The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

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SmoothRide
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Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by SmoothRide »

Prema wrote:
SmoothRide wrote:
Prema wrote: Maybe rather the opposite could be the case, Lewis showing to the world what that hurts him inside of him. He is weak. He radioed to the team during the race "The battle's not over, boys". That is his mental stage, 6 races into the season. He is about to give it up mentally.
How does that show that Hamilton is weak? He is perhaps getting worried about the fact that Ferrari can run with, and often outrun the Merc car at any given track, but that's quite normal. He didn't have to worry about competitors, aside from his teammate, for quite a while. He has won plenty of races against competitive cars fielded by other teams though. I don't see any evidence that he is ready to "give it up mentally".
You have to look this in the context of the post that I was replying to, and that stated how Lewis walked out from Monaco with gaining some mental advantage. No kidding. Failing miserably, witnessing Vettel's triumph, who got 100% team's backing, and then going bubbling something to a reporter as if that is to move a blade of grass in any way and make any difference in the world. That is rather the sign of being weak.
I don't think Hamilton walked away from Monaco with a mental advantage, but I don't see why he would or should be perceived as weak. Where does that come from? I am not a fan of Hamilton; I appreciate his talent, which I think is extraordinary, though I don't like his general attitude. I have seen enough of his skill and perseverance that I would never label him as weak though. I am sorry, but that's preposterous.
Prema wrote: And Lewis trying to lift the spirits to the "boys" how all is not over yet, that is the evidence of his mind dwelling over the thought how it all could be over (but hey, not yet) while driving there out. That is mental. It could be the question of but one or two such flops, and a half-baked thought could become a full baked one. Say a DNF in Canada, Vettel wins, 50 points in between, Toto just stating how Ferrari is good all-over car on all tracks and in the hands of both their drivers, and how Merc can't figure out the tyres and are not able to manage the right operating window.... good going. Mentally in advantage, ha!
Otherwise, what "evidence" may be there, it is subjective.
What would you expect him to do then? Throw in the towel and submit to defeat? I think it's quite natural that Mercedes will take the fight to Ferrari throughout the season. Despite the setbacks they have faced at Monaco, and some of the previous races, they still have a very good car, and very good drivers. I seriously doubt that they will just mentally collapse due to some adversity. This applies to the drivers and the entire team personnel.

mikeyg123
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Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by mikeyg123 »

Prema wrote:
SmoothRide wrote:
Prema wrote: Maybe rather the opposite could be the case, Lewis showing to the world what that hurts him inside of him. He is weak. He radioed to the team during the race "The battle's not over, boys". That is his mental stage, 6 races into the season. He is about to give it up mentally.
How does that show that Hamilton is weak? He is perhaps getting worried about the fact that Ferrari can run with, and often outrun the Merc car at any given track, but that's quite normal. He didn't have to worry about competitors, aside from his teammate, for quite a while. He has won plenty of races against competitive cars fielded by other teams though. I don't see any evidence that he is ready to "give it up mentally".
You have to look this in the context of the post that I was replying to, and that stated how Lewis walked out from Monaco with gaining some mental advantage. No kidding. Failing miserably, witnessing Vettel's triumph, who got 100% team's backing, and then going bubbling something to a reporter as if that is to move a blade of grass in any way and make any difference in the world. That is rather the sign of being weak.

And Lewis trying to lift the spirits to the "boys" how all is not over yet, that is the evidence of his mind dwelling over the thought how it all could be over (but hey, not yet) while driving there out. That is mental. It could be the question of but one or two such flops, and a half-baked thought could become a full baked one. Say a DNF in Canada, Vettel wins, 50 points in between, Toto just stating how Ferrari is good all-over car on all tracks and in the hands of both their drivers, and how Merc can't figure out the tyres and are not able to manage the right operating window.... good going. Mentally in advantage, ha!
Otherwise, what "evidence" may be there, it is subjective.
You're talking about the driver here who won four consecutive races after a mechanical failure put the title out of his hands in Malaysia last year.

Hamilton isn't mentally weak.

