planetf1.com

not sure that Parr actually said that it was Kimi who made a decision. From my reading there was no agreement in Williams on Kimi and it is not clear who made a final decision, likely Parr himself

full interview is under subscription on Autosport

“One member said that we have to hire him. Another member said that it would be the worst mistake we have ever done,” Parr told Autosport.

“I myself wanted to hire him, but in the end I came to the conclusion that it would be too risky.

F1nsider wrote:Meanwhile, Lotus keeps racking up sponsors - http://www.yallaf1.com/2013/01/14/lotus ... aF1.com%29

I wonder if that would've been possible if they didn't sign Kimi

most importantly - Henri-Lloyds was Brawn and Mercedes partners in 2009-2011. So, we can see the 'price' of success in 2012

bbobeckyj wrote:

F1nsider wrote:Kimi Turned Down Williams for Lotus - http://www.yallaf1.com/2013/01/15/raikk ... aF1.com%29

That's news! I always thought it was a money thing to be honest. Turns out that Kimi wanted a more competitive car

Briton Parr, who left his role as Williams chairman early last year and is now promoting a book, confirmed that he had talks with the Finn about driving for the famous British team in 2012.

“I wanted to bring Kimi to Williams in 2012,” Parr is quoted by Italy’s Autosprint, “but I could not guarantee a competitive car for him. When I spoke with him, I was impressed by his hunger and his determination.”

“Nevertheless, his value at the time remained unclear, and we didn’t know just how strong our car would be.”

Despite the title, it doesn't say anywhere that Raikkonen turned down an offer, or even that there was an offer. This bold part implies that any offer would have been very low, they eventually signed c. £10m of pay driver instead of paying out £5m. The difference being comparable to two championship positions.
Bottas was a long term goal, they compromised their £10m pay driver's weekend by giving the Friday morning sessions to their future driver who is about ten years younger than Raikkonen, and who is the only non pay driver outside of the top 5 teams, in the same sense that Grosjean brings Total, but that isn't the reason he got the drive, his career is being managed and some funding has been organised with it.
I don't get any impression that there was a serious offer, so is it fair to say that Raikkonen turned Williams down?

agree, writer misled us!

F1nsider wrote:Oh, What have you done Jinx.. Now the 2 Alonso fans we have in the forum will be all over this thread again

When you revert to statistis they will talk about the car, when you talk about performance they'll throw in "Massa beat Kimi", when you say it was because of the car, they'll go back to statistics

Dunno if I'm one of those people you mentioned but I'll go anyway.

Massa is actually more of a scapegoat for Kimi fans these days than some sort of weapon used by Alonso fans. Since you bothered to complain I'll point out that Kimi fans usually cherry pick stats that suit Kimi and often target Alonso since they hold a grudge. And of course most fans including myself tend to get a bit defensive when their driver of support is being called into question. But personally I don't care much for stats. I wanted Alonso to win the WDC for the sheer joy of it rather than the everlasting stat. On that I was disappointed. Comparison with Kimi ? Alonso is being hailed as the best driver on the grid so that pretty much takes care of all the rest of the drivers, not just Kimi.

Kimi forgets his sponsors - http://www.gpupdate.net/en/videos/2977/ ... -sponsors/

So..the engineer who got leave me alone treatment is heading to another straight talkers engineer to Red Bull and Webbers engineer will be Lotus teams new chief race engineer..I dunno will it affect this and that to Lotus teams strategy calls..but will be interesting to see if Webbers starts got better.

F1nsider wrote:Meanwhile, Lotus keeps racking up sponsors - http://www.yallaf1.com/2013/01/14/lotus ... aF1.com%29

I wonder if that would've been possible if they didn't sign Kimi

The article says that the team will wear the companies clothing while travelling.
I wonder what Kimi will think of being told what he has to wear while travelling, and to/from the track?

RaggedMan wrote:

F1nsider wrote:Meanwhile, Lotus keeps racking up sponsors - http://www.yallaf1.com/2013/01/14/lotus ... aF1.com%29

I wonder if that would've been possible if they didn't sign Kimi

The article says that the team will wear the companies clothing while travelling.
I wonder what Kimi will think of being told what he has to wear while travelling, and to/from the track?

