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mikeyg123 wrote:It's Grosjean and Magnussen at Haas for next year.

What a terrible decision.

Various news outlets saying kubica is gone at the end of the year, maybe hulk is going to williams????

Steve_muzzy wrote:Various news outlets saying kubica is gone at the end of the year, maybe hulk is going to williams????

Yup. He's gone

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-motor ... KKBN1W41E4

But could still play a part in F1 as RP reserve driver
https://grandpx.news/kubica-linked-with ... oint-move/

Official news on Kubica parting ways with Williams:

https://www.williamsf1.com/racing/news/ ... 019-season

Also read somewhere Kubica may join Racing point as 3rd driver for 2020. His sponsor (Orlem) would shift teams too if this happens.

Steve_muzzy wrote:Various news outlets saying kubica is gone at the end of the year, maybe hulk is going to williams????

Hulk going back to Williams would be good for the team. For the driver, not so much........

Especially if he gets whooped by George Russell.

Of course on the flip side, if it happened and he ended up better than Russell, what would that do for GR's chances at Mercedes I wonder?

SteveW wrote:

Steve_muzzy wrote:Various news outlets saying kubica is gone at the end of the year, maybe hulk is going to williams????

Hulk going back to Williams would be good for the team. For the driver, not so much........

Especially if he gets whooped by George Russell.

Of course on the flip side, if it happened and he ended up better than Russell, what would that do for GR's chances at Mercedes I wonder?

Williams need money. They need Latifi who I think is ready to get $30 million in sponsorship!

With the regulation change in 2021 it obvious Williams will be again the worst team on the grid by far next year. I really can't see anyone experienced who would like to "race" there next year. Ideal fit for Latifi as he got money and for first season it's fine, especially he has no other options in F1.
Kubica will probably secure some 3rd driver role or seat in other series like DTM.

Not surprised that Hulk didn’t land at Haas. This is a guy who turned down Renault for one year. Why would he go to a weaker team? For him it didn’t make much sense going there. I think he is likely done in f1 unless Ferrari or Redbull miraculously give him a call.

Haas keeping Grosjean is a surprise but they must like something in what he brings to the table. I can’t imagine why else they wouldn’t give Wherlein a go.

kleefton wrote:Not surprised that Hulk didn’t land at Haas. This is a guy who turned down Renault for one year. Why would he go to a weaker team? For him it didn’t make much sense going there. I think he is likely done in f1 unless Ferrari or Redbull miraculously give him a call.

Haas keeping Grosjean is a surprise but they must like something in what he brings to the table. I can’t imagine why else they wouldn’t give Wherlein a go.

Gunther has lost most of his brain cells after the Rich Energy saga!

SteveW wrote:

Steve_muzzy wrote:Various news outlets saying kubica is gone at the end of the year, maybe hulk is going to williams????

Hulk going back to Williams would be good for the team. For the driver, not so much........

Especially if he gets whooped by George Russell.

Of course on the flip side, if it happened and he ended up better than Russell, what would that do for GR's chances at Mercedes I wonder?

Hulk would be a good benchmark for us fans to judge Russell against. I know Merc will have the data they need etc but would quite like to see that.

JN23 wrote:That's uninspiring. Hulk is now well and truly in the s***.

I'm kind of hearing that he's put himself in this situation, with rumours of him wanting too much money at Haas and turning down a 1 year contract at Renault because he wanted a longer contract.

Has the Hulk basically priced himself out of F1 by overestimating his own value?

Steve_muzzy wrote:Various news outlets saying kubica is gone at the end of the year, maybe hulk is going to williams????

Williams will be wanting a pay driver and the likes of Latifi has plenty of dollars.

pokerman wrote:

JN23 wrote:That's uninspiring. Hulk is now well and truly in the s***.

I'm kind of hearing that he's put himself in this situation, with rumours of him wanting too much money at Haas and turning down a 1 year contract at Renault because he wanted a longer contract.

