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Driver in the F1 community? I know he really was raised more racing Sprint cars, then stock cars, then Indycar and then he went back and forth between Indycar and F1 (has an F1 championship). After doing a lot of research it looks like Even when he wasn't winning championships, he was winning races and even when he was a part time F1 driver he had an occasional win and/or pole position in F1. It is really hard to follow his career as it looks like he was in Indycar and then he would hop in and F1 team for 1, 2, 3 or so racing in a season and do really well, but then go back to Indycar. Looks like he had some very solid wins against some really good competition. Back then it seems like there was a lot more crossover and guys moving around (kind of like what Alonso is doing).

Excellent driver, top class 1976-1978. Had about three strong years in F1 which for the time was more than enough. His 1978 year was dominating and that's where he sealed his reputation. The next 1979 was a backwards year as Lotus made a big miscalculation with their car. The 1980 year literally killed him, as he got even a more awful car (which was beautiful beyond words), and a young aspiring team mate that beat him. His flame was put down by the unsuccessful Alfa Romeao in 1981. He went there because Alfa really seemed to be the good place to be, as they went steadily up in 1980. But, the rules where changed concerning the size of the rear wheels, they became smaller and it greatly interfered with the concept of Alfa Romeo team. His 1982 comeback was stellar, with pole position in Monza with Ferrari, though he only got third in the race. Certainly, one of the greatest drivers, clearly full of talent. and not known for crashing a lot. Beside that he was a genuine gentleman. Certainly, one can safely call him a legend of F1, which he really is.

Lt. Drebin wrote:The 1980 year literally killed him.....

I really hate to be a pedant, but that line "literally" made me doubt my entire recollection of F1 history for about a second!

Lojik wrote:

Lt. Drebin wrote:The 1980 year literally killed him.....

I really hate to be a pedant, but that line "literally" made me doubt my entire recollection of F1 history for about a second!

Depends whether it's being used in a formal way, or an informal way. Most dictionaries now recognise it's informal use. Used for emphasis.

shoot999 wrote:

Lojik wrote:

Lt. Drebin wrote:The 1980 year literally killed him.....

I really hate to be a pedant, but that line "literally" made me doubt my entire recollection of F1 history for about a second!

Depends whether it's being used in a formal way, or an informal way. Most dictionaries now recognise it's informal use. Used for emphasis.

I love how a word can have 2 definitions which mean almost the exact opposite of each other!

I'm really literally sorry guys.

Words change their meaning over time. Good that Mario is still with us.

Anyway he is "literally" one of the best among the very best (sharing the top of my own list of best, at least), and certainly the most complete driver, in an era of great complete racing drivers. He simply loved driving and racing.
Top class 76/78... That's short ! Well, he was top class already in 1969 (and certainly before), when he won the Indianapolis 500 miles (and the USAC championship for the 3rd time). He didn't race regularly in F1 before 1975, but put a Lotus 49on pole at his first ever F1 race in 1968.
He won in every series he entered (Nascar, Midget Indy/USAC, Endurance, F1...), even won at Pikes Peak, and was a great endurance race driver. Except for not winning Le Mans (finishing 1rst of the class but 2nd overall) he gets the most complete CV of them all, and I can't think of any other driver that could be a better epitome of racing driver.

Harpo wrote:Anyway he is "literally" one of the best among the very best (sharing the top of my own list of best, at least), and certainly the most complete driver, in an era of great complete racing drivers. He simply loved driving and racing.
Top class 76/78... That's short ! Well, he was top class already in 1969 (and certainly before), when he won the Indianapolis 500 miles (and the USAC championship for the 3rd time). He didn't race regularly in F1 before 1975, but put a Lotus 49on pole at his first ever F1 race in 1968.
He won in every series he entered (Nascar, Midget Indy/USAC, Endurance, F1...), even won at Pikes Peak, and was a great endurance race driver. Except for not winning Le Mans (finishing 1rst of the class but 2nd overall) he gets the most complete CV of them all, and I can't think of any other driver that could be a better epitome of racing driver.