For the team, free clothes, probably of their choice (selected from the maker's range), sounds great to me. They all have to wear team uniform anyway to and from tracks, it'll just have a different name on it this year. Raikkonen has a personal clothing sponsor so is possibly exempt.

Looks like Lotus has a new chief race engineer ex race engineer of Mark Webber Ciaron Pilbeam while Simon Rennie leaves Lotus to become Mark Webber race engineer at Red Bull.

I think this is a real positive for the team as he can bring a lot to the team.

I also heard Permane is gone... dunno if this sound bite is true

Jinx wrote:I also heard Permane is gone... dunno if this sound bite is true

Good riddance if true.. I never liked him to be honest

F1nsider wrote:

Jinx wrote:I also heard Permane is gone... dunno if this sound bite is true

Good riddance if true.. I never liked him to be honest

I feel the same way . Thing is permane has friends in the media so there was no way he was going to be criticised for his awful decisions.
I hope lotus go the ferrari and red bull way and do all the calculations and plan the strategy back at enstone.

sandyf1 wrote:

F1nsider wrote:

Jinx wrote:I also heard Permane is gone... dunno if this sound bite is true

Good riddance if true.. I never liked him to be honest

I feel the same way . Thing is permane has friends in the media so there was no way he was going to be criticised for his awful decisions.
I hope lotus go the ferrari and red bull way and do all the calculations and plan the strategy back at enstone.

wow... Permane is a big name, but I have to agree. I heard from a top F1 journalist that Permane told him in Texas that if they had Alonso instead of Kimi this year they would have won the title. If he really said that he is full of it....

Who can forget that when Kimi qualified 11th bcos he told kimi to stay in the garage and let kimi take the fall during the post quali conference... and when kimi drove to a podium, he then stuck his hand up to say it was his brilliant strategy all along? Maybe he should join Fernando in Ferrari

Jinx wrote:Who can forget that when Kimi qualified 11th bcos he told kimi to stay in the garage and let kimi take the fall during the post quali conference... and when kimi drove to a podium, he then stuck his hand up to say it was his brilliant strategy all along? Maybe he should join Fernando in Ferrari

That really cracked me up

They get Permane and replace Dominicalli with Flavio = Perfect Evil Team

Any one know the Lotus launch date?

Jinx wrote:Who can forget that when Kimi qualified 11th bcos he told kimi to stay in the garage and let kimi take the fall during the post quali conference... and when kimi drove to a podium, he then stuck his hand up to say it was his brilliant strategy all along? Maybe he should join Fernando in Ferrari

Both Alan Permane and Simon Rennie have been around a while and although they made some bad calls last year, they know their 'stuff'. Have won plenty of times in the past so I guess they will be missed. No doubt about it.

As for Ciaron Pilbeam, well..... BAR race engineer 1998/9 - 2005. Then race engineer at RBR until now. So we'll have to wait and see what he brings to the table.

car launch date??????????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hakkattack wrote:car launch date??????????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Not yet announced. Their Twitter feed is good for such details, though it also has a lot of inane chit chat cluttering it.

bbobeckyj wrote:

Hakkattack wrote:car launch date??????????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Not yet announced. Their Twitter feed is good for such details, though it also has a lot of inane chit chat cluttering it.

thanks....

I do follow them on twitter and you are right... I ignore 90% of it


Curious what new paint scheme will be with new sponsors

Launch Date = February 1, isn't it? Same as Merc?

bourbon19 wrote:Launch Date = February 1, isn't it? Same as Merc?

It may well be, but Lotus have said nothing more specific than "next month".

Edit for poor grammar.

Hakkattack wrote:

sandyf1 wrote:

F1nsider wrote:

Jinx wrote:I also heard Permane is gone... dunno if this sound bite is true

Good riddance if true.. I never liked him to be honest

I feel the same way . Thing is permane has friends in the media so there was no way he was going to be criticised for his awful decisions.
I hope lotus go the ferrari and red bull way and do all the calculations and plan the strategy back at enstone.

wow... Permane is a big name, but I have to agree. I heard from a top F1 journalist that Permane told him in Texas that if they had Alonso instead of Kimi this year they would have won the title. If he really said that he is full of it....