Has the Hulk basically priced himself out of F1 by overestimating his own value?

I think Steiner was also reluctant to sign Hulk due to his critical nature. This yea he's been quite vocal about Renault's woes even though he Renault is not that bad. Imagine how vocal Hulk would be after every race in Haas that doesn't understand its tyres.

kleefton wrote:Not surprised that Hulk didn’t land at Haas. This is a guy who turned down Renault for one year. Why would he go to a weaker team? For him it didn’t make much sense going there. I think he is likely done in f1 unless Ferrari or Redbull miraculously give him a call.

Haas keeping Grosjean is a surprise but they must like something in what he brings to the table. I can’t imagine why else they wouldn’t give Wherlein a go.

May be because Wherlein is worse than the current drivers... He didn't set the world on fire during his first F1 appearance, he certainly wouldn't after 2 years of disappearance.

UnlikeUday wrote:

pokerman wrote:

JN23 wrote:That's uninspiring. Hulk is now well and truly in the s***.

I'm kind of hearing that he's put himself in this situation, with rumours of him wanting too much money at Haas and turning down a 1 year contract at Renault because he wanted a longer contract.

Has the Hulk basically priced himself out of F1 by overestimating his own value?

I think Steiner was also reluctant to sign Hulk due to his critical nature. This yea he's been quite vocal about Renault's woes even though he Renault is not that bad. Imagine how vocal Hulk would be after every race in Haas that doesn't understand its tyres.

That's what I dislike about Steiner. He can dish it out but he can't take it.

With regards to Hulk; his previous career moves have all been steps forward. A move to Haas would be a decided step backwards and I imagine that he is reluctant to put himself in a position where he is just hanging on in F1. The brutality of a 22 races schedule might not seem worth it in those circumstances and at his age.

He might be a little short-sighted here though. Things are uncertain for Vettel at Ferrari and I don't see anyone over at Alfa who Ferrari would want as #2 to Charles should Vettel leave. I think Hulk should have taken the deal at Haas as a last chance at positioning himself for a top drive.

sandman1347 wrote:

UnlikeUday wrote:

pokerman wrote:

JN23 wrote:That's uninspiring. Hulk is now well and truly in the s***.

I'm kind of hearing that he's put himself in this situation, with rumours of him wanting too much money at Haas and turning down a 1 year contract at Renault because he wanted a longer contract.

Has the Hulk basically priced himself out of F1 by overestimating his own value?

I think Steiner was also reluctant to sign Hulk due to his critical nature. This yea he's been quite vocal about Renault's woes even though he Renault is not that bad. Imagine how vocal Hulk would be after every race in Haas that doesn't understand its tyres.

That's what I dislike about Steiner. He can dish it out but he can't take it.

With regards to Hulk; his previous career moves have all been steps forward. A move to Haas would be a decided step backwards and I imagine that he is reluctant to put himself in a position where he is just hanging on in F1. The brutality of a 22 races schedule might not seem worth it in those circumstances and at his age.

He might be a little short-sighted here though. Things are uncertain for Vettel at Ferrari and I don't see anyone over at Alfa who Ferrari would want as #2 to Charles should Vettel leave. I think Hulk should have taken the deal at Haas as a last chance at positioning himself for a top drive.

Hulk may be reaching the point of deciding between 'ruling in Hell or serving in Heaven' so to speak. He could probably command a top drive and top salary in any other series, so how far down the grid does he have to go before it's no longer attractive just to stay in F1?

Exediron wrote:

sandman1347 wrote:

UnlikeUday wrote:

pokerman wrote:

JN23 wrote:That's uninspiring. Hulk is now well and truly in the s***.

I'm kind of hearing that he's put himself in this situation, with rumours of him wanting too much money at Haas and turning down a 1 year contract at Renault because he wanted a longer contract.

Has the Hulk basically priced himself out of F1 by overestimating his own value?

