Re: Vettel vs. Leclerc
Posted: Tue Nov 19, 2019 6:22 pm
Very clear in this front-on video, Vettel is moving into Leclerc, no sign of Leclerc turning in on Vettel.
You’re welcome tooOption or Prime wrote:Rockie wrote:Is this from a video, be interesting to see the sequence before and the sequence after to get the feel for the incident?
Lol try again or harder!DeepPyro69 wrote:You’re welcome tooOption or Prime wrote:Rockie wrote:Is this from a video, be interesting to see the sequence before and the sequence after to get the feel for the incident?
http://i1294.photobucket.com/albums/b60 ... wdzm8u.png
As you can see, Leclerc is trying to steer away from Vettel, so Vettel is trying to hit him!
Well this still shows Leclerc is trying to steer away from Vettel, so Vettel is trying to hit him!Rockie wrote: How exactly?
Should Vettel be the one to ensure that Leclerc has proper control of his car?
DeepPyro69 wrote:Well this still shows Leclerc is trying to steer away from Vettel, so Vettel is trying to hit him!Rockie wrote: How exactly?
Should Vettel be the one to ensure that Leclerc has proper control of his car?
http://i1294.photobucket.com/albums/b60 ... wdzm8u.png
Indeed. Nothing wrong with Ferrari letting their drivers race each other, they should be commended for it. You'd hope that two drivers in the same team would be able to race each other without colliding when there is no championship at stake.FormulaFun wrote:Yeah Ferrari are damned if they do damned if they don't when it comes to team orders they genuinely get slated whatever their approach
Cr@p happens. I seem remember other examples of teammates coming together. Obviouly , it is best for the team that they don't, but they are competitors as well.j man wrote:Indeed. Nothing wrong with Ferrari letting their drivers race each other, they should be commended for it. You'd hope that two drivers in the same team would be able to race each other without colliding when there is no championship at stake.FormulaFun wrote:Yeah Ferrari are damned if they do damned if they don't when it comes to team orders they genuinely get slated whatever their approach
This is way I say they both carry the same responsibility and I would even go to say this is 60% Charles 40% Vettel.Blake wrote:Cr@p happens. I seem remember other examples of teammates coming together. Obviouly , it is best for the team that they don't, but they are competitors as well.j man wrote:Indeed. Nothing wrong with Ferrari letting their drivers race each other, they should be commended for it. You'd hope that two drivers in the same team would be able to race each other without colliding when there is no championship at stake.FormulaFun wrote:Yeah Ferrari are damned if they do damned if they don't when it comes to team orders they genuinely get slated whatever their approach
As has been pointed out a couple of times on this page, Ferrari is damned if they do damned if they don't with some here. Have a #1 not fair to the other driver and used to discredit the "#1" . Have two top drivers, it doesn't work. Use team orders= cheating...don't use them and they should have. Let a teammate through and you are a lapdog, race the teammate and you are the fool.
I don't think you can blame Ferrari for this, also let's not forget there's no longer anything at stake for Ferrari this season and it certainly didn't cost them the win of the race.j man wrote:Indeed. Nothing wrong with Ferrari letting their drivers race each other, they should be commended for it. You'd hope that two drivers in the same team would be able to race each other without colliding when there is no championship at stake.FormulaFun wrote:Yeah Ferrari are damned if they do damned if they don't when it comes to team orders they genuinely get slated whatever their approach
How can it be Leclerc's fault? He drove in a straight line, Vettel moved across the track into him. Vettel had little downforce and traction as he had his DRS open and would have been far less able to manoeuvre safely so should have left himself room. It was reckless, plus he has done it than once.PRFAN wrote:This is way I say they both carry the same responsibility and I would even go to say this is 60% Charles 40% Vettel.Blake wrote:Cr@p happens. I seem remember other examples of teammates coming together. Obviouly , it is best for the team that they don't, but they are competitors as well.j man wrote:Indeed. Nothing wrong with Ferrari letting their drivers race each other, they should be commended for it. You'd hope that two drivers in the same team would be able to race each other without colliding when there is no championship at stake.FormulaFun wrote:Yeah Ferrari are damned if they do damned if they don't when it comes to team orders they genuinely get slated whatever their approach
As has been pointed out a couple of times on this page, Ferrari is damned if they do damned if they don't with some here. Have a #1 not fair to the other driver and used to discredit the "#1" . Have two top drivers, it doesn't work. Use team orders= cheating...don't use them and they should have. Let a teammate through and you are a lapdog, race the teammate and you are the fool.