I did notice when looking at his Bio that it was very interesting of all the diversity he had, BUT also that he won Le Mans in his class, BUT second overall. I still think they call that a "LeMans win". I guess it depends on how technical it is/was, but someone driving an LMP2 or GT car can't really expect to get an overall win (on a related topic, I am a huge Alonso fan, but I almost don't even recognize his LeMans win, given that, yes, he is driving a dominant car in a relatively small field, BUT toyota has its own set of rules vs the others in the SAME class which makes it impossible for the other teams to win, its a total joke and a farce....I actually think his 24 hrs of daytona is a bigger deal, since there was more equal competition as he was with Wayne Taylor racing and there were more equal equipment racing him).

I wonder what "BIG" races Mario has won? Alonso talks about triple crown, Mario has Indy500, did he win Monaco? Did he win Daytona 500 when in NASCAR? the "triple crown" is kind of a made up title, but how ever you dice it, it looks like Mario probably has something much more impressive than a "triple crown". Also interesting that he won Pikes Peak

Lt. Drebin wrote:Excellent driver, top class 1976-1978. Had about three strong years in F1 which for the time was more than enough. His 1978 year was dominating and that's where he sealed his reputation. The next 1979 was a backwards year as Lotus made a big miscalculation with their car. The 1980 year literally killed him, as he got even a more awful car (which was beautiful beyond words), and a young aspiring team mate that beat him. His flame was put down by the unsuccessful Alfa Romeao in 1981. He went there because Alfa really seemed to be the good place to be, as they went steadily up in 1980. But, the rules where changed concerning the size of the rear wheels, they became smaller and it greatly interfered with the concept of Alfa Romeo team. His 1982 comeback was stellar, with pole position in Monza with Ferrari, though he only got third in the race. Certainly, one of the greatest drivers, clearly full of talent. and not known for crashing a lot. Beside that he was a genuine gentleman. Certainly, one can safely call him a legend of F1, which he really is.

nice, thanks for the detail. Sometimes being in America, I wonder if he was kind of someone we boosted up higher than reality, but since he did race, succeed in F1, it is almost hard to deny his talent. Thanks!

Now you're talking about a subject that is near and dear to my heart. Mario IS the greatest racing driver of all time. Not in F1, not Indy, CART, Stock Cars, Sprints or any other discipline solely, but collectively, he is the most successful in all those disciplines combined. In CART/INDY he was highly competitive into his 50's!!!… and often would teach his already veteran son new tricks on tracks when they were teammates at Newman/Haas. Mario won everything except the 24 hours of LeMans, but did place 2nd at the young age of 55!!!… but given he raced in so many series concurrently, winning all he did is an accomplishment we will NEVER see again. He and AJ Foyt are the greatest race car drivers of all time, but Mario Edges him by just a smidgen, and on top of it all, he's the nicest human being you could ever hope to meet! Foyt on the other hand is not a very nice person and tends to be quite rude, but the man was a god behind the wheel and that's not debatable.

Mario's full-time commitment to so many series at the same time is what makes it so difficult to follow his career, and he wasn't solely committed to F1 in during most of the seasons he drove in the series and was flying back and forth to run in all the series he competed in. It wasn't uncommon in those days being as drivers didn't make rock star type money like we see today, so these guys worked their buts off to secure top drives in top series but also partook in other series to earn more money while further honing their skills set. The last driver to do this was Robbie Gordon and with schedules being so vast these days, he spread himself thin and his success suffered greatly because of it. Had he stuck to just 2 or 3 different series, he would have done better, but he often participated in at least 5.