Thing is, Raikkonen's qualifying was a big disappointment for me in 2012 - more often than not, Grosjean showed the car's real qualifying potential (or at least its minimum position), and Raikkonen often failed to win races because the car was often out of place on the grid. If he had qualified in *at least* Grosjean's position, one could argue he could have won more races and thus (maybe at a stretch) taken the championship. But that was his only flaw, in my opinion (although it was a *big* one).

Now look at Alonso, he massively out qualified Massa, but that car was no good in qualifying, just like the Lotus, however he was championship contender right up until the last race... Thus Permane's argument might not be too far from the truth.

sgt.hartman wrote:

Hakkattack wrote:

sandyf1 wrote:

F1nsider wrote:

Jinx wrote:I also heard Permane is gone... dunno if this sound bite is true

Good riddance if true.. I never liked him to be honest

I feel the same way . Thing is permane has friends in the media so there was no way he was going to be criticised for his awful decisions.
I hope lotus go the ferrari and red bull way and do all the calculations and plan the strategy back at enstone.

wow... Permane is a big name, but I have to agree. I heard from a top F1 journalist that Permane told him in Texas that if they had Alonso instead of Kimi this year they would have won the title. If he really said that he is full of it....

Thing is, Raikkonen's qualifying was a big disappointment for me in 2012 - more often than not, Grosjean showed the car's real qualifying potential (or at least its minimum position), and Raikkonen often failed to win races because the car was often out of place on the grid. If he had qualified in *at least* Grosjean's position, one could argue he could have won more races and thus (maybe at a stretch) taken the championship. But that was his only flaw, in my opinion (although it was a *big* one).

Now look at Alonso, he massively out qualified Massa, but that car was no good in qualifying, just like the Lotus, however he was championship contender right up until the last race... Thus Permane's argument might not be too far from the truth.

but u ignore the fact that kimi was away for 2 years while grosjean was pirelli tester and recent GP2 champ. On top of that, Kimi had numerous issues (like Kers, Differential, engineers didn't inform him he didn't have enough time for another lap if he didn't speed up, etc) that affected quali quite often. And let us not forget he had to sacrifice many a friday to test important parts like Coanda and DDRS and wasted all his practice/set up time compared to Grosjean. So I dun think Permane's assessment or your assessment is fair. That being said, there were days when he screwed up quali all by himself... I distinctly remembered one - I think he spun at the last minute or something.

Kimi Raikkonen facebook feed (unconfirmed if it's official or imposter) just announced Henri Lloyd as a Lotus sponsor.

Jinx wrote:

sgt.hartman wrote:

Hakkattack wrote:wow... Permane is a big name, but I have to agree. I heard from a top F1 journalist that Permane told him in Texas that if they had Alonso instead of Kimi this year they would have won the title. If he really said that he is full of it....

Thing is, Raikkonen's qualifying was a big disappointment for me in 2012 - more often than not, Grosjean showed the car's real qualifying potential (or at least its minimum position), and Raikkonen often failed to win races because the car was often out of place on the grid. If he had qualified in *at least* Grosjean's position, one could argue he could have won more races and thus (maybe at a stretch) taken the championship. But that was his only flaw, in my opinion (although it was a *big* one).

Now look at Alonso, he massively out qualified Massa, but that car was no good in qualifying, just like the Lotus, however he was championship contender right up until the last race... Thus Permane's argument might not be too far from the truth.

but u ignore the fact that kimi was away for 2 years while grosjean was pirelli tester and recent GP2 champ. On top of that, Kimi had numerous issues (like Kers, Differential, engineers didn't inform him he didn't have enough time for another lap if he didn't speed up, etc) that affected quali quite often. And let us not forget he had to sacrifice many a friday to test important parts like Coanda and DDRS and wasted all his practice/set up time compared to Grosjean. So I dun think Permane's assessment or your assessment is fair. That being said, there were days when he screwed up quali all by himself... I distinctly remembered one - I think he spun at the last minute or something.