Charles passed Vettel with a nice move and then got immediately passed again. So Charles went from an offensive mindset to a defensive one and as he said got surprised by the move on the outside from Seb when he even said he was expecting an inside move. You would think that Charles will go in the offensive again but he stayed deffensive and this is in my opinion a key factor. How do you stay deffensive, how you prevent a completed pass? You stay as close as possible to the car in front to allow a side draft effect and to take away a free entree to the next corner just s he did. So now Vettel is in his mirrors and switch from offense to deffense, and how you deffend a pass?? You take the center of the track!!!!
Charles had a better visual understanding of what is happening, Vettel in in his mirrors and BOTH in a defensive mindset, Leclerc failed to his ego
60 to 40 b on Charles.being at fault, no business being that close
He positioned his front right too close to Vettels rear left, should have given himself more room in case Vettel decided to go defensuve as any driver would by positioning the car in the middle of the road. The downforce claim you make is mute, this cars still produce significant downforce with the DRS open, not an issue. In my opinion Charles wanted to prevent Vettel to position his car in the middle of the road so he stuck close to him, it is harder for Vettel to judge if he is 100% pass Charles, for this I think you can not say Vettel was reckless, he did what any passing driver would have done, Charles possitioned himself in the danger zone and payed a price. Charles shows his inexperience often. Yes Vettel could have stayed right, but there was no way Charles was getting that position back, he should have stayed back play it safe and attack later. But feelings got in the way. Charles has an ego problem.Option or Prime wrote:How can it be Leclerc's fault? He drove in a straight line, Vettel moved across the track into him. Vettel had little downforce and traction as he had his DRS open and would have been far less able to manoeuvre safely so should have left himself room. It was reckless, plus he has done it than once.PRFAN wrote:This is way I say they both carry the same responsibility and I would even go to say this is 60% Charles 40% Vettel.Blake wrote:Cr@p happens. I seem remember other examples of teammates coming together. Obviouly , it is best for the team that they don't, but they are competitors as well.j man wrote:Indeed. Nothing wrong with Ferrari letting their drivers race each other, they should be commended for it. You'd hope that two drivers in the same team would be able to race each other without colliding when there is no championship at stake.FormulaFun wrote:Yeah Ferrari are damned if they do damned if they don't when it comes to team orders they genuinely get slated whatever their approach
As has been pointed out a couple of times on this page, Ferrari is damned if they do damned if they don't with some here. Have a #1 not fair to the other driver and used to discredit the "#1" . Have two top drivers, it doesn't work. Use team orders= cheating...don't use them and they should have. Let a teammate through and you are a lapdog, race the teammate and you are the fool.
Charles passed Vettel with a nice move and then got immediately passed again. So Charles went from an offensive mindset to a defensive one and as he said got surprised by the move on the outside from Seb when he even said he was expecting an inside move. You would think that Charles will go in the offensive again but he stayed deffensive and this is in my opinion a key factor. How do you stay deffensive, how you prevent a completed pass? You stay as close as possible to the car in front to allow a side draft effect and to take away a free entree to the next corner just s he did. So now Vettel is in his mirrors and switch from offense to deffense, and how you deffend a pass?? You take the center of the track!!!!