Being emotional does not in itself make one weak.

That being said, I think talk of Hamilton having any kind of "mental" edge over Vettel is ridiculous. The only advantage Vettel will care about is his 25 point one. Both drivers know this is a defining season, going head to head in fairy equal cars. So far Vettel has been the better and has had slightly the better car over the first 6 races. Hamilton could easily strike back though. Especially with Canada next up.

F1_Ernie
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Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by F1_Ernie »

mikeyg123 wrote:
Prema wrote:
SmoothRide wrote:
Prema wrote: Maybe rather the opposite could be the case, Lewis showing to the world what that hurts him inside of him. He is weak. He radioed to the team during the race "The battle's not over, boys". That is his mental stage, 6 races into the season. He is about to give it up mentally.
How does that show that Hamilton is weak? He is perhaps getting worried about the fact that Ferrari can run with, and often outrun the Merc car at any given track, but that's quite normal. He didn't have to worry about competitors, aside from his teammate, for quite a while. He has won plenty of races against competitive cars fielded by other teams though. I don't see any evidence that he is ready to "give it up mentally".
You have to look this in the context of the post that I was replying to, and that stated how Lewis walked out from Monaco with gaining some mental advantage. No kidding. Failing miserably, witnessing Vettel's triumph, who got 100% team's backing, and then going bubbling something to a reporter as if that is to move a blade of grass in any way and make any difference in the world. That is rather the sign of being weak.

And Lewis trying to lift the spirits to the "boys" how all is not over yet, that is the evidence of his mind dwelling over the thought how it all could be over (but hey, not yet) while driving there out. That is mental. It could be the question of but one or two such flops, and a half-baked thought could become a full baked one. Say a DNF in Canada, Vettel wins, 50 points in between, Toto just stating how Ferrari is good all-over car on all tracks and in the hands of both their drivers, and how Merc can't figure out the tyres and are not able to manage the right operating window.... good going. Mentally in advantage, ha!
Otherwise, what "evidence" may be there, it is subjective.
You're talking about the driver here who won four consecutive races after a mechanical failure put the title out of his hands in Malaysia last year.

Hamilton isn't mentally weak.

Being emotional does not in itself make one weak.

That being said, I think talk of Hamilton having any kind of "mental" edge over Vettel is ridiculous. The only advantage Vettel will care about is his 25 point one. Both drivers know this is a defining season, going head to head in fairy equal cars. So far Vettel has been the better and has had slightly the better car over the first 6 races. Hamilton could easily strike back though. Especially with Canada next up.
Spot on mikey :thumbup:
PF1 Pick 10 Competition

2016: 24th place
2017: 4th place
2018: 12th place

Wins: Spain 2016, Canada 2017, Malaysia 2017
Podiums: 2nd Germany 2016, 3rd Mexico 2016, 3rd China 2018, 3rd Japan 2018, 2nd Mexico 2018

kleefton
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Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2012 11:14 pm

Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by kleefton »

mikeyg123 wrote:
Prema wrote:
SmoothRide wrote:
Prema wrote: Maybe rather the opposite could be the case, Lewis showing to the world what that hurts him inside of him. He is weak. He radioed to the team during the race "The battle's not over, boys". That is his mental stage, 6 races into the season. He is about to give it up mentally.
How does that show that Hamilton is weak? He is perhaps getting worried about the fact that Ferrari can run with, and often outrun the Merc car at any given track, but that's quite normal. He didn't have to worry about competitors, aside from his teammate, for quite a while. He has won plenty of races against competitive cars fielded by other teams though. I don't see any evidence that he is ready to "give it up mentally".
You have to look this in the context of the post that I was replying to, and that stated how Lewis walked out from Monaco with gaining some mental advantage. No kidding. Failing miserably, witnessing Vettel's triumph, who got 100% team's backing, and then going bubbling something to a reporter as if that is to move a blade of grass in any way and make any difference in the world. That is rather the sign of being weak.