I think Steiner was also reluctant to sign Hulk due to his critical nature. This yea he's been quite vocal about Renault's woes even though he Renault is not that bad. Imagine how vocal Hulk would be after every race in Haas that doesn't understand its tyres.

That's what I dislike about Steiner. He can dish it out but he can't take it.

With regards to Hulk; his previous career moves have all been steps forward. A move to Haas would be a decided step backwards and I imagine that he is reluctant to put himself in a position where he is just hanging on in F1. The brutality of a 22 races schedule might not seem worth it in those circumstances and at his age.

He might be a little short-sighted here though. Things are uncertain for Vettel at Ferrari and I don't see anyone over at Alfa who Ferrari would want as #2 to Charles should Vettel leave. I think Hulk should have taken the deal at Haas as a last chance at positioning himself for a top drive.

Hulk may be reaching the point of deciding between 'ruling in Hell or serving in Heaven' so to speak. He could probably command a top drive and top salary in any other series, so how far down the grid does he have to go before it's no longer attractive just to stay in F1?

Well... Hulk is also a 30+ driver who failed to score a podium finish in almost 200 races... let's say he's not the hottest name in the market and the next big thing (still better than Grosjean though)

It seems unfathomable that the Hulk could be out of a seat, but I'm now struggling to see where he'll get in.

I think Nico is going for broke here, he still wants a top drive and realizes it's probably now or never. Haas or Williams would just further cement his journeyman status.

If there's a little chance, I could still see Alfa Romeo to partner Kimi. It all depends how much Giovinazzi can impress. Hulk won't lose much also if he stays out of F1 for 2020 & has a good shot at a top team in 2021.

UnlikeUday wrote:If there's a little chance, I could still see Alfa Romeo to partner Kimi. It all depends how much Giovinazzi can impress. Hulk won't lose much also if he stays out of F1 for 2020 & has a good shot at a top team in 2021.

He might be a good shout for the Ferrari seat at Alfa. I haven't seen anything from Giovinazzi that has impressed me.

That way Ferrari have a reliable backup should Vettel jack it all in.


I disagree about 2021 though, IMO if he doesn't have a seat for 2020, he's done. Top teams will be looking to the future generation.

Horner has just said the following (possibly not word for word but the point stands)... 'very hard for Nico [Hulkenberg] to be a factor in our thinking for next year'. He talked about their pool of drivers to pick from.

Covalent wrote:I think Nico is going for broke here, he still wants a top drive and realizes it's probably now or never. Haas or Williams would just further cement his journeyman status.

There's probably something in that, it's been pointed out that every step that the Hulk has made out of choice in his F1 career has been a forward step and going to the likes of Haas would be his first backwards step.

He's 32 now, he hasn't the time for backwards steps, roll the dice and make yourself available for either Ferrari or Red Bull. Red Bull are struggling to find a driver to supplement Verstappen whilst it's not clear what happens to Vettel after 2020?

Alfa Romeo could be a nice destination for the Hulk given how close they are to Ferrari, it depends how sold Ferrari are on Giovinazzi, does he really look like a future Ferrari driver but then again he's Italian so they might want to give him more time to prove himself.

How far forward do Ferrari want to look in finding a possible replacement for Vettel, next year they could benchmark the Hulk against Kimi, also for Alfa Romeo the Hulk could be seen as a possible replacement for Kimi who turns 40 next year.

If Hulk can get a drive at Alfa alongside Kimi he should take it.

Vettel leaving Ferrari at the end of next year is a real possibility and if he can show himself to be an improvement on Kimi he could be in with a shot as a solid pair of hands to support Leclerc while Ferrari bring another junior through the ranks.

pokerman wrote:

JN23 wrote:That's uninspiring. Hulk is now well and truly in the s***.

I'm kind of hearing that he's put himself in this situation, with rumours of him wanting too much money at Haas and turning down a 1 year contract at Renault because he wanted a longer contract.