Charles had a better visual understanding of what is happening, Vettel in in his mirrors and BOTH in a defensive mindset, Leclerc failed to his ego
60 to 40 b on Charles.being at fault, no business being that close
Not so he didn't do any positioning, he is driving straight.PRFAN wrote: He positioned his front right too close to Vettels rear left,
PRFAN wrote: The downforce claim you make is mute
Quite possibly but they are both the same, it is not the first time Vettel has reacted having been passed, there was only one car moving laterally on that straight, Vettels'.PRFAN wrote: Charles has an ego problem.
You are wrong to think that because the car has DRS open is not producing downforce hence any movement of the wheel to change direction is dangerous. Although a big percentage of the DF is produce by the rear wing, the floor and diffuser provide significant down force numbers, which increase exponentially as speed increases, so even if you remove the rear wing completely, they more speed Vettel gains the safer his car becomes. As I said, DF is not an issue in this scenario. If engineers were able to find a way to produce enough downforce with the floor to allow them to completely delete the rear wing they will do so, that is an extreme situation tho, just trying to prove a point.Option or Prime wrote:Not so he didn't do any positioning, he is driving straight.PRFAN wrote: He positioned his front right too close to Vettels rear left,
PRFAN wrote: The downforce claim you make is mute
Not at all it downforce were unaffected it would be permitted in corners, the zones are there for a reason.
Quite possibly but they are both the same, it is not the first time Vettel has reacted having been passed, there was only one car moving laterally on that straight, Vettels'.PRFAN wrote: Charles has an ego problem.
WHoff78 wrote:Reading the last couple of posts, it seems that the FIA have really dug themselves into a hole on this one after the Monza incident between Hamilton and Leclerc. Effectively Leclerc knows that he won’t get a penalty if he lets Vettel muscle him out of the way and there is no contact between the two.
Basically he is left with two choices. Concede the line and position to Vettel, even though the move is not quite complete. Or hold his line and risk contact. Neither of which are good choices.
Vettel would love reading thisPRFAN wrote:You are wrong to think that because the car has DRS open is not producing downforce hence any movement of the wheel to change direction is dangerous. Although a big percentage of the DF is produce by the rear wing, the floor and diffuser provide significant down force numbers, which increase exponentially as speed increases, so even if you remove the rear wing completely, they more speed Vettel gains the safer his car becomes. As I said, DF is not an issue in this scenario. If engineers were able to find a way to produce enough downforce with the floor to allow them to completely delete the rear wing they will do so, that is an extreme situation tho, just trying to prove a point.Option or Prime wrote:Not so he didn't do any positioning, he is driving straight.PRFAN wrote: He positioned his front right too close to Vettels rear left,
PRFAN wrote: The downforce claim you make is mute
Not at all it downforce were unaffected it would be permitted in corners, the zones are there for a reason.
Quite possibly but they are both the same, it is not the first time Vettel has reacted having been passed, there was only one car moving laterally on that straight, Vettels'.PRFAN wrote: Charles has an ego problem.
Now this sent me to review the video again in slow motion. Leaving the corner into the DRS zone CL is looking to his right mirror, clearly he wants SV to have the outside, he knows SV will have DRS so he does not want to give up the inside to the next corner. Now that he gets SV to the outside, the next thing is to pinch him to the outside, nothing wrong here, this is racing Chess, he wants to deny SV a good entry to next corner and give himself an advantage, this is absolutely normal, but he got greedy. Vettel is 3/4 of the way pass and from the onboard you can clearly see CL turning right, he is reacting to SV moving LEFT to deny CL the line, SV wants to force CL into a shallow/slow entry, again this is CHESS to the next corner, CL at the same time is trying to get SV to react right, they get into an arm wrestling match. This is where CL fackt it up. He, should have conceded, SV got him moving left, he does not have DRS, at this moment he should have moved farther left to allow Seb to move forward, tuck behind, force SV to defend the middle and try for late apex and concentrate on exit. This is something Alonso and Schumi were good at, this is RACECRAFT.
