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Which records will Hamilton break?
Poll ended at Mon Oct 15, 2018 12:54 pm
World Titles 10%  10%  [ 14 ]
Race Wins 16%  16%  [ 22 ]
Fastest Laps 4%  4%  [ 6 ]
Podiums 17%  17%  [ 24 ]
Laps Led 7%  7%  [ 10 ]
KMs Led 6%  6%  [ 9 ]
Hat Tricks 4%  4%  [ 5 ]
Wins/Podiums in Consecutive Years 10%  10%  [ 14 ]
Wins at an Individual Grand Prix/Circuit 11%  11%  [ 16 ]
Consecutive Podiums 4%  4%  [ 5 ]
Consecutive Wins 4%  4%  [ 6 ]
Consecutive Poles 4%  4%  [ 5 ]
Grand Slams 4%  4%  [ 5 ]
Total votes : 141
Author Message
PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2020 10:06 pm 

Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:30 pm
Posts: 34276
KingVoid wrote:
The problem with this argument is that people always forget that Rosberg stacked up very well against Hamilton in 2013 when Mercedes was competitive but clearly not the best car.

That was Hamilton's weakest season against Rosberg, I think being new to the team and car being a factor, in particular the Fric system that affected how he wanted to drive the car, he came on stronger in the second half of the season but late on 2 poor races later found to be a cracked chassis which didn't help with the overall impression of his season.

PF1 Pick 10 Competition

2013: 5th Place
2014: Champion
2015: 3rd Place
2016: 4th Place

2017: 9th Place
2018: 7th place

Wins: Canada 2018, Abu Dhabi 2017
Podiums: (8)

PostPosted: Fri Mar 27, 2020 2:31 pm 

Joined: Tue Oct 21, 2003 11:06 am
Posts: 7928
Location: Belgium
pokerman wrote:
Fiki wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Fiki wrote:
KingVoid wrote:
Rosberg is one of those drivers whose reputation will increase over time.

People often discredit his performances against Hamilton because “it’s easy to challenge for a WDC in a dominant car”, but forget that he was also very competitive in 2013.

Nico wasn’t rated that highly by fans when he was driving, but he will be remembered fondly with hindsight.

It’s the complete opposite to Vettel and Raikkonen, two drivers whose reputation was sky-high in their mid-20s and then deteriorated with time.
I think you're right. And I also think that if Mercedes had hired a second German driver, he might now well be a multiple title holder. It's no reflection on Hamilton, but I wondered why they didn't keep the team more German.

Maybe because they didn't have a crystal ball therefore in 2012 they couldn't foresee the domination of 2014, so priority was to employ the best driver available and not just some bespoke German driver.

Also good luck in winning the titles in 2017 and 2018 with priority on having German drivers.
Possibly, but that was projecting beyond the three years immediately ahead. Remember the initial McLaren run in the 1980s? '84 and '85 were won with the best car and arguably the two best drivers in the world, but even by 1986 their run should have been finished. Still being a top team with the best driver in the world kept McLaren in touch with Williams, who didn't have the best drivers in the world, albeit both world champions then or later.
And yet Williams should have won the drivers' title with their slightly inferior drivers.

Edit: And how would the battle in 1986 have looked, had McLaren been capable of accommodating both its world champions, with their different requirements? It took them far too long to see Rosberg for the fast driver he was.

I'm a bit confused you seem to be saying the same thing as me, McLaren needed Prost for when the car was no longer dominant, similar with Hamilton and Mercedes.

A team can't gamble on having a dominant car that will facilitate having weaker drivers.
Perhaps I didn't go far enough in explaining my additional point. I didn't so much underline McLaren's need to rely on Prost to remain competitive, rather than wonder how much more competitive they could have been, had they been able to accommodate both Prost's and Rosberg's needs in a car. Keke's final race in Adelaide only provides us with a glimpse of what was possible. He certainly wasn't a slouch. And even though he himself later said he thought he was fast until he met Prost, the fact remains McLaren had two champions on their books. The parallel with Mercedes/Hamilton/Rosberg is clear I hope.

All in all, I think KingVoid's comment on Nico's reputation is correct, and that doesn't diminish respect for Hamilton's qualities in the least.

There's one record Schumacher didn't score, and that Hamilton isn't in a position to achieve anymore, but that Nico did: setting fastest lap in his very first Grand Prix.

Use every man after his desert, and who should scape whipping? Use them after your own honour and dignity.

Maria de Villota - Jules Bianchi

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