He was away, sure, but he was quicker than Grosjean on race day, so why was he slower in qualifying? Issues of KERS, Diff etc aside, Grosjean was generally quicker, thus suggesting he under performed in qualifying. The word for Kimi's qualifying record of 2012, in my opinion, is 'Underwhelming'.

I agree in part on the lack of credible info from his race engineer, I mean I seem to remember his engineer, at the Spanish GP, telling him that Alonso and Maldonado were definitely going to pit again (when it was clear they weren't), so he should take it easy and he'll inherit the lead.

Kimi has never been an amazing qualifier, always faster in the race.

VENEKOR wrote:Kimi has never been an amazing qualifier, always faster in the race.

Right, and thus Permane's suggestion that they could have won the championship with Alonso isn't massively far fetched. Personally I disagree - I don't think the car was fast enough for long enough, but certainly their situation would have been made much better if the car had started races further up the grid, as it was a strong race car.

Crunchy Frog wrote:Kimi Raikkonen facebook feed (unconfirmed if it's official or imposter) just announced Henri Lloyd as a Lotus sponsor.

That's old news, and the team twitter feed often says that he doesn't do social networking, so almost certainly a fake one.

sgt.hartman wrote:

Jinx wrote:
but u ignore the fact that kimi was away for 2 years while grosjean was pirelli tester and recent GP2 champ. On top of that, Kimi had numerous issues (like Kers, Differential, engineers didn't inform him he didn't have enough time for another lap if he didn't speed up, etc) that affected quali quite often. And let us not forget he had to sacrifice many a friday to test important parts like Coanda and DDRS and wasted all his practice/set up time compared to Grosjean. So I dun think Permane's assessment or your assessment is fair. That being said, there were days when he screwed up quali all by himself... I distinctly remembered one - I think he spun at the last minute or something.

He was away, sure, but he was quicker than Grosjean on race day, so why was he slower in qualifying? Issues of KERS, Diff etc aside, Grosjean was generally quicker, thus suggesting he under performed in qualifying. The word for Kimi's qualifying record of 2012, in my opinion, is 'Underwhelming'.

I agree in part on the lack of credible info from his race engineer, I mean I seem to remember his engineer, at the Spanish GP, telling him that Alonso and Maldonado were definitely going to pit again (when it was clear they weren't), so he should take it easy and he'll inherit the lead.

as I said, there were also many fridays he spent testing major "upgrades" and compromised his setup time apart from the other issues. Can you remember how many times they took out those "upgraded" parts only to waste all the precious time to replace those upgraded items back to the older specs? I remembered many a friday wondering why this always had to be on Kimi's shoulders... and then I remembered they use him becos he can keep his cool when he didn't have much to go on, unlike Grosjean. It's just a difference in character although I know Grosjean would also make a fine tester if he didn't have to compete shortly after. So I definitely think Permane's criticisms were uncalled for. If none of these issues had occurred and Kimi had been consistently shaded by Grosjean at quali or raceday, I'd say Kimi would not have retained his seat for 2013. I believe he was also on a very tight leash and he had driven very carefully at the beginning, and we saw how he steadily got back his agression towards the middle and end of the season.

I am also unsure why raceday pace seemed better than quali for Kimi. Or is it that he let the car come to him on raceday (I am purely speculating at this point as I am not a techie )

Plus, almost the whole first half of the season they were wasting full FP sessions to change steerings to check them.

After things have stabalised he was faster than Romain almost all the time

teething problems hopefully resolved

So do we know for sure Permane is gone? Have not seen it anywhere other than here

I don't know why he would say something of that nature anyway. It is foolish on many levels. But you can't stop a man from running his mouth anymore than you can stop the earth spinning (the latter might actually be easier )


Meanwhile, Kimi has reportedly signed up for an ice race in Russia. If this is old news, I apologize, I don't have time to parse the thread and read all the posts right now. Here is the story: http://www.thef1times.com/news/display/07181

Kimi, Petrov and Pic will be racing in that event

E21 will be launched on January 28th on their Youtube page via live stream

http://www.youtube.com/lotusf1team at 7:15 pm their time on Monday.