And Lewis trying to lift the spirits to the "boys" how all is not over yet, that is the evidence of his mind dwelling over the thought how it all could be over (but hey, not yet) while driving there out. That is mental. It could be the question of but one or two such flops, and a half-baked thought could become a full baked one. Say a DNF in Canada, Vettel wins, 50 points in between, Toto just stating how Ferrari is good all-over car on all tracks and in the hands of both their drivers, and how Merc can't figure out the tyres and are not able to manage the right operating window.... good going. Mentally in advantage, ha!
Otherwise, what "evidence" may be there, it is subjective.
You're talking about the driver here who won four consecutive races after a mechanical failure put the title out of his hands in Malaysia last year.

Hamilton isn't mentally weak.

Being emotional does not in itself make one weak.

That being said, I think talk of Hamilton having any kind of "mental" edge over Vettel is ridiculous. The only advantage Vettel will care about is his 25 point one. Both drivers know this is a defining season, going head to head in fairy equal cars. So far Vettel has been the better and has had slightly the better car over the first 6 races. Hamilton could easily strike back though. Especially with Canada next up.
True story. Those mental weakness comments are so ridiculous. If you look at Lewis's history there are numerous examples which show he isn't mentally weak.

I actually think that Lewis thrives when there is adversity. He always performs better when he is being pressured or he has to come back from less than ideal situations. Last year after Malaysia the last few races were some of the best driving he's ever done. Even Rosberg said that recently. I also think that when he said that Vettel shouldn't have won the race it wasn't mind games. First off it was right after the race so the adrenaline was still pumping and he couldn't have been aware of all of the facts. Secondly I just think he's trying to give himself more reason to be fired up and come back strong. I'm sure that if he gets asked about it again he will have a different tune.

I expect him to bounce back strong in Canada and Baku. In fact I really think he's going to win both of them. Imo those circuits favor the Merc and Lewis knows that he must win a few in a row now.

We shall see. Hopefully his car doesn't break down.

Prema
Posts: 6650
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Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by Prema »

mikeyg123 wrote:
Prema wrote:
SmoothRide wrote:
Prema wrote: Maybe rather the opposite could be the case, Lewis showing to the world what that hurts him inside of him. He is weak. He radioed to the team during the race "The battle's not over, boys". That is his mental stage, 6 races into the season. He is about to give it up mentally.
How does that show that Hamilton is weak? He is perhaps getting worried about the fact that Ferrari can run with, and often outrun the Merc car at any given track, but that's quite normal. He didn't have to worry about competitors, aside from his teammate, for quite a while. He has won plenty of races against competitive cars fielded by other teams though. I don't see any evidence that he is ready to "give it up mentally".
You have to look this in the context of the post that I was replying to, and that stated how Lewis walked out from Monaco with gaining some mental advantage. No kidding. Failing miserably, witnessing Vettel's triumph, who got 100% team's backing, and then going bubbling something to a reporter as if that is to move a blade of grass in any way and make any difference in the world. That is rather the sign of being weak.

And Lewis trying to lift the spirits to the "boys" how all is not over yet, that is the evidence of his mind dwelling over the thought how it all could be over (but hey, not yet) while driving there out. That is mental. It could be the question of but one or two such flops, and a half-baked thought could become a full baked one. Say a DNF in Canada, Vettel wins, 50 points in between, Toto just stating how Ferrari is good all-over car on all tracks and in the hands of both their drivers, and how Merc can't figure out the tyres and are not able to manage the right operating window.... good going. Mentally in advantage, ha!
Otherwise, what "evidence" may be there, it is subjective.
You're talking about the driver here who won four consecutive races after a mechanical failure put the title out of his hands in Malaysia last year.

Hamilton isn't mentally weak.

Being emotional does not in itself make one weak.

That being said, I think talk of Hamilton having any kind of "mental" edge over Vettel is ridiculous. The only advantage Vettel will care about is his 25 point one. Both drivers know this is a defining season, going head to head in fairy equal cars. So far Vettel has been the better and has had slightly the better car over the first 6 races. Hamilton could easily strike back though. Especially with Canada next up.
But you are not taking about the driver from the previous race, are you? "Being emotional" comes handy when an elite sportsman takes a dive, doesn't it. What exactly do you think "being emotional" in this instance would go for anyway? Being emotional about animal mistreatment in the world perhaps, or about the prospects of winning the WDC having just received the major hit and preaching to oneself that all is not over yet (6 races down)?

