2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Forum rules
Please read the forum rules
Post Reply
mikeyg123
Posts: 17897
Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2012 4:13 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by mikeyg123 »

Invade wrote:They are showing replays of the Hamilton-Albon incident. I believe Hamilton should be given a penalty for an incident which is borderline a racing incident.
You don't think Albon should have given Hamilton room once he got alongside?

mikeyg123
Posts: 17897
Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2012 4:13 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by mikeyg123 »

Interesting that the late stop was Hamilton's call.

User avatar
Flash2k11
Posts: 2932
Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2005 2:06 pm
Location: England
Contact:

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by Flash2k11 »

When you leave that much room, you are a party to what follows. Lewis has admitted fault, but Albon has admitted on Sky that he didn't know where Lewis was when he turned in. Racing incident all day long, and a good, hard lesson for Albon to learn.... Leave a gap, and the real beasts up front will go for it.
2018 Pick 10 Champion

mikeyg123
Posts: 17897
Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2012 4:13 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by mikeyg123 »

Does Mattia have the balls to blame Vettel? My guess is no.

Please one of the pundits ask him what he thinks Leclerc did wrong?

User avatar
bourbon19
Posts: 2222
Joined: Tue Mar 09, 2010 6:31 am

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by bourbon19 »

Invade wrote:
bourbon19 wrote:
Invade wrote:Tough times to be a Vettel fan TBH, generally speaking. But hey, he wins races and most of the grid doesn't.
Tough times to be a Brundle fan, generally speaking. But hey, he gets most the speaking gigs whereas most of the race journos don't.
Someday I'll make a point on these threads and it will be understood. Someday.
I'm somewhat confused by this response? But okie dokie.
I am sure. You are speaking about Vettel and LeClerc, and I was speaking about the commentators, upset at them.

Seb was ahead after passing on the outside in turn 3 and naturally he was going to pull ahead of Charles along the straight, to the left. But for some reason, this is a completely unexpected move. Whereas Hamilton spearing Albon of the track is quite expected and usual, despite Hamilton accepting his own error. They are still sitting there saying it is more Albon's fault that his. I find the commentary ridiculous. Truly that is my only opinion here.

As to the incident, I accept people calling it for Seb or Charles, I will call it a race incident. Ferrari lost.
Last edited by bourbon19 on Sun Nov 17, 2019 7:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Invade
Posts: 3082
Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2015 9:33 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by Invade »

mikeyg123 wrote:
Invade wrote:They are showing replays of the Hamilton-Albon incident. I believe Hamilton should be given a penalty for an incident which is borderline a racing incident.
You don't think Albon should have given Hamilton room once he got alongside?

Well, I do. I think it was clumsy from Albon and the gap was very inviting indeed and you can hear from Albon's reaction in the interview just now with Sky that he had also taken a potential risk and felt the potential collision coming in slow motion. It's pretty much a racing incident, I suppose. Very curious to see what will happen - Hamilton once again just put the blame on himself in his interview with Sky.

Asphalt_World
Posts: 4996
Joined: Thu May 12, 2011 6:08 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by Asphalt_World »

mikeyg123 wrote:Does Mattia have the balls to blame Vettel? My guess is no.

Please one of the pundits ask him what he thinks Leclerc did wrong?
He's a team boss and gains nothing for the team by coming out a blaming a driver. We may want to hear it, but it causes nothing but issues within his team. It's a pointless exercise for him.
Instagram @simply_italian_cars

sidders
Posts: 113
Joined: Sun Oct 14, 2012 11:52 am

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by sidders »

Invade wrote:They are showing replays of the Hamilton-Albon incident. I believe Hamilton should be given a penalty for an incident which is borderline a racing incident.
I've just seen it again and not so sure now. Albon left room which Lewis went for and then turned in. I'm edging towards racing incident

mikeyg123
Posts: 17897
Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2012 4:13 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by mikeyg123 »

bourbon19 wrote:
Invade wrote:
bourbon19 wrote:
Invade wrote:Tough times to be a Vettel fan TBH, generally speaking. But hey, he wins races and most of the grid doesn't.
Tough times to be a Brundle fan, generally speaking. But hey, he gets most the speaking gigs whereas most of the race journos don't.
Someday I'll make a point on these threads and it will be understood. Someday.
I'm somewhat confused by this response? But okie dokie.
I am sure. You are speaking about Vettel and LeClerc, and I was speaking about the commentators, upset at them.