The car sounds fantastic

Monday duty for Kimi hahaha...I hope Lotus will be more stronger than last year...as they know the driving nature of both driver and also more data to try different setup...I hope tyre heat problem in low temperature track is resolved

Something from MTV3, courtesy to Nicole


Race engineer remembers: This is how Kimi Räikkönen was found


The organizer of Kimi Räikkönen's first F1-contract, engineer Jacky Eeckelaert, tells to MTV3 how Räikkönen came to F1 with Sauber-team.

Eeckelaert was Räikkönen's engineer in Kimi's first test in September 2000 and he was also his race engineer in Sauber during season 2001.

Räikkönen's F1-test took place in a situation where Sauber was looking for a replacement for Mika Salo, who was going to Toyota-team. Eeckelaert contacted managers Steve and David Robertson in order to ask about Jenson Button's contract. Button had debuted with Williams in season 2000 but he lost his seat to Juan Pablo Montoya for season 2001, hence the Sauber-team was interested to know if the Brit would still be available on the market. But Button headed to Renault under Briatore's wings. The Robertsons offered Räikkönen to Eeckelaert instead of Button.

– This guy is very good, just like Jenson Button is, but only with a different personality. He has a very, very strong character because he has done many things independently without a budget. He is very committed, Robertsons described the young Räikkönen.

Sauber-team had already signed Nick Heidfeld for season 2001 and he had one F1-season in his pocket. The team dared to consider a rookie-driver in their team so they offered Räikkönen a F1-test. Before that Räikkönen had only one full season in Formula Renault -serie in his pocket.

Räikkönen drove his first test with Sauber's C19-car on Mugello's track on 12th September 2000. Eeckelaert was especially concerned about how Räikkönen's neck would endure the F1-car's G-powers, hence they made him drive only three quali-laps in the beginning. During the breaks Eeckelaert and Räikkönen compared their telemetry to Salo's and Pedro Diniz's telemetry from the earlier test. Räikkönen finished 29 laps during the first day. His laptime was 2,5 seconds slower than Diniz's on that same day, but Eeckelaert was assured that they would see an improvement in speed once Räikkönen's brains would adjust to a situation where everything moves faster.

During his second test-day Räikkönen drove already 40 laps and improved his time to 1.27,130, which was clearly an even bigger improvement than they expected from the opening day's laptime 1.30,008. By analyzing telemetry Räikkönen found new breaking points and right driving angles to corners.

Michael Schumacher from Ferrari was also driving on the track during the 3-day test.

– Of course Schumacher stopped by to ask: who is this driver who is testing for you? Eeckelaert remembers.

– When I replied that it's Kimi Räikkönen, Schumacher said: "he cam be fast, he can be fast", Eeckelaert continues..

First Peter Sauber thought of hiring Räikkönen as a test driver, but Eeckelaert adviced him to take the Finn as a racing driver. During the three test days it became clear that Räikkönen is a very talented and fast driver, but his physical condition didn't yet endure a GP with 60 laps. Hence Räikkönen started to work with Ayrton Senna's former trainer so that he would get in shape for races.

Räikkönen drove his second F1-test in Mugello on 28th September. In laptime-comparison he left Enrique Bernoldi slightly behind him, Enrique was also looking for a seat in Sauber with their sponsor Red Bull's support. The engineer thought that the most convincing matter was how the young Finn evaluated his car's setup-changes. Despite their sponsor's requirements Peter Sauber chose Räikkösen as the driver in his team.

Räikkönen debuted as a Sauber-driver in Australia GP on March 4th in 2001 and immediately drove to points by finishing 6th. From that day on he has achieved 19 GP-victories, 69 podiums and 37 fastest laps.

http://www.mtv3.fi/urheilu/f1/uutiset.s ... a-ykkosiin

Apparently James Allison on the way out too!

If thats the case, along with the rumours about Simon and Alan, one word comes to mind...........

DOOMED!