Mario is a true gem of a human being and I'm glad he became my hero from a very early age.
The other guy who is a gem of a human being is Rick Mears. I couldn't believe how nonchalant, humble and welcoming he was after meeting him by pure chance.
I was rubbing elbows with this white haired gentleman who had his back to me and when he turned around I literally said, Holy Sh#! You're Rick Mears!
He said nope, I'm his much less talented twin brother! LOL
After that we talked for a couple of hours and he provided so much insight and great stories about all things racing and I was so sad when the time came to say goodbye, I was almost heartbroken. :LOL:

F1 MERCENARY wrote:Now you're talking about a subject that is near and dear to my heart. Mario IS the greatest racing driver of all time. Not in F1, not Indy, CART, Stock Cars, Sprints or any other discipline solely, but collectively, he is the most successful in all those disciplines combined. In CART/INDY he was highly competitive into his 50's!!!… and often would teach his already veteran son new tricks on tracks when they were teammates at Newman/Haas. Mario won everything except the 24 hours of LeMans, but did place 2nd at the young age of 55!!!… but given he raced in so many series concurrently, winning all he did is an accomplishment we will NEVER see again. He and AJ Foyt are the greatest race car drivers of all time, but Mario Edges him by just a smidgen, and on top of it all, he's the nicest human being you could ever hope to meet! Foyt on the other hand is not a very nice person and tends to be quite rude, but the man was a god behind the wheel and that's not debatable.

Mario's full-time commitment to so many series at the same time is what makes it so difficult to follow his career, and he wasn't solely committed to F1 in during most of the seasons he drove in the series and was flying back and forth to run in all the series he competed in. It wasn't uncommon in those days being as drivers didn't make rock star type money like we see today, so these guys worked their buts off to secure top drives in top series but also partook in other series to earn more money while further honing their skills set. The last driver to do this was Robbie Gordon and with schedules being so vast these days, he spread himself thin and his success suffered greatly because of it. Had he stuck to just 2 or 3 different series, he would have done better, but he often participated in at least 5.

Thats cool. In the early days of the indy500 (and even F1) it seems like there was a lot more diversity as far as what people ran. They could run sprint cars at indy, F1 cars, indycar and almost anything open wheeled. I read that one of Marios Indycars was a replica or a clone of one of the F1 cars. I am not sure what that means exactly, does that mean someone took the F1 car and modified it for indy500 or does that mean that someone took the design of the f1 car and basically copied it? I also think i read something that sometimes people would run indycars or modified indycars in F1, does that sound right? Kind of an interesting time back then.

rodH wrote:

Harpo wrote:Anyway he is "literally" one of the best among the very best (sharing the top of my own list of best, at least), and certainly the most complete driver, in an era of great complete racing drivers. He simply loved driving and racing.
Top class 76/78... That's short ! Well, he was top class already in 1969 (and certainly before), when he won the Indianapolis 500 miles (and the USAC championship for the 3rd time). He didn't race regularly in F1 before 1975, but put a Lotus 49on pole at his first ever F1 race in 1968.
He won in every series he entered (Nascar, Midget Indy/USAC, Endurance, F1...), even won at Pikes Peak, and was a great endurance race driver. Except for not winning Le Mans (finishing 1rst of the class but 2nd overall) he gets the most complete CV of them all, and I can't think of any other driver that could be a better epitome of racing driver.

I did notice when looking at his Bio that it was very interesting of all the diversity he had, BUT also that he won Le Mans in his class, BUT second overall. I still think they call that a "LeMans win". I guess it depends on how technical it is/was, but someone driving an LMP2 or GT car can't really expect to get an overall win (on a related topic, I am a huge Alonso fan, but I almost don't even recognize his LeMans win, given that, yes, he is driving a dominant car in a relatively small field, BUT toyota has its own set of rules vs the others in the SAME class which makes it impossible for the other teams to win, its a total joke and a farce....I actually think his 24 hrs of daytona is a bigger deal, since there was more equal competition as he was with Wayne Taylor racing and there were more equal equipment racing him).

I wonder what "BIG" races Mario has won? Alonso talks about triple crown, Mario has Indy500, did he win Monaco? Did he win Daytona 500 when in NASCAR? the "triple crown" is kind of a made up title, but how ever you dice it, it looks like Mario probably has something much more impressive than a "triple crown". Also interesting that he won Pikes Peak

He won the Daytona 500 before winning the Indy 500, never won at Monaco, won his last Indycar championship (whatever the series name at the time) at the age of 44, won his last Indycar race at the age of 53 and entered his last Indianapolis 500 at the age of 54... That's dedication.
Funny thing is he was born Italian during the war, moved to the USA with his parents at 15, and became a naturalized US citizen only at the age of 24, when he was already scouring the US races since 5 or 6 years.