Seb was ahead after passing on the outside in turn 3 and naturally he was going to pull of Charles along the straight. But for some reason, this is a completely unexpected move. Whereas Hamilton spearing Albon of the track is quite expected and usual, despite Hamilton accepting his own error. They are still sitting there saying it is more Albon's fault that his. I find the commentary ridiculous. Truly that is my only opinion here.

As to the incident, I accept people calling it for Seb or Charles, I will call it a race incident. Ferrari lost.
What? You didn't see Vettel turn left into Leclerc half way down the straight?

mikeyg123
Posts: 17897
Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2012 4:13 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by mikeyg123 »

Asphalt_World wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:Does Mattia have the balls to blame Vettel? My guess is no.

Please one of the pundits ask him what he thinks Leclerc did wrong?
He's a team boss and gains nothing for the team by coming out a blaming a driver. We may want to hear it, but it causes nothing but issues within his team. It's a pointless exercise for him.
Does it? If you were Leclerc would you not be tiddled at being partially blamed for something that is not your fault? Blaming both when one is clearly at fault I would think is more damaging. If I was Leclerc hearing that I would be spitting tacks.

sandman1347
Posts: 6977
Joined: Sun May 25, 2008 7:55 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by sandman1347 »

bourbon19 wrote:
Invade wrote:
bourbon19 wrote:
Invade wrote:Tough times to be a Vettel fan TBH, generally speaking. But hey, he wins races and most of the grid doesn't.
Tough times to be a Brundle fan, generally speaking. But hey, he gets most the speaking gigs whereas most of the race journos don't.
Someday I'll make a point on these threads and it will be understood. Someday.
I'm somewhat confused by this response? But okie dokie.
I am sure. You are speaking about Vettel and LeClerc, and I was speaking about the commentators, upset at them.

Seb was ahead after passing on the outside in turn 3 and naturally he was going to pull ahead of Charles along the straight, to the left. But for some reason, this is a completely unexpected move. Whereas Hamilton spearing Albon of the track is quite expected and usual, despite Hamilton accepting his own error. They are still sitting there saying it is more Albon's fault that his. I find the commentary ridiculous. Truly that is my only opinion here.

As to the incident, I accept people calling it for Seb or Charles, I will call it a race incident. Ferrari lost.
How can anyone claim that it's Charles's fault? He didn't move towards Seb at all and he in fact moved to the left to try to avoid Seb when Seb moved across him.

sidders
Posts: 113
Joined: Sun Oct 14, 2012 11:52 am

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by sidders »

mikeyg123 wrote:Does Mattia have the balls to blame Vettel? My guess is no.

Please one of the pundits ask him what he thinks Leclerc did wrong?
He might do in private but don't think he would in public.

User avatar
Invade
Posts: 3082
Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2015 9:33 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by Invade »

bourbon19 wrote:
Invade wrote:
bourbon19 wrote:
Invade wrote:Tough times to be a Vettel fan TBH, generally speaking. But hey, he wins races and most of the grid doesn't.
Tough times to be a Brundle fan, generally speaking. But hey, he gets most the speaking gigs whereas most of the race journos don't.
Someday I'll make a point on these threads and it will be understood. Someday.
I'm somewhat confused by this response? But okie dokie.
I am sure. You are speaking about Vettel and LeClerc, and I was speaking about the commentators, upset at them.

Seb was ahead after passing on the outside in turn 3 and naturally he was going to pull ahead of Charles along the straight, to the left. But for some reason, this is a completely unexpected move. Whereas Hamilton spearing Albon of the track is quite expected and usual, despite Hamilton accepting his own error. They are still sitting there saying it is more Albon's fault that his. I find the commentary ridiculous. Truly that is my only opinion here.

As to the incident, I accept people calling it for Seb or Charles, I will call it a race incident. Ferrari lost.
No I'm speaking about Vettel generally and his form over the last couple of seasons. But yeah I can see you are frustrated by the Sky commentary team. I think calling the Ferrari collision a racing incident is fine but obviously when such a catastrophic outcome occurs it's quite natural to try to come to a conclusion on who was more to blame. I feel like Vettel is way too edgy with the sort of room he gives other drivers on the track.

