Indycar - Long Beach

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Flash2k11
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Indycar - Long Beach

Post by Flash2k11 »

Rossi on pole.

Not sure i'll be able to see the whole race tonight, real early start in the morning :x
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Herb
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Re: Indycar - Long Beach

Post by Herb »

Rossi wins by 20 seconds.

Not the most entertaining of races.

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Placid
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Re: Indycar - Long Beach

Post by Placid »

Rahal stripped of 3rd place for blocking. Dixon earns 3rd place.

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Mort Canard
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Re: Indycar - Long Beach

Post by Mort Canard »

Placid wrote:Rahal stripped of 3rd place for blocking. Dixon earns 3rd place.
The FIA don't have a monopoly on boneheaded officiating, do they???

I didn't particularly like the block and was hoping for Dixon to overtake but according to the rules (as read by Leigh Diffey and Paul Tracy) it was legal as Rahal moved first.

Edit: The race was almost as much of a parade as Shanghai was this morning. Rossi ran away and hid even more than Hamilton in China. I did enjoy watching Power blow the turn in under pressure from Dixon.

If Dixon hadn't had the bad pitstop, the battle with Rahal would never have happened. When you make mistakes, you get put in situations you don't want to be in.
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Flash2k11
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Re: Indycar - Long Beach

Post by Flash2k11 »

Watched the second half of the race yesterday.

Yeah..... wasn't a classic. It's a lovely looking track but it all seemed a bit Monaco.... no tyre deg and no really massively obvious ways to overtake. I've read since that Dixon has suggested the race be lengthened to introduce more tyre deg into the mix..... certainly an interesting twist on ways to make races more exciting.
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Re: Indycar - Long Beach

Post by pokerman »

Flash2k11 wrote:Watched the second half of the race yesterday.

Yeah..... wasn't a classic. It's a lovely looking track but it all seemed a bit Monaco.... no tyre deg and no really massively obvious ways to overtake. I've read since that Dixon has suggested the race be lengthened to introduce more tyre deg into the mix..... certainly an interesting twist on ways to make races more exciting.
Maybe they should try DRS and dump the push to pass which is also a push to defend? ;)
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Mort Canard
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Re: Indycar - Long Beach

Post by Mort Canard »

pokerman wrote:
Flash2k11 wrote:Watched the second half of the race yesterday.

Yeah..... wasn't a classic. It's a lovely looking track but it all seemed a bit Monaco.... no tyre deg and no really massively obvious ways to overtake. I've read since that Dixon has suggested the race be lengthened to introduce more tyre deg into the mix..... certainly an interesting twist on ways to make races more exciting.
Maybe they should try DRS and dump the push to pass which is also a push to defend? ;)
I like DRS much more than Push to Pass since there is no limit to how long or how often you can use it. You just have to be in position, within 1 second and the benefit is yours. If you are as fast or faster than the car ahead, you can have the rest of the race to make repeated attempts to overtake. With Push to Pass, you have to pick and chose the most likely opportunity and then use the P2P. With DRS you can harass the other driver as long as you can hang with them to try to force an error.

I believe that DRS is proprietary and the property of the FIA. I don't know if it would ever be made available to Indycar.
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Re: Indycar - Long Beach

Post by cuco »

Mort Canard wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Flash2k11 wrote:Watched the second half of the race yesterday.

Yeah..... wasn't a classic. It's a lovely looking track but it all seemed a bit Monaco.... no tyre deg and no really massively obvious ways to overtake. I've read since that Dixon has suggested the race be lengthened to introduce more tyre deg into the mix..... certainly an interesting twist on ways to make races more exciting.
Maybe they should try DRS and dump the push to pass which is also a push to defend? ;)
I like DRS much more than Push to Pass since there is no limit to how long or how often you can use it. You just have to be in position, within 1 second and the benefit is yours. If you are as fast or faster than the car ahead, you can have the rest of the race to make repeated attempts to overtake. With Push to Pass, you have to pick and chose the most likely opportunity and then use the P2P. With DRS you can harass the other driver as long as you can hang with them to try to force an error.

I believe that DRS is proprietary and the property of the FIA. I don't know if it would ever be made available to Indycar.
I respectfully disagree. With DRS there is no way in hell you can defend much if both cars are somewhat equal. With P2P you can defend but if you come under attack because the driver behind got better corner exit and you use P2P to defend you will be out of it and the car behind can use theirs to pass. I think there is more skill to it than DRS.

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Re: Indycar - Long Beach

Post by kleefton »

cuco wrote:
Mort Canard wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Flash2k11 wrote:Watched the second half of the race yesterday.