The reason I apportioned some blame for SV is because the stage of the race and they are teammates, and he should have known better, but if not for that unfortunately I have to held CL almost fully responsible for this. He got greedy, he lost out. SV is in front cut you losses fall back and try again next corner.
Agreed. Racing incident. Amazing consequences for such a light contact.Mercedes-Benz wrote:Vettel was 99% ahead and made the move fraction too early. Charles knew what was coming but still did not want to give up. That incident is being blown away out of proportion. It is was racing incident and sadly for Ferrari there was huge consequence for it.
No MB, that is not correct. Vettel cannot have been 99% ahead if his left rear then touched the rear shoulder of Leclerc's right front tyre - which it did.Mercedes-Benz wrote:Vettel was 99% ahead and made the move fraction too early. Charles knew what was coming but still did not want to give up.
It came very close indeed to being considered a racing incident, but then, every accident is an incident to begin with. Still, I'm not convinced the stewards were of the opinion neither driver was predominantly to blame for the accident, even though no penalty came the way of either of them. But it is really hard to find a congruous argument to blame Leclerc of anything more than only allowing the outside attacker little more room than the rules prescribe.Mercedes-Benz wrote:That incident is being blown away out of proportion. It is was racing incident and sadly for Ferrari there was huge consequence for it.
Vettel rear tyre was ahead of Charles front tyre. His move was only fraction seconds early. Moreover I am very sure Charles could see Vettel coming and that he wanted to go to the racing line to have best possible line for the corner rather than going around outside. But still he did not want to concede. Early in the race Charles was moving more aggressively to overtake midfielder like Norris and Ricciardo. Norris had to give up and move to avoid crash with him.Fiki wrote:No MB, that is not correct. Vettel cannot have been 99% ahead if his left rear then touched the rear shoulder of Leclerc's right front tyre - which it did.Mercedes-Benz wrote:Vettel was 99% ahead and made the move fraction too early. Charles knew what was coming but still did not want to give up.
It came very close indeed to being considered a racing incident, but then, every accident is an incident to begin with. Still, I'm not convinced the stewards were of the opinion neither driver was predominantly to blame for the accident, even though no penalty came the way of either of them. But it is really hard to find a congruous argument to blame Leclerc of anything more than only allowing the outside attacker little more room than the rules prescribe.Mercedes-Benz wrote:That incident is being blown away out of proportion. It is was racing incident and sadly for Ferrari there was huge consequence for it.
If this had not been between team-mates, which gives the stewards the opportunity to let the team "explain" to their drivers whether they raced by the team orders or not, I think there would have been a penalty. Which, I hope, would have been given to the driver who really caused the accident, not the one racing by the rules.
That's actually not true. The damage was caused because the wheels overlapped with Vettel going faster so essentially Vettel's rear tyre ran into the back of Leclerc's front tyre.Mercedes-Benz wrote:Vettel rear tyre was ahead of Charles front tyre. His move was only fraction seconds early. Moreover I am very sure Charles could see Vettel coming and that he wanted to go to the racing line to have best possible line for the corner rather than going around outside. But still he did not want to concede. Early in the race Charles was moving more aggressively to overtake midfielder like Norris and Ricciardo. Norris had to give up and move to avoid crash with him.Fiki wrote:No MB, that is not correct. Vettel cannot have been 99% ahead if his left rear then touched the rear shoulder of Leclerc's right front tyre - which it did.Mercedes-Benz wrote:Vettel was 99% ahead and made the move fraction too early. Charles knew what was coming but still did not want to give up.
It came very close indeed to being considered a racing incident, but then, every accident is an incident to begin with. Still, I'm not convinced the stewards were of the opinion neither driver was predominantly to blame for the accident, even though no penalty came the way of either of them. But it is really hard to find a congruous argument to blame Leclerc of anything more than only allowing the outside attacker little more room than the rules prescribe.Mercedes-Benz wrote:That incident is being blown away out of proportion. It is was racing incident and sadly for Ferrari there was huge consequence for it.
