2017 Mexican Grand Prix Race Thread

UnlikeUday · Post by **UnlikeUday** » Sat Oct 28, 2017 7:07 pm

Not possible to predict the winner of the tomorrow but a great race is expected.

Invade · Post by **Invade** » Sat Oct 28, 2017 7:16 pm

Three-way battle Vettel-Verstappen-Hamilton.

But we await the result of the steward decision for the incident with Bottas and Verstappen.

mmi16 · Post by **mmi16** » Sat Oct 28, 2017 7:31 pm

Since the track has been slicker than snot all weekend - will they go out and pretreat it for the race with Taco grease?

Clarky · Post by **Clarky** » Sat Oct 28, 2017 7:49 pm

Hamilton had superb pace yesterday so it will be interesting

kleefton · Post by **kleefton** » Sat Oct 28, 2017 8:13 pm

I dont think the merc will be the strongest in this race. The fastest car in the race is probably verstappens redbull. Assuming there are no shenanigans at turn 1 it should be exciting to watch max seb and lewis going at it. Its a shame this circuit is historically not good for overtaking but the different strategies will be fascinating to follow regardless.

Zoue · Post by **Zoue** » Sat Oct 28, 2017 8:21 pm

It's quite impressive how the Red Bulls have managed to get so competitive these last few races, especially since their PU is not supposed to be as good as the others. I'll bet McLaren can't wait until next year!

I see Max winning this one, or else having an accident while trying to. Vettel can't afford to play for points and only a win will do, so I suspect neither will give any quarter. First corner will be interesting - wonder if Vettel will be able to get away with Hamilton's little trick from last year?

j man · Post by **j man** » Sat Oct 28, 2017 8:25 pm

Zoue wrote:It's quite impressive how the Red Bulls have managed to get so competitive these last few races, especially since their PU is not supposed to be as good as the others. I'll bet McLaren can't wait until next year!

I see Max winning this one, or else having an accident while trying to. Vettel can't afford to play for points and only a win will do, so I suspect neither will give any quarter. First corner will be interesting - wonder if Vettel will be able to get away with Hamilton's little trick from last year?

Thankfully they've put the new higher kerbs in at the first turn, I think going off on the first lap will almost certainly result in lost positions now.

Lotus49 · Post by **Lotus49** » Sat Oct 28, 2017 8:28 pm

Zoue wrote:It's quite impressive how the Red Bulls have managed to get so competitive these last few races, especially since their PU is not supposed to be as good as the others. I'll bet McLaren can't wait until next year!

I see Max winning this one, or else having an accident while trying to. Vettel can't afford to play for points and only a win will do, so I suspect neither will give any quarter. First corner will be interesting - wonder if Vettel will be able to get away with Hamilton's little trick from last year?

Sausage kerbs been added there I think.

This is just about perfect for Lewis for reasons you touch on. Seb can't afford to yield or his slim title chance is done. Max has been the best starter this year and just about never yields. They're going to be with each other in T1...

Lewis could be leading a Mercedes 1-2 by T3 tomorrow..

lamo · Post by **lamo** » Sat Oct 28, 2017 8:51 pm

Vettel will win the title with 2nd-1st-1st so I think finishing 2nd doesn't change his odds that much at all. He requires basically 3 DNFs for Hamilton.

Herb Tarlik · Post by **Herb Tarlik** » Sat Oct 28, 2017 9:56 pm

Zoue wrote:It's quite impressive how the Red Bulls have managed to get so competitive these last few races, especially since their PU is not supposed to be as good as the others. I'll bet McLaren can't wait until next year!

Yep. Every single session we see the wisdom that McLaren had to dump Honda.

Next year can't come soon enough for those two drivers.

ReservoirDog · Post by **ReservoirDog** » Sat Oct 28, 2017 11:01 pm

The first corner is going to be amaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaazing!!!

TheGiantHogweed · Post by **TheGiantHogweed** » Sat Oct 28, 2017 11:13 pm

Zoue wrote:It's quite impressive how the Red Bulls have managed to get so competitive these last few races, especially since their PU is not supposed to be as good as the others. I'll bet McLaren can't wait until next year!

I see Max winning this one, or else having an accident while trying to. Vettel can't afford to play for points and only a win will do, so I suspect neither will give any quarter. First corner will be interesting - wonder if Vettel will be able to get away with Hamilton's little trick from last year?

Those words are a little funny. If Red Bull's engine turned out to be better, are they really not supposed to be up there? As if it is a naughty thing to do

KingVoid · Post by **KingVoid** » Sat Oct 28, 2017 11:18 pm

Hamilton has 3.5 kph on Vettel and 5.8 kph on Verstappen

If he gets anything resembling a good start he'll be past them halfway down the straight, same for Bottas.

lamo · Post by **lamo** » Sat Oct 28, 2017 11:24 pm

3.5 kpmh is nothing, especially at that altitude. The slipstream affect here is lower than anywhere else. When there is a long run to turn 1, starting 2nd can be the place to be with these draggy cars but I doubt that will be the case tomorrow due to the thin air.