Has the Hulk basically priced himself out of F1 by overestimating his own value?

If true then he does not seem too interested in F1

Mercedes-Benz wrote:

pokerman wrote:

JN23 wrote:That's uninspiring. Hulk is now well and truly in the s***.

I'm kind of hearing that he's put himself in this situation, with rumours of him wanting too much money at Haas and turning down a 1 year contract at Renault because he wanted a longer contract.

Has the Hulk basically priced himself out of F1 by overestimating his own value?

If true then he does not seem too interested in F1

On C4, it was said apart from Hulk asking for a high fee (which Haas couldn't afford), it's rumoured a new French sponsor will be coming on board. So it made all the sense to keep Grosjean.

Mercedes-Benz wrote:

pokerman wrote:

JN23 wrote:That's uninspiring. Hulk is now well and truly in the s***.

I'm kind of hearing that he's put himself in this situation, with rumours of him wanting too much money at Haas and turning down a 1 year contract at Renault because he wanted a longer contract.

Has the Hulk basically priced himself out of F1 by overestimating his own value?

If true then he does not seem too interested in F1

He is not interested to be in F1 just to be in F1. That much is clear. He has basicaly ruled out Williams and Sauber said they are not interested in him. So while his preference seems to be F1 it seems he realize that only a top drive makes sense for him at this point in his career. Unless Vettel retires he is out of f1. That isn't a bold prediction.

Not entirely sure what confirmed 'internally' means but Kvyat looks to be staying with Toro Rosso for 2020.

Albon vs Gasly for the Red Bull seat to be decided after Mexico.

Black_Flag_11 wrote:If Hulk can get a drive at Alfa alongside Kimi he should take it.

Vettel leaving Ferrari at the end of next year is a real possibility and if he can show himself to be an improvement on Kimi he could be in with a shot as a solid pair of hands to support Leclerc while Ferrari bring another junior through the ranks.

That could be a shout.

Otherwise, I don't see the point in Hulkenberg going anywhere else. Top teams aren't going to learn anything new about him if he beat the likes of Magnussen or Russell. He's done his fair share of that for the past ten years. He might as well go outside F1 for a year and have an eye on any top positions opening up in 2021.

JN23 wrote:

Not entirely sure what confirmed 'internally' means but Kvyat looks to be staying with Toro Rosso for 2020.

Albon vs Gasly for the Red Bull seat to be decided after Mexico.

It means the good doctor has already implanted the 2020 RB-TR compliance chip into Kvyat but has not yet activated it.

So there you go, RB have not given Albon "the rest of the season" to prove himself as Horner was saying in Belgium. They've given him 6 races. I thought they'd make a call on it around Russia or Japan. I couldn't see them holding out till years to decide.

Despite Horners comments yesterday i'd still not totally write off Hulkenberg being in that 2nd RB seat next year if Albon struggles.

Grosjean rewarding his new contract by doing another typical grosjean move. Ugh.

Yellowbin74 wrote:Grosjean rewarding his new contract by doing another typical grosjean move. Ugh.

Well Russell drive into him. For once, it is really not his fault. Stupid move by Russell.

mikeyg123 wrote:It's Grosjean and Magnussen at Haas for next year.

Silly season indeed.

Watched the Best of Team Radio compilation and just felt that Grosjean was looking for an excuse to pass some blame to the team again. “We need to stop talking in corners.” I may have missed something in the race however - I fell asleep when Leclerc was backing everyone up.

He doesn’t even seem grateful for his contract extension. “Feels like playing tennis with a ping pong racket!”

Has Naoki Yamamoto just bagged himself a race seat for 2020?

Paolo_Lasardi wrote:

Yellowbin74 wrote:Grosjean rewarding his new contract by doing another typical grosjean move. Ugh.

Well Russell drive into him. For once, it is really not his fault. Stupid move by Russell.