If this had not been between team-mates, which gives the stewards the opportunity to let the team "explain" to their drivers whether they raced by the team orders or not, I think there would have been a penalty. Which, I hope, would have been given to the driver who really caused the accident, not the one racing by the rules.
Closer than I would have thought in the end given Vettel went missing for pretty much the whole of the second 3rd of the season. Without backtracking and having a look I'd guess that Leclerc lost more points to bad luck than Vettel.Mort Canard wrote:Well, I voted that Vettel would win but it would be close. So much for that idea.
My question is with a 24 point gap from Leclerc to Vettel, almost a race win, is that really all that close?
While Vettel has benefited from having a favored race strategy in the team, Charles did what he needed to do to outshine the veteran this year. It seems to me that if Binnotto does not put his hand on the scales favoring one driver over the other till the momentum is clear, Leclerc could easily out-point Vettel by more than he did this year.
In the end, my question is how close was the battle this year between Leclerc and Vettel?
So what you're saying is that if Vettel clicks with the car he can make a fight of it with Leclerc in roughly equal circumstances, otherwise Leclerc could butcher Vettel. It doesn't sound to me like Vettel has much of a shot here if his best case scenario is to have a good fight with Charles.Black_Flag_11 wrote:Closer than I would have thought in the end given Vettel went missing for pretty much the whole of the second 3rd of the season. Without backtracking and having a look I'd guess that Leclerc lost more points to bad luck than Vettel.Mort Canard wrote:Well, I voted that Vettel would win but it would be close. So much for that idea.
My question is with a 24 point gap from Leclerc to Vettel, almost a race win, is that really all that close?
While Vettel has benefited from having a favored race strategy in the team, Charles did what he needed to do to outshine the veteran this year. It seems to me that if Binnotto does not put his hand on the scales favoring one driver over the other till the momentum is clear, Leclerc could easily out-point Vettel by more than he did this year.
In the end, my question is how close was the battle this year between Leclerc and Vettel?
Next year will be interesting. Which way will the car development go? Vettel has never been very adaptable and that showed in the mid part of the season where the car wasnt to his liking. Leclerc seems to be more adaptable as he didn't struggle in the same way.
So based on what we saw this year I see it coming down to largely to the car, if Vettel clicks with it it could be an epic battle next year, if not it could be a complete walk over. Certainly the inter team battle I'm most looking forward to though.
Well obviously yes.Invade wrote:So what you're saying is that if Vettel clicks with the car he can make a fight of it with Leclerc in roughly equal circumstances, otherwise Leclerc could butcher Vettel. It doesn't sound to me like Vettel has much of a shot here if his best case scenario is to have a good fight with Charles.Black_Flag_11 wrote:Closer than I would have thought in the end given Vettel went missing for pretty much the whole of the second 3rd of the season. Without backtracking and having a look I'd guess that Leclerc lost more points to bad luck than Vettel.Mort Canard wrote:Well, I voted that Vettel would win but it would be close. So much for that idea.
My question is with a 24 point gap from Leclerc to Vettel, almost a race win, is that really all that close?
While Vettel has benefited from having a favored race strategy in the team, Charles did what he needed to do to outshine the veteran this year. It seems to me that if Binnotto does not put his hand on the scales favoring one driver over the other till the momentum is clear, Leclerc could easily out-point Vettel by more than he did this year.
In the end, my question is how close was the battle this year between Leclerc and Vettel?
Next year will be interesting. Which way will the car development go? Vettel has never been very adaptable and that showed in the mid part of the season where the car wasnt to his liking. Leclerc seems to be more adaptable as he didn't struggle in the same way.