Hamilton reckons you need to be 1.4 seconds a lap quicker to overtake here, with how close the front cars are. We won't see any overtaking tomorrow.

MasterRacer · Post by **MasterRacer** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 2:53 am

lamo wrote:We won't see any overtaking tomorrow.

There's always the chance Max will find another shortcut.

F1_Ernie · Post by **F1_Ernie** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 7:17 am

kleefton wrote:I dont think the merc will be the strongest in this race. The fastest car in the race is probably verstappens redbull. Assuming there are no shenanigans at turn 1 it should be exciting to watch max seb and lewis going at it. Its a shame this circuit is historically not good for overtaking but the different strategies will be fascinating to follow regardless.

It's a one stop race so not alot you can do with strategies.

UnlikeUday · Post by **UnlikeUday** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 7:34 am

The revised grid:

1 Sebastian Vettel
2 Max Verstappen
3 Lewis Hamilton
4 Valtteri Bottas
5 Kimi Raikkonen
6 Esteban Ocon
7 Daniel Ricciardo
8 Nico Hulkenberg
9 Carlos Sainz
10 Sergio Perez
11 Felipe Massa
12 Lance Stroll
13 Brendon Hartley
14 Marcus Ericsson
15 Pascal Wehrlein
16 Kevin Magnussen
17 Romain Grosjean
18 Fernando Alonso *
19 Stoffel Vandoorne **
20 Pierre Gasly ***

* 20-place power unit element penalty
** 35-place power unit element penalty
*** 15-place power unit element penalty

F1Tyrant · Post by **F1Tyrant** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 8:32 am

Hamilton is in a really interesting position as his fourth title is entirely dependent on the racing gods. Does he try to win this race for the kudos and the cherry on top at the risk of straining his machinery? Or run a conservative engine mode and ensure he finishes fifth? I'd imagine it would be the former after what happened in 2007.

Verstappen vs Vettel is going to be great though. Max has no respect for Vettel and will want to give him a bloody nose after Singapore.

Llotyhy · Post by **Llotyhy** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 9:02 am

Dutch commentator Olav Mol says Red Bull are changing Ricciardo's engine, so at least +20. Unconfirmed so far I think.

F1_Ernie · Post by **F1_Ernie** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 9:40 am

Llotyhy wrote:Dutch commentator Olav Mol says Red Bull are changing Ricciardo's engine, so at least +20. Unconfirmed so far I think.

I have read the same on Amus.

j man · Post by **j man** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 10:12 am

lamo wrote:3.5 kpmh is nothing, especially at that altitude. The slipstream affect here is lower than anywhere else. When there is a long run to turn 1, starting 2nd can be the place to be with these draggy cars but I doubt that will be the case tomorrow due to the thin air.

Hamilton reckons you need to be 1.4 seconds a lap quicker to overtake here, with how close the front cars are. We won't see any overtaking tomorrow.

This surprises me a little. Surely if the slipstream effect is diminished by the altitude, then the turbulent air effect is too? So it should be easier to follow other cars more closely?

Herb Tarlik · Post by **Herb Tarlik** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 11:22 am

F1Tyrant wrote:Hamilton is in a really interesting position as his fourth title is entirely dependent on the racing gods.

What????

F1Tyrant · Post by **F1Tyrant** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 11:32 am

Herb Tarlik wrote:What????

If Hamilton has three reliability issues which causes DNFs in the last three races, there is nothing much he can do. It's the will of the racing gods/bad luck.

UnlikeUday · Post by **UnlikeUday** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 11:52 am

Best pit strategy for the race:

According to Pirelli, a one-stopper is going to be the most effective strategy for this afternoon’s 71-lap race, starting on the ultrasoft-compound tyres and running for 30-34 laps, then taking supersofts for the remainder.

If there is a Safety Car deployment or a driver gets trapped in traffic, a one-stopper with an opening stint of 16 laps on ultrasofts and a second stint on softs to the flag could also be useful.

Also interesting could be a two-stopper with two 25-lap stints on ultrasofts and one on supersofts to the finish.

kleefton · Post by **kleefton** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 11:54 am

F1_Ernie wrote:
kleefton wrote:I dont think the merc will be the strongest in this race. The fastest car in the race is probably verstappens redbull. Assuming there are no shenanigans at turn 1 it should be exciting to watch max seb and lewis going at it. Its a shame this circuit is historically not good for overtaking but the different strategies will be fascinating to follow regardless.
It's a one stop race so not alot you can do with strategies.

I doubt everyone will go to one stop. At the end of the day a safety car period is pretty likely and even if it doesnt happen guys are gonna try alternate strategies when they realize they cannot overtake on similar aged tires. Ill be surprised if thats not the case.

Herb Tarlik · Post by **Herb Tarlik** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 12:17 pm

F1Tyrant wrote:
Herb Tarlik wrote:What????
If Hamilton has three reliability issues which causes DNFs in the last three races, there is nothing much he can do. It's the will of the racing gods/bad luck.