That's not dedication… That's a Bad Maaaaan!!!!

GO TO 0:50

rodH wrote:

Lt. Drebin wrote:Excellent driver, top class 1976-1978. Had about three strong years in F1 which for the time was more than enough. His 1978 year was dominating and that's where he sealed his reputation. The next 1979 was a backwards year as Lotus made a big miscalculation with their car. The 1980 year literally killed him, as he got even a more awful car (which was beautiful beyond words), and a young aspiring team mate that beat him. His flame was put down by the unsuccessful Alfa Romeao in 1981. He went there because Alfa really seemed to be the good place to be, as they went steadily up in 1980. But, the rules where changed concerning the size of the rear wheels, they became smaller and it greatly interfered with the concept of Alfa Romeo team. His 1982 comeback was stellar, with pole position in Monza with Ferrari, though he only got third in the race. Certainly, one of the greatest drivers, clearly full of talent. and not known for crashing a lot. Beside that he was a genuine gentleman. Certainly, one can safely call him a legend of F1, which he really is.

nice, thanks for the detail. Sometimes being in America, I wonder if he was kind of someone we boosted up higher than reality, but since he did race, succeed in F1, it is almost hard to deny his talent. Thanks!

You are welcome. I didn't see a top 10 driver list without Andretti name in it, at least prior to 2000's. Also, we in Europe were not so aware of his rich heritage of success in USA prior to F1. You know, those were the times with no internet and cable TV. Anyway, Mario is firmly on a list of legends, and he is to stay there! If POBRatings was with us still, he would provide us with many black and white reasons why.

Lt. Drebin wrote:

rodH wrote:

Lt. Drebin wrote:Excellent driver, top class 1976-1978. Had about three strong years in F1 which for the time was more than enough. His 1978 year was dominating and that's where he sealed his reputation. The next 1979 was a backwards year as Lotus made a big miscalculation with their car. The 1980 year literally killed him, as he got even a more awful car (which was beautiful beyond words), and a young aspiring team mate that beat him. His flame was put down by the unsuccessful Alfa Romeao in 1981. He went there because Alfa really seemed to be the good place to be, as they went steadily up in 1980. But, the rules where changed concerning the size of the rear wheels, they became smaller and it greatly interfered with the concept of Alfa Romeo team. His 1982 comeback was stellar, with pole position in Monza with Ferrari, though he only got third in the race. Certainly, one of the greatest drivers, clearly full of talent. and not known for crashing a lot. Beside that he was a genuine gentleman. Certainly, one can safely call him a legend of F1, which he really is.

nice, thanks for the detail. Sometimes being in America, I wonder if he was kind of someone we boosted up higher than reality, but since he did race, succeed in F1, it is almost hard to deny his talent. Thanks!

You are welcome. I didn't see a top 10 driver list without Andretti name in it, at least prior to 2000's. Also, we in Europe were not so aware of his rich heritage of success in USA prior to F1. You know, those were the times with no internet and cable TV. Anyway, Mario is firmly on a list of legends, and he is to stay there! If POBRatings was with us still, he would provide us with many black and white reasons why.

There's a thread in here somewhere where POB and I went back and forth on Mario where I told the story of meeting him in greater detail.
Gosh I never met the man but Boy do I miss Patrick dearly. The conversations I had with him were incredible and he shared many the same unpopular views as I, so we had much to talk about.

I keep in touch with his daughter Catherine who's a wonderful human being and such an amazingly talented artist, just like her dad.

From someone who didnt see any of marios actual racing snd have knly seen clips and old footage.

Mario andretti seems one of the greatest all rounders of all time. In formula 1. we had drivers like lauda hunt. Peterson. Fittipaldi. Scheckter. Villeneuve. Ickx. Regazzoni competing on f1. And in indy car. We had drivers like mears. Bobby unser and al sr. Aj foyt. and thats just a few of secect drivers in the indy car.

To win any championship in either era would of put you as one of the best in any sport. But too win in both series would put you on an elite class.