So based on what we saw this year I see it coming down to largely to the car, if Vettel clicks with it it could be an epic battle next year, if not it could be a complete walk over. Certainly the inter team battle I'm most looking forward to though.
Admittedly we dont have a large set of data to draw from for Leclerc so we dont know for sure he isnt susceptible to underperformance when the car isnt to his liking, but we do know this is the case for Vettel and have seen it be true way back to 2012 at least.Invade wrote:So what you're saying is that if Vettel clicks with the car he can make a fight of it with Leclerc in roughly equal circumstances, otherwise Leclerc could butcher Vettel. It doesn't sound to me like Vettel has much of a shot here if his best case scenario is to have a good fight with Charles.Black_Flag_11 wrote:Closer than I would have thought in the end given Vettel went missing for pretty much the whole of the second 3rd of the season. Without backtracking and having a look I'd guess that Leclerc lost more points to bad luck than Vettel.Mort Canard wrote:Well, I voted that Vettel would win but it would be close. So much for that idea.
My question is with a 24 point gap from Leclerc to Vettel, almost a race win, is that really all that close?
While Vettel has benefited from having a favored race strategy in the team, Charles did what he needed to do to outshine the veteran this year. It seems to me that if Binnotto does not put his hand on the scales favoring one driver over the other till the momentum is clear, Leclerc could easily out-point Vettel by more than he did this year.
In the end, my question is how close was the battle this year between Leclerc and Vettel?
Next year will be interesting. Which way will the car development go? Vettel has never been very adaptable and that showed in the mid part of the season where the car wasnt to his liking. Leclerc seems to be more adaptable as he didn't struggle in the same way.
So based on what we saw this year I see it coming down to largely to the car, if Vettel clicks with it it could be an epic battle next year, if not it could be a complete walk over. Certainly the inter team battle I'm most looking forward to though.
I dont really see how you could credit Kimi for 2018's point total being higher than this year's. This years car is way worse than last years, with Kimi in the other Ferrari the difference would have been larger too.PRFAN wrote:In the end these teams race for points and 2018 vs 2019 results for Ferrari confirm or validate what many beleive in the sense that driver chemistry is important. And maybe Kimi was not that bad after all
Yeah, I mean you only have to look at the 2018 and 2019 Italian Grand Prix to see the difference between CL and KR. In 2018 Kimi blew it big time whereas in 2019 Leclerc held off Hamilton for the win.Black_Flag_11 wrote:I dont really see how you could credit Kimi for 2018's point total being higher than this year's. This years car is way worse than last years, with Kimi in the other Ferrari the difference would have been larger too.PRFAN wrote:In the end these teams race for points and 2018 vs 2019 results for Ferrari confirm or validate what many beleive in the sense that driver chemistry is important. And maybe Kimi was not that bad after all
I am not entirely crediting Kimi. I am not implying that he is faster than Leclerc either. The car argument I suspected was going to pop up, you can also argue that the MB car in 2019 was worse than the 2018, and I am not sure you can say the 2019 Ferrari was worse than the 2018 car. Also saying that with Kimi in the 2019 Ferrari they would have been farther behind is speculative, no body knows what would have happened. All I am saying is that the 2019 Ferrari Team did worse than the 2018, and you can not deny that moving Leclerc to Ferrari had an impact and I do not think it was a positive one out of the individual achievements of each driver. At the beginning of the season a few (including me) made the argument to the benefits to the team with pairing Vettel and Leclerc, and that maybe one more year at Alfa for Leclerc was not necessarily a bad thing. Points wise Ferrari lost out. Vettel made some mistakes but Charles made some too, as Kimi did last season, but the Level head and consistency of Kimi got him 3rd in the overall standings. With all his critics he only lost out to Leclerc by 13 points! 251 to 264 Old guy past his prime what are you doing in F1 please leave now apparently did wellBlack_Flag_11 wrote:I dont really see how you could credit Kimi for 2018's point total being higher than this year's. This years car is way worse than last years, with Kimi in the other Ferrari the difference would have been larger too.PRFAN wrote:In the end these teams race for points and 2018 vs 2019 results for Ferrari confirm or validate what many beleive in the sense that driver chemistry is important. And maybe Kimi was not that bad after all