It isn't even for once this season though. I don't think any of his 7 retirements have been his fault. We have seen as many or more race ending or qualifying ending mistakes from Leclerc and other drivers than Grosjean. I feel some are basing Grosjean too much on his previous seasons. He hasn't been great this season, but in almost all the races this year both team mates have finished, Grosjean has looked better and often by a long way. They surprisingly already had Magnussen under contract so i guess that is why they kept him. Grosjean IMO has looked better than Magnussen this season and basically did help the team work out that their upgrade effectively made them go backwards, even if it was a crash in practice.

I don't think it is all that smart keeping this pair of drivers together, but I think Grosjean has shown more speed and deserves to be here more than Magnussen.

mikeyg123 wrote:Has Naoki Yamamoto just bagged himself a race seat for 2020?

I'd say he's earned one, but Christian Horner cast some shade on that idea when he said Yamamoto 'didn't fit the criteria' for a race seat. I assume he's much too old for a Toro Rosso seat. If there's a seat open at the big team (although right now it looks like Albon is doing everything they need) that might be another story.

BMWSauber84 wrote:It seems unfathomable that the Hulk could be out of a seat, but I'm now struggling to see where he'll get in.

Wow, why?

It's not like it's Verstappen, Hamilton or Leclerc that can't find a drive here. That would be unfathomable.

The Hulk has been mostly making up the numbers his entire grand prix career, so why is it so hard to understand or comprehend that someone in Hulk's position, with very little cold hard results to show for his long career to date, would be the kind of driver making way for new drivers coming through?

F1 Racer wrote:

BMWSauber84 wrote:It seems unfathomable that the Hulk could be out of a seat, but I'm now struggling to see where he'll get in.

Wow, why?

It's not like it's Verstappen, Hamilton or Leclerc that can't find a drive here. That would be unfathomable.

The Hulk has been mostly making up the numbers his entire grand prix career, so why is it so hard to understand or comprehend that someone in Hulk's position, with very little cold hard results to show for his long career to date, would be the kind of driver making way for new drivers coming through?

His teammates frequently best him and, while he has never had a podium finish, his teammates have had several over the years. At some point the results needed to come. It's miraculous that he made it this far in some ways. Is he F1 caliber? Sure he is, but he's no longer young and he does not have the resume to guarantee anything. He's neither a guy that you can hire to win you a championship (like Hamilton, Vettel, Verstappen, etc.) not is he a young driver with a lot of potential. It's like a big game of musical chairs and he just got caught out when the music stopped.

sandman1347 wrote:

F1 Racer wrote:

BMWSauber84 wrote:It seems unfathomable that the Hulk could be out of a seat, but I'm now struggling to see where he'll get in.

Wow, why?

It's not like it's Verstappen, Hamilton or Leclerc that can't find a drive here. That would be unfathomable.

The Hulk has been mostly making up the numbers his entire grand prix career, so why is it so hard to understand or comprehend that someone in Hulk's position, with very little cold hard results to show for his long career to date, would be the kind of driver making way for new drivers coming through?

His teammates frequently best him and, while he has never had a podium finish, his teammates have had several over the years. At some point the results needed to come. It's miraculous that he made it this far in some ways. Is he F1 caliber? Sure he is, but he's no longer young and he does not have the resume to guarantee anything. He's neither a guy that you can hire to win you a championship (like Hamilton, Vettel, Verstappen, etc.) not is he a young driver with a lot of potential. It's like a big game of musical chairs and he just got caught out when the music stopped.

I think he's a top 10 driver on the grid so for us it's a shame to lose him but for him I sort of see this as a good scenario.

If anything implodes at Ferrari or Red Bull he's got a very good chance of that seat. At this point in his career I doubt he has much to gain by spending yet another midfield year at a team like Alfa or Haas so it's worth waiting it out.

If that doesn't come off there's a hell of a lot of fun a millionaire in his early 30s could have in a year off.