Ups and downs. I spoke about the present moment. The coming race will be of a great significance here. He could blossom, or he could drop deep south... depending on what happens.

Prema
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Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by Prema »

And regarding those examples from the last year, sure. But you need also to pay attention to specifics. Hamilton had the car that virtually guaranteed the win, bar a misfortune. He had to beat his teammate. Period. That was his motivation even if the chances for the title were not great. He would go all in for beating Rosberg every single race even if the title had been decided for Rosberg already. There you do not even need a mental strength, but a strong motivation to beat that pesky Rosberg and not let him beat you.

That's gone now. Now he is apparently already contemplating that "emotional" moment when "all is over, boys". Hasn't happen yet, granted. Looks like it very much could be in the hands of the... boys.

mikeyg123
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Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by mikeyg123 »

Prema wrote:And regarding those examples from the last year, sure. But you need also to pay attention to specifics. Hamilton had the car that virtually guaranteed the win, bar a misfortune. He had to beat his teammate. Period. That was his motivation even if the chances for the title were not great. He would go all in for beating Rosberg every single race even if the title had been decided for Rosberg already. There you do not even need a mental strength, but a strong motivation to beat that pesky Rosberg and not let him beat you.

That's gone now. Now he is apparently already contemplating that "emotional" moment when "all is over, boys". Hasn't happen yet, granted. Looks like it very much could be in the hands of the... boys.
None of what you written explains how someone "mentally weak" was able to be mentally strong?

Surely if you are mentally weak that is that. Having motivation not to be is not just suddenly going to make you mentally strong.

As I said - being emotional does not automatically have to be a weakness. Just because you feel something does not mean you have to succumb to it.

Prema
Posts: 6650
Joined: Sat Mar 16, 2013 1:40 pm

Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by Prema »

mikeyg123 wrote:
Prema wrote:And regarding those examples from the last year, sure. But you need also to pay attention to specifics. Hamilton had the car that virtually guaranteed the win, bar a misfortune. He had to beat his teammate. Period. That was his motivation even if the chances for the title were not great. He would go all in for beating Rosberg every single race even if the title had been decided for Rosberg already. There you do not even need a mental strength, but a strong motivation to beat that pesky Rosberg and not let him beat you.

That's gone now. Now he is apparently already contemplating that "emotional" moment when "all is over, boys". Hasn't happen yet, granted. Looks like it very much could be in the hands of the... boys.
None of what you written explains how someone "mentally weak" was able to be mentally strong?

Surely if you are mentally weak that is that. Having motivation not to be is not just suddenly going to make you mentally strong.

As I said - being emotional does not automatically have to be a weakness. Just because you feel something does not mean you have to succumb to it.
Sure it does explain. Maybe not to you, but that would be another thing.
You are apparently coming from the position that people have their minds' level of strength be flat and fixed as God gave them at the time of their birth, and so throughout their lives and whatever situations. Further more, either it is "weak" or "strong" and nothing in between.

And sure, being emotional is not to be seen as a mental weakness by de fault. Such as to love flowers, for example. People are mixing that with "machoism" and "manning up" and the "strength of mind" and such silliness. Otherwise, if you feel that there is no hope, that all is lost, if you feel depressed and bewildered, then that itself is already succumbing to it. Or otherwise you don't feel it. That is what does make someone be mentally weak. Or the other way, if you feel that everything is aligned for you to succeed, you are mentally strong. I am surprised that you would separate whatever emotional state of mind/heart from the general state of mind itself (and strength of mind is the state of mind). You can't be considered mentally strong and at the same time contemplate if to hang yourself or not due to an overwhelming feeling of meaningless and hopelessness in life, can you?
(and I am not referring to Hamilton himself here in any way, ok?)