Lt. Drebin wrote: You are welcome. I didn't see a top 10 driver list without Andretti name in it, at least prior to 2000's. Also, we in Europe were not so aware of his rich heritage of success in USA prior to F1. You know, those were the times with no internet and cable TV. Anyway, Mario is firmly on a list of legends, and he is to stay there! If POBRatings was with us still, he would provide us with many black and white reasons why.

I'm not sure of that. I remember feature articles about motor racing in the US in the monthly French magazine I used to read in the sixties. There was one at least every year when the Indy 500 was approching, about the various racing series that were specifically American, and monthly short news about stock car (Nascar) and Indy racing. And when the Can-Am series got started, we could follow it, on the same monthly basis. Well, Andretti was at least known in Europe before his F1 days for driving (and winning races) in the world sport-car & prototype championship (or it's just me, as what hooked me to motor racing was the then great endurance racing championship, its gorgeous cars, heroic drivers and epic drives).

Mario Andretti is a GOD and if I ever meet him, I will bow to him until he tells me to stop...

...and even then he might just have to physically stop me

You probably wouldn’t. Like me, you’ll likely be speechless for a moment and then he’d smile at you and offer to shake your hand, at which time you’ll feel even more impressed, but his warm welcoming demeanor will more than likely impress you more. The way I met him was rather iconic in that I was delivering programs for the race weekend because we were the printers for Homestead Motorsports Complex, but security caused a delay so I was cutting it close to get to my seats before the green flag, but I stopped to get a drink and some food, and as I turned around quickly, this maniac was driving a golf cart like a mad man and almost hit us, and seeing it just in time, I stopped so quickly, my drink exploded in my hand and as I was looking up and towards the driver, and starting to say… you mother…

it was HIM!!! My life long idol and he was so apologetic and sincerely upset that he’d almost run me over, but I didn’t care. I was awestruck and he asked where I was sitting and I said first row in Turn one, he said no, get in, you guys are my guests for the weekend and my buddy and I got the VIP treatment from Friday to Sunday! Best weekend ever with the exception of my favorite driver at the time, his son Michael being a bit of an ahole, though he was going through a divorce at the time, so IDK if that’s how he is, or just a difficult time for him, but he dominated and won the race in his Swift.

Just the coolest human being ever!!!

F1 MERCENARY wrote:You probably wouldn’t. Like me, you’ll likely be speechless for a moment and then he’d smile at you and offer to shake your hand, at which time you’ll feel even more impressed, but his warm welcoming demeanor will more than likely impress you more. The way I met him was rather iconic in that I was delivering programs for the race weekend because we were the printers for Homestead Motorsports Complex, but security caused a delay so I was cutting it close to get to my seats before the green flag, but I stopped to get a drink and some food, and as I turned around quickly, this maniac was driving a golf cart like a mad man and almost hit us, and seeing it just in time, I stopped so quickly, my drink exploded in my hand and as I was looking up and towards the driver, and starting to say… you mother…

it was HIM!!! My life long idol and he was so apologetic and sincerely upset that he’d almost run me over, but I didn’t care. I was awestruck and he asked where I was sitting and I said first row in Turn one, he said no, get in, you guys are my guests for the weekend and my buddy and I got the VIP treatment from Friday to Sunday! Best weekend ever with the exception of my favorite driver at the time, his son Michael being a bit of an ahole, though he was going through a divorce at the time, so IDK if that’s how he is, or just a difficult time for him, but he dominated and won the race in his Swift.

Just the coolest human being ever!!!

that's awesome, i have no doubt he was the greatest all around driver. your comments about mario and aj and michael are pretty spot on.
did you see paul newman that weekend ? i am still struck by how such a small, soft spoken guy could command such attention and respect with so many alpha personalties around in the newman/haas garage-hospitality area.

Mario has to be the most versatile driver that ever lived. His success in different disciplines is unmatched

I also place Mario on the top pedestal. I first met Mario in 1974, while I was messing around with a F5000 team at Mosport. it was an exceptionally busy weekend, with both F5000 and Can-Am running back-to-back. On Saturday morning I had a few spare moments, and decided to sit on the pit wall ( a perk from having a full pit pass) and watch a fascinating Mini race. Before I realized it, some guy sat down beside me, and when I looked, it was Mario. He wasn't there for his ego, he was just watching some fascinating racing. He was a car guy, he was a pure racer through and through. He would race anything.