Asphalt_World
Posts: 4996
Joined: Thu May 12, 2011 6:08 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by Asphalt_World »

mikeyg123 wrote:
Asphalt_World wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:Does Mattia have the balls to blame Vettel? My guess is no.

Please one of the pundits ask him what he thinks Leclerc did wrong?
He's a team boss and gains nothing for the team by coming out a blaming a driver. We may want to hear it, but it causes nothing but issues within his team. It's a pointless exercise for him.
Does it? If you were Leclerc would you not be tiddled at being partially blamed for something that is not your fault? Blaming both when one is clearly at fault I would think is more damaging. If I was Leclerc hearing that I would be spitting tacks.
So you think a team boss of Ferrari should announce his opinion on the incident for you, sitting at home watching TV, rather than wait, watch the incident with the team management and drivers before making a call for the team and then the watching public?
Instagram @simply_italian_cars

cmberry20
Posts: 269
Joined: Thu Nov 22, 2012 7:06 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by cmberry20 »

On the plus side, Vettels car control must be getting better - he didn't spin!

mikeyg123
Posts: 17897
Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2012 4:13 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by mikeyg123 »

Compare the difference in reaction of Hamilton after the Albon crash and Vettel after the Lecelrc crash.

User avatar
Clarky
Posts: 4588
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 4:09 pm
Location: LONDON...!

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by Clarky »

For such a little touch the damage to both Ferrari's was huge.

Asphalt_World
Posts: 4996
Joined: Thu May 12, 2011 6:08 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by Asphalt_World »

Can we just confirm that Vettel didn't make the pass in T3 but rather tried to pass on the straight down to T4? I'm confused by the point that he made the pass in T3.
Instagram @simply_italian_cars

-K-
Posts: 90
Joined: Sun Aug 18, 2019 11:00 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by -K- »

I’m also thinking racing incident but that Hamilton has invited them to give him a penalty just like Max did (though Max’s failure to slow was a slam dunk for me; hilarious to see him accuse Lewis of the same this race.)

Everyone feels bad for Alex and I think Lewis let that come across too much there. Don’t want Sainz to not celebrate his first podium. Leclerc could have been handed his first win after the race but wasn’t.

Did Merc not pit Lewis at the first SC because they didn’t expect it to be out for so long?

Might Seb be edging close to a race ban again courtesy of totting the superlicence points? He is on 7 already and the next ones don’t come off until June.
Last edited by -K- on Sun Nov 17, 2019 7:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Clarky
Posts: 4588
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 4:09 pm
Location: LONDON...!

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by Clarky »

Mercedes had a strategy nightmare today.

Asphalt_World
Posts: 4996
Joined: Thu May 12, 2011 6:08 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by Asphalt_World »

mikeyg123 wrote:Compare the difference in reaction of Hamilton after the Albon crash and Vettel after the Lecelrc crash.
Compare the difference in situation from a driver crowned this years WDC with that of a driver trying to make sure he gets a proper shout next year against a new, possible star driver.
Instagram @simply_italian_cars

mikeyg123
Posts: 17897
Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2012 4:13 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by mikeyg123 »

I just want to note the fantastic driving between Gasly and Hamilton coming down to the chequered flags. Wheels overlapping at 180MPH whilst turning. That could have been a plane crash.

mikeyg123
Posts: 17897
Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2012 4:13 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by mikeyg123 »

Clarky wrote:Mercedes had a strategy nightmare today.
I don't know. I think they were trying to win in a car not quite faster enough to win so they were making low percentage calls.

User avatar
Invade
Posts: 3082
Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2015 9:33 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by Invade »

mikeyg123 wrote:I just want to note the fantastic driving between Gasly and Hamilton coming down to the chequered flags. Wheels overlapping at 180MPH whilst turning. That could have been a plane crash.

It was absolutely brilliant to watch. On the whole, this race was epic. That first safety car made us all so mad though.
mikeyg123 wrote:
Clarky wrote:Mercedes had a strategy nightmare today.
I don't know. I think they were trying to win in a car not quite faster enough to win so they were making low percentage calls.

I agree, and think we are generally being too hard on their calls today. Hamilton reckons it would have been extremely difficult to hold off those behind on even older mediums anyway, and that he'd have probably ended up in the same position. It was all or nothing for Mercedes today. They threw almost everything at it. I guess what they didn't do is somehow try to use Bottas to help Hamilton?

