of the UK and now reading about it from an international perspective on international news sites (and my web browser being sent the international versions of the UK media) I've learned that for most other countries, the country they point and laugh at isn't the USA, it's Britain. Britain really is the laughing stock of the world right now. Although the USA is often second...


[/color]

pc27b
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by pc27b »

videos like that, I'm not sure how many are really happening because someone is a nut job, compared to how many do videos like that just to get views on the internet?

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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Alienturnedhuman »

pc27b wrote:videos like that, I'm not sure how many are really happening because someone is a nut job, compared to how many do videos like that just to get views on the internet?
Both a BBC and Guardian journalist confirmed that the video was real as they contacted the company involved. When I first saw it I assumed it was staged as I couldn't believe what was coming out of her mouth.

However the fact that two 5G masts have been set on fire, and there are videos on YouTube by British people doing things like disassembling equipment claiming they are are electrical engineers and the cables they are using are far thicker than what is needed for a transmitter so are only being used so they can deliver the power needed to deliver lethal levels of radiation... I mean, it hurts my brain just typing the nonsense let alone listening to it. There has been an underground movement that pushes the idea that 5G will kill people, and they've latched onto the Corona pandemic and are using it to support their nonsense.

There are people out there who think that the mobile phone companies are using their transmitters to selectively target people and use the 5G radiation to lower their immune system so they can contract COVID19. I mean, I don't know how this plays out as a business strategy, EE can't exactly go around killing its customers or they'll lose revenue, so maybe they are phoning up O2 customers, offering them to switch and if they don't then give them a blast with their deadly Coronalaser.

I think that the UK is starting to pay the price for not confronting people who spout this nonsense thinking if they ignore it then it'll go away. I mean, that's the strategy take towards anti vaxxers and it's not exactly worked out as until the COVID19 epidemic hit anti vaxxers were on the rise. I think a key lesson of recent times is that you do have to challenge idiots when they spout nonsense because if there is one thing more contagious than coronavirus it's a stupid idea.

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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Harpo »

Alienturnedhuman wrote:
When i lived in the UK, everyone would laugh at all the stories coming out of America, how stupid Americans are for all the stupid stuff you hear going on in there. Since moving out of the UK and now reading about it from an international perspective on international news sites (and my web browser being sent the international versions of the UK media) I've learned that for most other countries, the country they point and laugh at isn't the USA, it's Britain. Britain really is the laughing stock of the world right now. Although the USA is often second...


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Not sure it will appease you, but my point of view is that stupidity is dispatched equally around the word, just like other human qualities. The way they are expressed being a matter of culture and history, the "foreign" stupidity may appear more laughable, thick, violent, etc. than our "national" stupity, just because it's not the one we're used too.
We laugh of Trump and the trumpites (which is certainly not the good way to handle such a disaster), but Europe was ahead of the USA (for once...) and a good share of the world when it comes to idiocracy. Italy had Berlusconi and liked it enough to put him back in charge numerous times, we had Sarkozy (and don't start me off on our current egotist, nor the previous), Central Europe is a mess, and Britain made what it could to catch up (which is why the die-hard Brexiters shouldn't be that proud : what they took for the expression of a British distinctive identity was just being late rallying world wide stupidity).
As my brother said : "I've got the brain of a four year old. I'll bet he was glad to be rid of it".

Option or Prime
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Option or Prime »

Have to say I was amazed at the restraint of the Openreach engineer, to say they will be responsible for killing their parents with the phrase. "bye bye mama" is deplorable.
I notice she doesn't show her face!
Incredibly she sounds educated and actually believes what she is saying. I would have told her to go and speak to the supervisor way before that.
Out of interest would you hold a conversation with someone in the street holding a camera at you? Who owns the copyright to that video BTW?

pc27b
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by pc27b »

"" but my point of view is that stupidity is dispatched equally around the word, just like other human qualities. The way they are expressed being a matter of culture and history, the "foreign" stupidity may appear more laughable, thick, violent, etc. than our "national" stupity, just because it's not the one we're used too. ""

yep

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minchy
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by minchy »

Option or Prime wrote:Have to say I was amazed at the restraint of the Openreach engineer, to say they will be responsible for killing their parents with the phrase. "bye bye mama" is deplorable.
I notice she doesn't show her face!
Incredibly she sounds educated and actually believes what she is saying. I would have told her to go and speak to the supervisor way before that.
Out of interest would you hold a conversation with someone in the street holding a camera at you? Who owns the copyright to that video BTW?
I was amazed at the whole video!