Yeah the 2018 Ferrari was a WDC capable car unlike the 2019 Ferrari.Black_Flag_11 wrote:I dont really see how you could credit Kimi for 2018's point total being higher than this year's. This years car is way worse than last years, with Kimi in the other Ferrari the difference would have been larger too.PRFAN wrote:In the end these teams race for points and 2018 vs 2019 results for Ferrari confirm or validate what many beleive in the sense that driver chemistry is important. And maybe Kimi was not that bad after all
I wouldn't be seeing that as the best example, in 2018 Kimi would probably have been penalised for doing what Leclerc did this year, the stewarding changed somewhat after Canada this year.F1 Racer wrote:Yeah, I mean you only have to look at the 2018 and 2019 Italian Grand Prix to see the difference between CL and KR. In 2018 Kimi blew it big time whereas in 2019 Leclerc held off Hamilton for the win.Black_Flag_11 wrote:I dont really see how you could credit Kimi for 2018's point total being higher than this year's. This years car is way worse than last years, with Kimi in the other Ferrari the difference would have been larger too.PRFAN wrote:In the end these teams race for points and 2018 vs 2019 results for Ferrari confirm or validate what many beleive in the sense that driver chemistry is important. And maybe Kimi was not that bad after all
So Leclerc has become the optimum of performance, a bit like Bottas gets more praise for beating Hamilton rather than the other way round, that's not exactly good for Vettel.WHoff78 wrote:Apparently Binotto claimed that the best Ferrari lap of the season was Vettel’s pole lap in Japan, and that it had to be special because he beat Leclerc. That is pretty telling from the principle. Vettel seems to be up for the fight next season, but I expect Ferrari to throw their weight behind Leclerc and the gap to widen.
What we don’t know is how much each driver brings in terms of optimizing the car development, and relaying where time can be found to the engineers. Or more importantly if the internal competition between the two drivers is hindering this process.
I never said it was the best example, just an example.pokerman wrote:I wouldn't be seeing that as the best example, in 2018 Kimi would probably have been penalised for doing what Leclerc did this year, the stewarding changed somewhat after Canada this year.F1 Racer wrote:Yeah, I mean you only have to look at the 2018 and 2019 Italian Grand Prix to see the difference between CL and KR. In 2018 Kimi blew it big time whereas in 2019 Leclerc held off Hamilton for the win.Black_Flag_11 wrote:I dont really see how you could credit Kimi for 2018's point total being higher than this year's. This years car is way worse than last years, with Kimi in the other Ferrari the difference would have been larger too.PRFAN wrote:In the end these teams race for points and 2018 vs 2019 results for Ferrari confirm or validate what many beleive in the sense that driver chemistry is important. And maybe Kimi was not that bad after all
Well Leclerc drove like that knowing that he probably would get away with it.F1 Racer wrote:I never said it was the best example, just an example.pokerman wrote:I wouldn't be seeing that as the best example, in 2018 Kimi would probably have been penalised for doing what Leclerc did this year, the stewarding changed somewhat after Canada this year.F1 Racer wrote:Yeah, I mean you only have to look at the 2018 and 2019 Italian Grand Prix to see the difference between CL and KR. In 2018 Kimi blew it big time whereas in 2019 Leclerc held off Hamilton for the win.Black_Flag_11 wrote:I dont really see how you could credit Kimi for 2018's point total being higher than this year's. This years car is way worse than last years, with Kimi in the other Ferrari the difference would have been larger too.PRFAN wrote:In the end these teams race for points and 2018 vs 2019 results for Ferrari confirm or validate what many beleive in the sense that driver chemistry is important. And maybe Kimi was not that bad after all