JN23
Posts: 2437
Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2016 11:14 am

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by JN23 »

Clarky wrote:Mercedes had a strategy nightmare today.
Not sure I’d call it a nightmare.

The Bottas strategy was weird.

Doing the opposite of verstappen at the first safety car was their best chance of winning at that point and I think Hamilton said the pit stop at the second SC was his call. Not great but not a disaster, they did try and undercut Verstappen twice and were successful once.

sandman1347
Posts: 6977
Joined: Sun May 25, 2008 7:55 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by sandman1347 »

JN23 wrote:
Clarky wrote:Mercedes had a strategy nightmare today.
Not sure I’d call it a nightmare.

The Bottas strategy was weird.

Doing the opposite of verstappen at the first safety car was their best chance of winning at that point and I think Hamilton said the pit stop at the second SC was his call. Not great but not a disaster, they did try and undercut Verstappen twice and were successful once.
It doesn't really matter anyway does it? They've got both titles done and dusted. I think they were just trying to find a way to win in a race where Red Bull had their number.

User avatar
Clarky
Posts: 4588
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 4:09 pm
Location: LONDON...!

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by Clarky »

JN23 wrote:
Clarky wrote:Mercedes had a strategy nightmare today.
Not sure I’d call it a nightmare.

The Bottas strategy was weird.

Doing the opposite of verstappen at the first safety car was their best chance of winning at that point and I think Hamilton said the pit stop at the second SC was his call. Not great but not a disaster, they did try and undercut Verstappen twice and were successful once.
Hamilton keeping Vestappen behind was never going to happen.

User avatar
Flash2k11
Posts: 2932
Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2005 2:06 pm
Location: England
Contact:

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by Flash2k11 »

sandman1347 wrote:
JN23 wrote:
Clarky wrote:Mercedes had a strategy nightmare today.
Not sure I’d call it a nightmare.

The Bottas strategy was weird.

Doing the opposite of verstappen at the first safety car was their best chance of winning at that point and I think Hamilton said the pit stop at the second SC was his call. Not great but not a disaster, they did try and undercut Verstappen twice and were successful once.
It doesn't really matter anyway does it? They've got both titles done and dusted. I think they were just trying to find a way to win in a race where Red Bull had their number.
This, all day long. When you've already won the game, you can roll the dice as often and as hard as you like. Probably the only reason they let Bottas cook his own engine too, if that was in the heat of a title fight, he would have been told to call it off long before it got to that point.
2018 Pick 10 Champion

cmberry20
Posts: 269
Joined: Thu Nov 22, 2012 7:06 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by cmberry20 »

No one gonna mention the red elephant in the room? Ferraris race pace was very meh. Before the first safety car, they were no where. Looks like they were missing something, like a bit of fuel!!

TheGiantHogweed
Posts: 2855
Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2014 10:15 am

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by TheGiantHogweed »

mikeyg123 wrote:I just want to note the fantastic driving between Gasly and Hamilton coming down to the chequered flags. Wheels overlapping at 180MPH whilst turning. That could have been a plane crash.
I actually think it was a bit poor of hamilton getting that close to gasly when his wing was flapping around like that. Not safe when your wing is in that state IMO. I think with this included too that hamilton should get some sort of penalty. That could have gone wrong like it did for leclerc in Japan - which he got a penalty for. Something could have flown off his car and hit those behind. he should have not gone as quick.
Last edited by TheGiantHogweed on Sun Nov 17, 2019 7:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
SmoothRide
Posts: 902
Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2008 8:56 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by SmoothRide »

Regarding the Ferrari crash, it has to be on Vettel. He moved across. I've got to say though that the contact was very slight and it's unfortunate for those involved that it resulted in so much damage. Several drivers made moves today that easily could have resulted in crashes and it was mostly down to luck that they didn't happen.

I don't think Hamilton is particularly to blame for spinning Albon although it was a late move and it's not surprising that Albon didn't know he has a car on his inside. I did notice that Lewis was a bit hasty today. When he managed to undercut Max at the first round of stops, he overtook Leclerc a corner too early so he had no DRS on the long straight. Max overtook the Ferrari in the last corner and he had DRS for a key overtake.