She was kind of articulate but was clearly educated to a high level in the same school as those anti-vax nut-jobs!!!

She's so hypocritical and didn't even realise it, that's what really grinds my gears about people like this. She wanted a few views online and wanted to make her point clear, whilst going completely against the advice the UK government has been giving and she was trying to make. Last time I checked, filming a conversation with someone isn't a form of exercise or essential shopping! Not to mention there are lots of workers other than NHS staff who have to continue working during this time.

She's probably one of the people who thought it would be ok to go to a crowded London park for a picnic yesterday. It's really simple (and to the best of my knowledge, the correct) advice to follow - stay the f**k at home!
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kleefton
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by kleefton »

Option or Prime wrote:Have to say I was amazed at the restraint of the Openreach engineer, to say they will be responsible for killing their parents with the phrase. "bye bye mama" is deplorable.
I notice she doesn't show her face!
Incredibly she sounds educated and actually believes what she is saying. I would have told her to go and speak to the supervisor way before that.
Out of interest would you hold a conversation with someone in the street holding a camera at you? Who owns the copyright to that video BTW?

That's what I don't understand watching the video. I don't think many people would take someone filming them like that well. I myself would probably would have asked her why are you filming us?

Anyway, very strange. This world just keeps getting stranger and stranger. This virus I have a feeling no one really understands it fully yet and honestly I just do not see an end game. It is very hard and very sad times.

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tootsie323
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by tootsie323 »

Just had to post a few quotes from that conversation between the lady behind the camera and the engineer, from her mouth:
- You’re laying 5G… You know that kills people.
- You know when they turn that on it’s going to kill everyone and that’s why they’re building the hospitals.
- Do you have parents...? When they turn that switch on, bye bye Mama… Are they paying you well enough to kill her?
- Everyone will be dead… We’ll all be in hospital on breathing apparatus.
- Why do you think they’re building 25000 concentration camps of death (in the London Excel)?
Too flabbergasted even to laugh at it.
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Siao7
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Siao7 »

kleefton wrote:
Option or Prime wrote:Have to say I was amazed at the restraint of the Openreach engineer, to say they will be responsible for killing their parents with the phrase. "bye bye mama" is deplorable.
I notice she doesn't show her face!
Incredibly she sounds educated and actually believes what she is saying. I would have told her to go and speak to the supervisor way before that.
Out of interest would you hold a conversation with someone in the street holding a camera at you? Who owns the copyright to that video BTW?

That's what I don't understand watching the video. I don't think many people would take someone filming them like that well. I myself would probably would have asked her why are you filming us?

Anyway, very strange. This world just keeps getting stranger and stranger. This virus I have a feeling no one really understands it fully yet and honestly I just do not see an end game. It is very hard and very sad times.
I think the guys working were just too polite, he seems almost camera shy and surprised by the bombardment of questions. I think that she did have a point about the 2m distancing etc. as the conversation starter, but it almost feels like she was making fun of the whole thing after that point, it is so stupid that it could have been a prank. Kudos to the guys for not telling her to f* off, but were polite and went on with it.

j man
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by j man »

tootsie323 wrote:Just had to post a few quotes from that conversation between the lady behind the camera and the engineer, from her mouth:
- You’re laying 5G… You know that kills people.
- You know when they turn that on it’s going to kill everyone and that’s why they’re building the hospitals.
- Do you have parents...? When they turn that switch on, bye bye Mama… Are they paying you well enough to kill her?
- Everyone will be dead… We’ll all be in hospital on breathing apparatus.
- Why do you think they’re building 25000 concentration camps of death (in the London Excel)?
Too flabbergasted even to laugh at it.
It shows the power of misinformation on the Internet. In the past when someone had a stupid thought or idea they'd get laughed at. Now they have a medium that not only allows them to broadcast that idea to the entire world, it also has algorithms that actively tries to connect them to other like-minded idiots, creating an echo chamber where everyone agrees with them and re-enforces their belief that they're right. So now you have small groups of people who ardently believe stuff like the Earth being flat, vaccines being harmful, aeroplanes spraying the population with noxious chemicals and the Pyramids being built by aliens. The same forces have also poisoned politics, creating ever more extreme and polarised points of view on both sides of the political spectrum.