This was a different era, when drivers crossed over a lot and chased rides. One prime example is Brian Redman, who deserves more recognition and respect by the general racing crowd. He was known for his endurance exploits, but he could have entered any series. He even turned his back on Formula One because he did not like the politics. And just like Mario, a very humble and nice person.

For most drivers from that era, a Google search just scratches the surface and does not tell the full story.

Never forget that Fangio started out racing stock cars in Argentina. Gilles Villeneuve started out drag racing, and later won the World Championship in snowmobiles before he progressed to open wheelers.

Blinky McSquinty wrote:I also place Mario on the top pedestal. I first met Mario in 1974, while I was messing around with a F5000 team at Mosport. it was an exceptionally busy weekend, with both F5000 and Can-Am running back-to-back. On Saturday morning I had a few spare moments, and decided to sit on the pit wall ( a perk from having a full pit pass) and watch a fascinating Mini race. Before I realized it, some guy sat down beside me, and when I looked, it was Mario. He wasn't there for his ego, he was just watching some fascinating racing. He was a car guy, he was a pure racer through and through. He would race anything.

This was a different era, when drivers crossed over a lot and chased rides. One prime example is Brian Redman, who deserves more recognition and respect by the general racing crowd. He was known for his endurance exploits, but he could have entered any series. He even turned his back on Formula One because he did not like the politics. And just like Mario, a very humble and nice person.

For most drivers from that era, a Google search just scratches the surface and does not tell the full story.

Never forget that Fangio started out racing stock cars in Argentina. Gilles Villeneuve started out drag racing, and later won the World Championship in snowmobiles before he progressed to open wheelers.

I never knew Gilles was a drag racer! That's a pretty neat little nugget of info.

pc27b wrote:

F1 MERCENARY wrote:You probably wouldn’t. Like me, you’ll likely be speechless for a moment and then he’d smile at you and offer to shake your hand, at which time you’ll feel even more impressed, but his warm welcoming demeanor will more than likely impress you more. The way I met him was rather iconic in that I was delivering programs for the race weekend because we were the printers for Homestead Motorsports Complex, but security caused a delay so I was cutting it close to get to my seats before the green flag, but I stopped to get a drink and some food, and as I turned around quickly, this maniac was driving a golf cart like a mad man and almost hit us, and seeing it just in time, I stopped so quickly, my drink exploded in my hand and as I was looking up and towards the driver, and starting to say… you mother…

it was HIM!!! My life long idol and he was so apologetic and sincerely upset that he’d almost run me over, but I didn’t care. I was awestruck and he asked where I was sitting and I said first row in Turn one, he said no, get in, you guys are my guests for the weekend and my buddy and I got the VIP treatment from Friday to Sunday! Best weekend ever with the exception of my favorite driver at the time, his son Michael being a bit of an ahole, though he was going through a divorce at the time, so IDK if that’s how he is, or just a difficult time for him, but he dominated and won the race in his Swift.

Just the coolest human being ever!!!

that's awesome, i have no doubt he was the greatest all around driver. your comments about mario and aj and michael are pretty spot on.
did you see paul newman that weekend ? i am still struck by how such a small, soft spoken guy could command such attention and respect with so many alpha personalties around in the newman/haas garage-hospitality area.

I did get to meet Paul but he was busy all weekend, but I also got to meet Carl and got to witness their relationship which was a bonus because they were genuine friends and would tease and joke with one another constantly and it kept things very fun and light hearted, even though they were all business.

It literally pains me to know the team was dissolved having never realized Paul’s dream of winning the 500 and I replay Paul’s last interview, where when speaking about the Indy 500, knowing he was on borrowed time he said… in this life or the next (he points to the sky) he knows we’ll win it one day.
It’s almost haunting and is part of the reason I don’t get excited about the 500 like I used to (along with the crap spec cars).