Yeah..... wasn't a classic. It's a lovely looking track but it all seemed a bit Monaco.... no tyre deg and no really massively obvious ways to overtake. I've read since that Dixon has suggested the race be lengthened to introduce more tyre deg into the mix..... certainly an interesting twist on ways to make races more exciting.
Maybe they should try DRS and dump the push to pass which is also a push to defend? ;)
I like DRS much more than Push to Pass since there is no limit to how long or how often you can use it. You just have to be in position, within 1 second and the benefit is yours. If you are as fast or faster than the car ahead, you can have the rest of the race to make repeated attempts to overtake. With Push to Pass, you have to pick and chose the most likely opportunity and then use the P2P. With DRS you can harass the other driver as long as you can hang with them to try to force an error.

I believe that DRS is proprietary and the property of the FIA. I don't know if it would ever be made available to Indycar.
I respectfully disagree. With DRS there is no way in hell you can defend much if both cars are somewhat equal. With P2P you can defend but if you come under attack because the driver behind got better corner exit and you use P2P to defend you will be out of it and the car behind can use theirs to pass. I think there is more skill to it than DRS.
There are ways to defend drs. Just this last race vettel had drs on Leclerc for many laps and never could attempt a move. This happens quite a lot too. Drs is far from automatic.

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Re: Indycar - Long Beach

Post by Exediron »

kleefton wrote:There are ways to defend drs. Just this last race vettel had drs on Leclerc for many laps and never could attempt a move. This happens quite a lot too. Drs is far from automatic.
Indeed. For all the whining you hear about automatic DRS passes, they're actually quite rare.
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Re: Indycar - Long Beach

Post by Mort Canard »

kleefton wrote:
cuco wrote:
Mort Canard wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Flash2k11 wrote:Watched the second half of the race yesterday.

Yeah..... wasn't a classic. It's a lovely looking track but it all seemed a bit Monaco.... no tyre deg and no really massively obvious ways to overtake. I've read since that Dixon has suggested the race be lengthened to introduce more tyre deg into the mix..... certainly an interesting twist on ways to make races more exciting.
Maybe they should try DRS and dump the push to pass which is also a push to defend? ;)
I like DRS much more than Push to Pass since there is no limit to how long or how often you can use it. You just have to be in position, within 1 second and the benefit is yours. If you are as fast or faster than the car ahead, you can have the rest of the race to make repeated attempts to overtake. With Push to Pass, you have to pick and chose the most likely opportunity and then use the P2P. With DRS you can harass the other driver as long as you can hang with them to try to force an error.

I believe that DRS is proprietary and the property of the FIA. I don't know if it would ever be made available to Indycar.
I respectfully disagree. With DRS there is no way in hell you can defend much if both cars are somewhat equal. With P2P you can defend but if you come under attack because the driver behind got better corner exit and you use P2P to defend you will be out of it and the car behind can use theirs to pass. I think there is more skill to it than DRS.
There are ways to defend drs. Just this last race vettel had drs on Leclerc for many laps and never could attempt a move. This happens quite a lot too. Drs is far from automatic.
:thumbup: :nod:
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Re: Indycar - Long Beach

Post by rodH »

I went to the race, amazing to see Rossi gap the field by around 24 seconds with everyone else being in very similar racecraft. Hamilton usually doesnt do that in vastly superior racecraft.

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Re: Indycar - Long Beach

Post by Zoue »

rodH wrote:I went to the race, amazing to see Rossi gap the field by around 24 seconds with everyone else being in very similar racecraft. Hamilton usually doesnt do that in vastly superior racecraft.
Tyres and component wear and tear. Drivers push too hard in F1 and they compromise their tyres, while they also have to be mindful of penalties for component replacement. They could go a lot faster than they currently go if they didn't have these artificial restraints

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Re: Indycar - Long Beach

Post by PT03 »

Exediron wrote:
kleefton wrote:There are ways to defend drs. Just this last race vettel had drs on Leclerc for many laps and never could attempt a move. This happens quite a lot too. Drs is far from automatic.
Indeed. For all the whining you hear about automatic DRS passes, they're actually quite rare.
What the hell have i been watching then!!!

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Re: Indycar - Long Beach

Post by rodH »

Zoue wrote:
rodH wrote:I went to the race, amazing to see Rossi gap the field by around 24 seconds with everyone else being in very similar racecraft. Hamilton usually doesnt do that in vastly superior racecraft.
Tyres and component wear and tear. Drivers push too hard in F1 and they compromise their tyres, while they also have to be mindful of penalties for component replacement. They could go a lot faster than they currently go if they didn't have these artificial restraints
Yes, I think this aspect if f1 needs to go away!!! drive the freakin hell out of the car instead of conservation mode. This is one of the big issues I hope changes in 2021. Can you imagine if Senna had to drive and manage his tires like they do now? Its a stupid aspect of the sport that I can't stand.