I don't know what the solution is. I don't agree with censoring the Internet, but it's reaching the point where it's having a real detrimental effect on our society.

Zazu
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Zazu »

It's scary how thick people

If you go on twitter it's not the odd crank, there's hordes of people who think 5g is causing coranvirus. Have people with millions of followers linking to conspiracy theory videos on YouTube and the mob comes out saying they have to destroy the masts

Siao7
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Siao7 »

After Spain and Italy, now the US has broken the 10,000 barrier in the death count, while France is not far behind. Also, the UK prime minister Boris is now in Intensive Care, although reportedly just for precaution.

In other funny news, New Zealand's health minister himself broke the quarantine rules and took his family to the beach. He called himself an idiot and apologised, so much for leading by example!

Harpo
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Harpo »

j man wrote: It shows the power of misinformation on the Internet. In the past when someone had a stupid thought or idea they'd get laughed at. Now they have a medium that not only allows them to broadcast that idea to the entire world, it also has algorithms that actively tries to connect them to other like-minded idiots, creating an echo chamber where everyone agrees with them and re-enforces their belief that they're right. So now you have small groups of people who ardently believe stuff like the Earth being flat, vaccines being harmful, aeroplanes spraying the population with noxious chemicals and the Pyramids being built by aliens. The same forces have also poisoned politics, creating ever more extreme and polarised points of view on both sides of the political spectrum.

I don't know what the solution is. I don't agree with censoring the Internet, but it's reaching the point where it's having a real detrimental effect on our society.
What do I learn ? How the earth is not flat ? How do you think Australians and emperor penguins can stand or walk ? If they really were on the other side of the earth, they would fall head first into the Great Nowhere !
As for the Pyramids, according to the Nobel prized scientist Churchill, they were built by workers who, already then, had a tendency to do less and less work. He didn't say they were not alien workers.


Ah ! Someone tells me Churchill's Nobel prize is not a science one... All the more reason not to rule out an alien involvement.
As my brother said : "I've got the brain of a four year old. I'll bet he was glad to be rid of it".

SteveW
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by SteveW »

Siao7 wrote: In other funny news, New Zealand's health minister himself broke the quarantine rules and took his family to the beach. He called himself an idiot and apologised, so much for leading by example!
What is it with these so-called health experts?

The Scottish Chief Medical Officer has had to resign after it was discovered that she had been travelling 40 miles to her "holiday home" for two consecutive weekends - after telling everyone else to STAY AT HOME!

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Jezza13
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Jezza13 »

j man wrote:
tootsie323 wrote:Just had to post a few quotes from that conversation between the lady behind the camera and the engineer, from her mouth:
- You’re laying 5G… You know that kills people.
- You know when they turn that on it’s going to kill everyone and that’s why they’re building the hospitals.
- Do you have parents...? When they turn that switch on, bye bye Mama… Are they paying you well enough to kill her?
- Everyone will be dead… We’ll all be in hospital on breathing apparatus.
- Why do you think they’re building 25000 concentration camps of death (in the London Excel)?
Too flabbergasted even to laugh at it.
It shows the power of misinformation on the Internet. In the past when someone had a stupid thought or idea they'd get laughed at. Now they have a medium that not only allows them to broadcast that idea to the entire world, it also has algorithms that actively tries to connect them to other like-minded idiots, creating an echo chamber where everyone agrees with them and re-enforces their belief that they're right. So now you have small groups of people who ardently believe stuff like the Earth being flat, vaccines being harmful, aeroplanes spraying the population with noxious chemicals and the Pyramids being built by aliens. The same forces have also poisoned politics, creating ever more extreme and polarised points of view on both sides of the political spectrum.