User avatar
bourbon19
Posts: 2222
Joined: Tue Mar 09, 2010 6:31 am

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by bourbon19 »

mikeyg123 wrote:
bourbon19 wrote:
Invade wrote:
bourbon19 wrote:
Invade wrote:Tough times to be a Vettel fan TBH, generally speaking. But hey, he wins races and most of the grid doesn't.
Tough times to be a Brundle fan, generally speaking. But hey, he gets most the speaking gigs whereas most of the race journos don't.
Someday I'll make a point on these threads and it will be understood. Someday.
I'm somewhat confused by this response? But okie dokie.
I am sure. You are speaking about Vettel and LeClerc, and I was speaking about the commentators, upset at them.

Seb was ahead after passing on the outside in turn 3 and naturally he was going to pull of Charles along the straight. But for some reason, this is a completely unexpected move. Whereas Hamilton spearing Albon of the track is quite expected and usual, despite Hamilton accepting his own error. They are still sitting there saying it is more Albon's fault that his. I find the commentary ridiculous. Truly that is my only opinion here.

As to the incident, I accept people calling it for Seb or Charles, I will call it a race incident. Ferrari lost.
What? You didn't see Vettel turn left into Leclerc half way down the straight?
I will discuss the incident with you - I was not discussing the incident above, I was discussing the commentating.


As I see it, Charles had not given up the fight. After Vettel passed him on the outside of turn 3, and came out ahead on the subsequent straight, Charles had no intention of letting Vettel cover him off. He stayed to the middle - right of the track, knowing that Seb was planning to cover him off. When Seb made his move, Charles anticipated this - knowing exactly what Seb was going to try to do and purposely gave no quarter at all, figuring like Bottas, Seb would buck. But Seb, figuring it was his teammate, did not expect this behavior. He believed Charles would allow him to cover him off considering how far ahead he was (incident was Seb's rear right with Charles front left), and then come back along the straight with DRS and make a battle of it. But Charles is not mature enough for that yet. Like Verstappen of old, he still has the mindset of a rookie and makes poor decisions. He's getting better, but until he does, this is going to happen. Vettel has to recognize his teammate's immaturity and make concessions for this when they go wheel to wheel. Thus, I do lay blame with both. Avoidable, but since both are to blame, race incident. This is what Mattias said as well - you have to see this from the point of view of both drivers, so I agree with him on this.
Last edited by bourbon19 on Sun Nov 17, 2019 7:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

JN23
Posts: 2437
Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2016 11:14 am

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by JN23 »

sandman1347 wrote:
JN23 wrote:
Clarky wrote:Mercedes had a strategy nightmare today.
Not sure I’d call it a nightmare.

The Bottas strategy was weird.

Doing the opposite of verstappen at the first safety car was their best chance of winning at that point and I think Hamilton said the pit stop at the second SC was his call. Not great but not a disaster, they did try and undercut Verstappen twice and were successful once.
It doesn't really matter anyway does it? They've got both titles done and dusted. I think they were just trying to find a way to win in a race where Red Bull had their number.
Agreed. Not sure they'd have made either of the decisions they did at the safety car if the titles weren't done.

Asphalt_World
Posts: 4996
Joined: Thu May 12, 2011 6:08 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by Asphalt_World »

The speed advantage Seb had over Charles along that straight, if he'd have kept it straight for another half a second or so, he'd have cleared Charles cleanly and not needed to move across at all.
Instagram @simply_italian_cars

User avatar
Flash2k11
Posts: 2932
Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2005 2:06 pm
Location: England
Contact:

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by Flash2k11 »

bourbon19 wrote: I will discuss the incident with you - I was not discussing the incident above, I was discussing the commentating.