It's funny that you folks can't acknowledge even the possibility of Hamilton getting mentally weak in some situations. That can happen to greater heroes even.
Last edited by Prema on Sun Jun 04, 2017 8:56 am, edited 1 time in total.

mikeyg123
Posts: 18462
Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2012 4:13 pm

Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by mikeyg123 »

Prema wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Prema wrote:And regarding those examples from the last year, sure. But you need also to pay attention to specifics. Hamilton had the car that virtually guaranteed the win, bar a misfortune. He had to beat his teammate. Period. That was his motivation even if the chances for the title were not great. He would go all in for beating Rosberg every single race even if the title had been decided for Rosberg already. There you do not even need a mental strength, but a strong motivation to beat that pesky Rosberg and not let him beat you.

That's gone now. Now he is apparently already contemplating that "emotional" moment when "all is over, boys". Hasn't happen yet, granted. Looks like it very much could be in the hands of the... boys.
None of what you written explains how someone "mentally weak" was able to be mentally strong?

Surely if you are mentally weak that is that. Having motivation not to be is not just suddenly going to make you mentally strong.

As I said - being emotional does not automatically have to be a weakness. Just because you feel something does not mean you have to succumb to it.
Sure it does explain. Maybe not to you, but that would be another thing.
You are apparently coming from the position that people have their minds' level of strength be flat and fixed as God gave them at the time of their birth, and so throughout their lives and whatever situations. Further more, either it is "weak" or "strong" and nothing in between.

And sure, being emotional is not to be seen as a mental weakness by de fault. Such as to love flowers, for example. People are mixing that with "machoism" and "manning up" and the "strength of mind" and such silliness. Otherwise, if you feel that there is no hope, that all is lost, if you feel depressed and bewildered, then that itself is already succumbing to it. That is what does make one mentally weak. Or the other way, if you feel that everything is aligned for you to succeed, you are mentally strong. I am surprised that you would separate whatever emotional state of mind/heart from the general state of mind itself (and strength of mind is the state of mind). You can't be considered mentally strong and at the same time contemplate if to hang yourself or not due to an overwhelming feeling of meaningless and hopelessness in life, can you?

It's funny that you folks can't acknowledge even the possibility of Hamilton getting mentally weak in some situations. That can happen to greater heroes even.
I just find it bizarre that you assume Hamilton's mental weakness will be a factor when the latest evidence we have is Hamilton showing mental resilience.

I think Hamilton in the past has had issues with his mental state but those days are gone. I get fed up with people just assuming because he happens to be comfortable showing more emotions than most that he would be mentally weak.

Prema
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Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by Prema »

mikeyg123 wrote: I just find it bizarre that you assume Hamilton's mental weakness will be a factor when the latest evidence we have is Hamilton showing mental resilience.

I think Hamilton in the past has had issues with his mental state but those days are gone. I get fed up with people just assuming because he happens to be comfortable showing more emotions than most that he would be mentally weak.
Well, normal humans do get affected by the state of their minds such as weakness. But then, it's Hamilton we are talking about here, so my "assumption" must be bizarre by de fault. Obviously so.

What I am predicting is that, shall the next race or two go Vettel's way, we will see more of Hamilton "showing emotions" of a kind. If so, then you might keep referring to it as his "mental strength" if you please.

mikeyg123
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Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2012 4:13 pm

Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by mikeyg123 »

Prema wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote: I just find it bizarre that you assume Hamilton's mental weakness will be a factor when the latest evidence we have is Hamilton showing mental resilience.

I think Hamilton in the past has had issues with his mental state but those days are gone. I get fed up with people just assuming because he happens to be comfortable showing more emotions than most that he would be mentally weak.
Well, normal humans do get affected by the state of their minds such as weakness. But then, it's Hamilton we are talking about here, so my "assumption" must be bizarre by de fault. Obviously so.