I don't know what the solution is. I don't agree with censoring the Internet, but it's reaching the point where it's having a real detrimental effect on our society.
I think sadly it's the price we'll pay for wanting the reap the benefits, if that's the right word, of modern technology.
Personally i'm 100% against the censorship of speech in any form, with the exception speech that directly call's for acts of violence or illegal activity. I think once we start condoning the removal of content off internet platforms, no matter how crackpot we all may think it is, then we're effectively allowing places like You Tube & Google, through which i'd say most of the global population extract their news & information from, to say " You don't think like we want you to think or say what we want you to say, therefore there is no place for you here", & to me, if society allows that to happen it sets us down a very, very dangerous path.
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Siao7
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Siao7 »

Jezza13 wrote:
j man wrote:
tootsie323 wrote:Just had to post a few quotes from that conversation between the lady behind the camera and the engineer, from her mouth:
- You’re laying 5G… You know that kills people.
- You know when they turn that on it’s going to kill everyone and that’s why they’re building the hospitals.
- Do you have parents...? When they turn that switch on, bye bye Mama… Are they paying you well enough to kill her?
- Everyone will be dead… We’ll all be in hospital on breathing apparatus.
- Why do you think they’re building 25000 concentration camps of death (in the London Excel)?
Too flabbergasted even to laugh at it.
It shows the power of misinformation on the Internet. In the past when someone had a stupid thought or idea they'd get laughed at. Now they have a medium that not only allows them to broadcast that idea to the entire world, it also has algorithms that actively tries to connect them to other like-minded idiots, creating an echo chamber where everyone agrees with them and re-enforces their belief that they're right. So now you have small groups of people who ardently believe stuff like the Earth being flat, vaccines being harmful, aeroplanes spraying the population with noxious chemicals and the Pyramids being built by aliens. The same forces have also poisoned politics, creating ever more extreme and polarised points of view on both sides of the political spectrum.

I don't know what the solution is. I don't agree with censoring the Internet, but it's reaching the point where it's having a real detrimental effect on our society.
I think sadly it's the price we'll pay for wanting the reap the benefits, if that's the right word, of modern technology.
Personally i'm 100% against the censorship of speech in any form, with the exception speech that directly call's for acts of violence or illegal activity. I think once we start condoning the removal of content off internet platforms, no matter how crackpot we all may think it is, then we're effectively allowing places like You Tube & Google, through which i'd say most of the global population extract their news & information from, to say " You don't think like we want you to think or say what we want you to say, therefore there is no place for you here", & to me, if society allows that to happen it sets us down a very, very dangerous path.
Absolutely, at least now you have the opportunity to ignore the loonies and chose where you get informed from, reputable news sites and not www.AliensbecauseAliens.com (no relation to our Alien!)

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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by SteveW »

I am unsure if I heard it correctly, as I was in a Teams meeting (whilst reading PF1, how professional of me :lol: ) and I had the radio on quietly in the background.....

But I think I heard on the news that youtube have removed videos relating to 5G and coronavirus........

Just thought I'd mention it given the posts above about freedom of speech etc.

I do worry that what we are going through in the world right now, will give governments too much authority over things like this going forward.

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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by pokerman »

Alienturnedhuman wrote:
pc27b wrote:there are too many conspiracy theories for me to bother wasting time on right now. heck, some are claiming 5g causes coronavirus ?? having said that, there isn't much i would put past governments and greedy corporations doing to retain/get more power, or get more money.
i think the time to deal with that, is after we get though the next few months. but our president here won't even lock down all the states or recommend masks in public
People in the UK are burning down 5G masts, a woman angrily confronted some broadband engineers telling them they were responsible for installing the equipment that was killing people, making everyone sick causing the lockdown and that the new hospital in London was actually a death camp for people infected with 5G radiation.
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/ ... nspiracies

When i lived in the UK, everyone would laugh at all the stories coming out of America, how stupid Americans are for all the stupid stuff you hear going on in there. Since moving out of the UK and now reading about it from an international perspective on international news sites (and my web browser being sent the international versions of the UK media) I've learned that for most other countries, the country they point and laugh at isn't the USA, it's Britain. Britain really is the laughing stock of the world right now. Although the USA is often second...