As I see it, Charles had not given up the fight. After Vettel passed him on the outside of turn 3, and came out ahead on the subsequent straight, Charles had no intention of letting Vettel cover him off. He stayed to the middle - right of the track, knowing that Seb was planning to cover him off. When Seb made his move, Charles anticipated this - knowing exactly what Seb was going to try to do and purposely gave no quarter at all, figuring like Bottas, Seb would buck. But Seb, figuring it was his teammate, did not expect this behavior. He believed Charles would allow him to cover him off considering how far ahead he was (incident was Seb's rear right with Charles front left), and then come back along the straight with DRS and make a battle of it. But Charles is not mature enough for that yet. Like Verstappen of old, he still has the mindset of a rookie and makes poor decisions. He's getting better, but until he does, this is going to happen. Vettel has to recognize his teammate's immaturity and make concessions for this when they go wheel to wheel. Thus, I do lay blame with both. Avoidable, but since both are to blame, race incident. This is what Mattias said as well - you have to see this from the point of view of both drivers, so I agree with him on this.
No. Vettel moved over early and wrecked the pair of them, the only poor mindset here is the mindset of the 'veteran' who has yet again highlighted his weakness when it comes to spatial awareness.
2018 Pick 10 Champion

User avatar
Clarky
Posts: 4588
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 4:09 pm
Location: LONDON...!

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by Clarky »

bourbon19 wrote: I will discuss the incident with you - I was not discussing the incident above, I was discussing the commentating.


As I see it, Charles had not given up the fight. After Vettel passed him on the outside of turn 3, and came out ahead on the subsequent straight, Charles had no intention of letting Vettel cover him off. He stayed to the middle - right of the track, knowing that Seb was planning to cover him off. When Seb made his move, Charles anticipated this - knowing exactly what Seb was going to try to do and purposely gave no quarter at all, figuring like Bottas, Seb would buck. But Seb, figuring it was his teammate, did not expect this behavior. He believed Charles would allow him to cover him off considering how far ahead he was (incident was Seb's rear right with Charles front left), and then come back along the straight with DRS and make a battle of it. But Charles is not mature enough for that yet. Like Verstappen of old, he still has the mindset of a rookie and makes poor decisions. He's getting better, but until he does, this is going to happen. Vettel has to recognize his teammate's immaturity and make concessions for this when they go wheel to wheel. Thus, I do lay blame with both. Avoidable, but since both are to blame, race incident. This is what Mattias said as well - you have to see this from the point of view of both drivers, so I agree with him on this.
WOW...just...WOW!!!

cmberry20
Posts: 269
Joined: Thu Nov 22, 2012 7:06 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by cmberry20 »

bourbon19 wrote:

I will discuss the incident with you - I was not discussing the incident above, I was discussing the commentating.


As I see it, Charles had not given up the fight. After Vettel passed him on the outside of turn 3, and came out ahead on the subsequent straight, Charles had no intention of letting Vettel cover him off. He stayed to the middle - right of the track, knowing that Seb was planning to cover him off. When Seb made his move, Charles anticipated this - knowing exactly what Seb was going to try to do and purposely gave no quarter at all, figuring like Bottas, Seb would buck. But Seb, figuring it was his teammate, did not expect this behavior. He believed Charles would allow him to cover him off considering how far ahead he was (incident was Seb's rear right with Charles front left), and then come back along the straight with DRS and make a battle of it. But Charles is not mature enough for that yet. Like Verstappen of old, he still has the mindset of a rookie and makes poor decisions. He's getting better, but until he does, this is going to happen. Vettel has to recognize his teammate's immaturity and make concessions for this when they go wheel to wheel. Thus, I do lay blame with both. Avoidable, but since both are to blame, race incident. This is what Mattias said as well - you have to see this from the point of view of both drivers, so I agree with him on this.
Good god man, that's some die hard fanboyism if I ever did see it. You might as well say it was Verstappens fault as he was throwing thumb tacks onto the track.
Last edited by cmberry20 on Sun Nov 17, 2019 7:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

JN23
Posts: 2437
Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2016 11:14 am

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by JN23 »

Was Norris unlucky with safety car timing or was his pace poor (or both I guess)? How did he end up multiple places behind Sainz after starting 10 places ahead?

Asphalt_World
Posts: 4996
Joined: Thu May 12, 2011 6:08 pm

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by Asphalt_World »

I still can't work out if bourbon is discussing the racing, the commentators or has enjoyed a few too many Sunday beverages!
Instagram @simply_italian_cars

User avatar
Clarky
Posts: 4588
Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 4:09 pm
Location: LONDON...!

Re: 2019 Brazilian Grand Prix Race Thread

Post by Clarky »

HAMILTON penalty 5 seconds added to elapsed race time

2 penalty points imposed (total of 4 in the 12 month period)

Post Reply