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Re: Indycar - Long Beach

Post by pokerman »

rodH wrote:
Zoue wrote:
rodH wrote:I went to the race, amazing to see Rossi gap the field by around 24 seconds with everyone else being in very similar racecraft. Hamilton usually doesnt do that in vastly superior racecraft.
Tyres and component wear and tear. Drivers push too hard in F1 and they compromise their tyres, while they also have to be mindful of penalties for component replacement. They could go a lot faster than they currently go if they didn't have these artificial restraints
Yes, I think this aspect if f1 needs to go away!!! drive the freakin hell out of the car instead of conservation mode. This is one of the big issues I hope changes in 2021. Can you imagine if Senna had to drive and manage his tires like they do now? Its a stupid aspect of the sport that I can't stand.
Actually despite common belief I believe that's what Senna actually use to do hence the lack of fastest laps on his resume in comparison to poles and wins.
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Re: Indycar - Long Beach

Post by Zoue »

pokerman wrote:
rodH wrote:
Zoue wrote:
rodH wrote:I went to the race, amazing to see Rossi gap the field by around 24 seconds with everyone else being in very similar racecraft. Hamilton usually doesnt do that in vastly superior racecraft.
Tyres and component wear and tear. Drivers push too hard in F1 and they compromise their tyres, while they also have to be mindful of penalties for component replacement. They could go a lot faster than they currently go if they didn't have these artificial restraints
Yes, I think this aspect if f1 needs to go away!!! drive the freakin hell out of the car instead of conservation mode. This is one of the big issues I hope changes in 2021. Can you imagine if Senna had to drive and manage his tires like they do now? Its a stupid aspect of the sport that I can't stand.
Actually despite common belief I believe that's what Senna actually use to do hence the lack of fastest laps on his resume in comparison to poles and wins.
I think there's a big difference between looking after tyres in general and the constant management that current drivers have to endure in order to keep the tyres in the correct operating temperature. Just about every driver who has experienced both types of tyre has mentioned it at some point. Kubica's the latest:

But there are things which are completely different like managing the tyres.”

Kubica’s last F1 start before 2019 came while Bridgestone was still the sport’s official tyre supplier. He said managing the current Pirelli rubber is very different.

“In general the pace, race pace is completely different to the past, especially in our situation where we struggle with the grips. The tyres are an extremely important factor and it’s a topic where you have to put a lot of attention.”


https://www.racefans.net/2019/04/22/kub ... ce-return/

and in Johanssen's recent blog describing how F1 has lost its way he also mentions the tyres and their dependency on staying in a very tight thermal window. It's something drivers of the past never had to contend with to anywhere like the same extent

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Re: Indycar - Long Beach

Post by pokerman »

Zoue wrote:
pokerman wrote:
rodH wrote:
Zoue wrote:
rodH wrote:I went to the race, amazing to see Rossi gap the field by around 24 seconds with everyone else being in very similar racecraft. Hamilton usually doesnt do that in vastly superior racecraft.
Tyres and component wear and tear. Drivers push too hard in F1 and they compromise their tyres, while they also have to be mindful of penalties for component replacement. They could go a lot faster than they currently go if they didn't have these artificial restraints
Yes, I think this aspect if f1 needs to go away!!! drive the freakin hell out of the car instead of conservation mode. This is one of the big issues I hope changes in 2021. Can you imagine if Senna had to drive and manage his tires like they do now? Its a stupid aspect of the sport that I can't stand.
Actually despite common belief I believe that's what Senna actually use to do hence the lack of fastest laps on his resume in comparison to poles and wins.
I think there's a big difference between looking after tyres in general and the constant management that current drivers have to endure in order to keep the tyres in the correct operating temperature. Just about every driver who has experienced both types of tyre has mentioned it at some point. Kubica's the latest:

But there are things which are completely different like managing the tyres.”

Kubica’s last F1 start before 2019 came while Bridgestone was still the sport’s official tyre supplier. He said managing the current Pirelli rubber is very different.

“In general the pace, race pace is completely different to the past, especially in our situation where we struggle with the grips. The tyres are an extremely important factor and it’s a topic where you have to put a lot of attention.”


https://www.racefans.net/2019/04/22/kub ... ce-return/

and in Johanssen's recent blog describing how F1 has lost its way he also mentions the tyres and their dependency on staying in a very tight thermal window. It's something drivers of the past never had to contend with to anywhere like the same extent
Yes indeed but the poster seemed to be coming from the belief that the drivers in the past gave no room for conservation of the car once they had a comfortable lead.
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