[/color]
I only have to look at Brexit to see how stupid some of us in the UK are.
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by pokerman »

Siao7 wrote:After Spain and Italy, now the US has broken the 10,000 barrier in the death count, while France is not far behind. Also, the UK prime minister Boris is now in Intensive Care, although reportedly just for precaution.

In other funny news, New Zealand's health minister himself broke the quarantine rules and took his family to the beach. He called himself an idiot and apologised, so much for leading by example!
Whilst China supposedly only has 3,300 deaths. :lol:

The Scottish health minister did similar, she seemingly was forced into resigning her position.
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j man
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by j man »

SteveW wrote:I am unsure if I heard it correctly, as I was in a Teams meeting (whilst reading PF1, how professional of me :lol: ) and I had the radio on quietly in the background.....

But I think I heard on the news that youtube have removed videos relating to 5G and coronavirus........

Just thought I'd mention it given the posts above about freedom of speech etc.

I do worry that what we are going through in the world right now, will give governments too much authority over things like this going forward.
Yes I saw this as well... as much as I don't want that sort of stupidity being spread around the general public I'm not sure I agree with the move that's been made here because of the precedent that it sets. I totally agree with Jezza's point above, free speech is an important right to maintain and I would only draw the line at actively inciting violence against others, and it certainly should not be up to the likes of YouTube and Google, who are not accountable to the general public, to decide what information is acceptable for me to consume.

As I said, I don't see a solution here without resorting to a level of authoritarianism that I am not comfortable with. So unfortunately maybe we do just have to leave things as they are and decide that the benefits outweigh the downsides of having a global information network where ideas can be so freely exchanged.

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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by mikeyg123 »

j man wrote:
SteveW wrote:I am unsure if I heard it correctly, as I was in a Teams meeting (whilst reading PF1, how professional of me :lol: ) and I had the radio on quietly in the background.....

But I think I heard on the news that youtube have removed videos relating to 5G and coronavirus........

Just thought I'd mention it given the posts above about freedom of speech etc.

I do worry that what we are going through in the world right now, will give governments too much authority over things like this going forward.
Yes I saw this as well... as much as I don't want that sort of stupidity being spread around the general public I'm not sure I agree with the move that's been made here because of the precedent that it sets. I totally agree with Jezza's point above, free speech is an important right to maintain and I would only draw the line at actively inciting violence against others, and it certainly should not be up to the likes of YouTube and Google, who are not accountable to the general public, to decide what information is acceptable for me to consume.

As I said, I don't see a solution here without resorting to a level of authoritarianism that I am not comfortable with. So unfortunately maybe we do just have to leave things as they are and decide that the benefits outweigh the downsides of having a global information network where ideas can be so freely exchanged.
Yes it makes me uncomfortable to. Sometimes uncomfortable ideas are correct. We can't allow ourselves to sleep walk into a situation where something like Darwinism would be censored if first theorised in 2020.

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Alienturnedhuman
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Re: Official Coronavirus Discussion thread

Post by Alienturnedhuman »

Wait, Google and Facebook are not the government, they are private companies and their servers are the ones being used to store the videos and their infrastructure and resources used to share the videos. It is entirely up to them what content they want to allow on their platforms. You can't force the Daily Mail to publish an article on how great Jeremy Corbyn is, or Fox News on how Obama wasn't all that bad. If you don't agree with their editorial policy then don't buy the paper, or in the case of YouTube, don't use their service.

Google and Facebook are funded through advertisers and the advertisers pull out when stupid content like this is not clamped down on. It happened before when terrorists were uploading videos and they were automatically getting Mercedes and Dyson adverts on them. We'd expect them to pull down terrorist videos even though that is censorship. Advocating that people destroy 5G towers falls into the same category.

Besides, coronavirus stuff isn't automatically getting pulled, most of it is there it's just demonetised - YouTube has a terms and conditions and they have the right to pull any video they wish, but especially ones that violate their terms of service. And most of these tin foil hat ones or any that make suggestions, overt or implicit, to commit vandalism will definitely be in violation.

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