And how is this different from every other driver that ever contended for a WDC?

F1_Ernie · Post by **F1_Ernie** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 12:23 pm

kleefton wrote:
F1_Ernie wrote:
kleefton wrote:I dont think the merc will be the strongest in this race. The fastest car in the race is probably verstappens redbull. Assuming there are no shenanigans at turn 1 it should be exciting to watch max seb and lewis going at it. Its a shame this circuit is historically not good for overtaking but the different strategies will be fascinating to follow regardless.
It's a one stop race so not alot you can do with strategies.
I doubt everyone will go to one stop. At the end of the day a safety car period is pretty likely and even if it doesnt happen guys are gonna try alternate strategies when they realize they cannot overtake on similar aged tires. Ill be surprised if thats not the case.

I hope your right but most races have been 1 stoppers and rarely anything happens with strategy. Vettel only pitted twice in Austin because the lack of running on Friday which meant his setup was eating his tyres.

Looks like Ferrari will go US then soft as they have used all there SS tyres, not that it matters because a few laps on the SS won’t hurt with such low tyre deg. RB and Mercedes have a new pair of SS so can be more variable.

TheGiantHogweed · Post by **TheGiantHogweed** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 1:15 pm

UnlikeUday wrote:The revised grid:

1 Sebastian Vettel
2 Max Verstappen
3 Lewis Hamilton
4 Valtteri Bottas
5 Kimi Raikkonen
6 Esteban Ocon
7 Daniel Ricciardo
8 Nico Hulkenberg
9 Carlos Sainz
10 Sergio Perez
11 Felipe Massa
12 Lance Stroll
13 Brendon Hartley
14 Marcus Ericsson
15 Pascal Wehrlein
16 Kevin Magnussen
17 Romain Grosjean
18 Fernando Alonso *
19 Stoffel Vandoorne **
20 Pierre Gasly ***

* 20-place power unit element penalty
** 35-place power unit element penalty
*** 15-place power unit element penalty

If Sauber do a risky strategy with Ericsson, it could result in points this weekend. He started 16th last year I think and then finished 11th when only a Manor retired. If there are some retirements of quicker cars, there will be quite a strong possibility of points for Sauber. Ericsson certainly is decent here.

UnlikeUday · Post by **UnlikeUday** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 1:32 pm

Due to the high altitude & thin air, teams are worried regarding cooling issues for engines & brakes. Running in slipstream could be worse when taken cooling into account.

Haas could be in trouble just when it comes to brakes whereas Renault engines in general could be a little more vulnerable when compared to Ferrari & Mercedes. Honda may be running on thin ice as well.

GingerFurball · Post by **GingerFurball** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 1:36 pm

F1Tyrant wrote:Hamilton is in a really interesting position as his fourth title is entirely dependent on the racing gods. Does he try to win this race for the kudos and the cherry on top at the risk of straining his machinery? Or run a conservative engine mode and ensure he finishes fifth? I'd imagine it would be the former after what happened in 2007.

Verstappen vs Vettel is going to be great though. Max has no respect for Vettel and will want to give him a bloody nose after Singapore.

He'll win when Vettel and Verstappen take each other out at the first corner when they play chicken with each other.

lamo · Post by **lamo** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 1:54 pm

I feel its a case of who Max will take out at turn 1, if he makes a bad start - then it could be Hamilton. If he makes a good start it could be Vettel. If they all make good starts and arrive into turn 1 side by side I would say its a 50% chance he collides with at least one of them.

UnlikeUday · Post by **UnlikeUday** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 3:15 pm

Ricciardo will be starting from back of the grid after an engine change:
https://www.f1today.net/en/news/f1/2329 ... mexican-gp

Option or Prime · Post by **Option or Prime** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 3:39 pm

My guess:
Vettel and Verstappen to have a clean first lap with Hamilton in 3rd, but battling with each other forces a two stop strategy for both letting the Mercedes to get though, can they hold off the Ferraris and Reb Bulls who are charging at the end of the race? The only DNF's will be engines failures.

UnlikeUday · Post by **UnlikeUday** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 3:47 pm

The big sausage kerbs installed at turn 1 to deter gaining time through grass will see some mayhem.

The previous 2 outings at Mexico have seen a safety car outing. This year may also have another outing.

SDLRob · Post by **SDLRob** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 6:21 pm

interesting comments by Lewis on Sky....

lucifers · Post by **lucifers** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 6:23 pm

SDLRob wrote:interesting comments by Lewis on Sky....

yip

lamo · Post by **lamo** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 6:26 pm

What did Lewis say on sky?

SDLRob · Post by **SDLRob** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 6:30 pm

he spoke about the kitchen chat with Toto... he also suggested that the COTA stewards failed to do their job properly regarding track limits

Herb Tarlik · Post by **Herb Tarlik** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 6:45 pm

I am NOT going to miss this clown Will Buxton. Good god, he is PAINFUL to listen to.

Herb Tarlik · Post by **Herb Tarlik** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 6:47 pm

That's an unusually noisy minute of silence.