What I am predicting is that, shall the next race or two go Vettel's way, we will see more of Hamilton "showing emotions" of a kind. If so, then you might keep referring to it as his "mental strength" if you please.
Aha, the flailing sound of someone who knows they are in the wrong. Unfounded accusations of bias. Worth a try. Unfortunately for you if given a choice I would probably rather Vettel one the WDC. I think I would just find that more interesting than another Merc win and it would hopefully shut up a few people who claimed he could only win in a "Newey rocketship".

Just a thought, I assume you considered Vettel's melt down at the end of the Mexican grand prix last year as mentally weak?

Prema
Posts: 6650
Joined: Sat Mar 16, 2013 1:40 pm

Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by Prema »

mikeyg123 wrote:
Prema wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote: I just find it bizarre that you assume Hamilton's mental weakness will be a factor when the latest evidence we have is Hamilton showing mental resilience.

I think Hamilton in the past has had issues with his mental state but those days are gone. I get fed up with people just assuming because he happens to be comfortable showing more emotions than most that he would be mentally weak.
Well, normal humans do get affected by the state of their minds such as weakness. But then, it's Hamilton we are talking about here, so my "assumption" must be bizarre by de fault. Obviously so.

What I am predicting is that, shall the next race or two go Vettel's way, we will see more of Hamilton "showing emotions" of a kind. If so, then you might keep referring to it as his "mental strength" if you please.
Aha, the flailing sound of someone who knows they are in the wrong. Unfounded accusations of bias. Worth a try. Unfortunately for you if given a choice I would probably rather Vettel one the WDC. I think I would just find that more interesting than another Merc win and it would hopefully shut up a few people who claimed he could only win in a "Newey rocketship".

Just a thought, I assume you considered Vettel's melt down at the end of the Mexican grand prix last year as mentally weak?
I really don't know what your "aha" moment was all about. You came with "bizarre" to "assume" that such thing as a mental weakness would be a factor for Hamilton. Hence my sarcastic reply... fairy cakes, then Hamilton must be not a normal human being as the rest of us, that to not be affected by such... in the eyes of his supporters only, I guessed so. :uhoh:

I don't recall exactly that particular situation with Vettel last year was in order to evaluate it along these lines. He wasn't in any title fight anyway. But yes, of course he too can and does succumb to this kinds od mental state at occasions. The greatest part of the year with Ricciardo, for example, would go there, if you ask me. He strikes me as the driver that when all works his way, he is incredibly focused on the one and only one goal of winning the title, and unwavering in his mind. You could put his toes on fire, he won't blink. But if not, he can be "all over the place" and crying like a little bitch.

It happens to others, sure. Take Rosberg, he undoubtedly had his periods of mental strength and resolution, but then also, he was a mental wreck for a long time after the Spa-gate. You could use him to wipe the floors in paddocks. And back to Hamilton, he can be a yo-yo. I believe that he lost the very first title bid back in McLaren due to his mental fart in that next-to last race of the season, in China. That was historical. Good for Kimi, though.

One driver who strikes me most consistent in that regard, compared to other top drivers, Ricciardo. Alonso following,

Zoue
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Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by Zoue »

Prema wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Prema wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote: I just find it bizarre that you assume Hamilton's mental weakness will be a factor when the latest evidence we have is Hamilton showing mental resilience.

I think Hamilton in the past has had issues with his mental state but those days are gone. I get fed up with people just assuming because he happens to be comfortable showing more emotions than most that he would be mentally weak.
Well, normal humans do get affected by the state of their minds such as weakness. But then, it's Hamilton we are talking about here, so my "assumption" must be bizarre by de fault. Obviously so.

What I am predicting is that, shall the next race or two go Vettel's way, we will see more of Hamilton "showing emotions" of a kind. If so, then you might keep referring to it as his "mental strength" if you please.
Aha, the flailing sound of someone who knows they are in the wrong. Unfounded accusations of bias. Worth a try. Unfortunately for you if given a choice I would probably rather Vettel one the WDC. I think I would just find that more interesting than another Merc win and it would hopefully shut up a few people who claimed he could only win in a "Newey rocketship".

Just a thought, I assume you considered Vettel's melt down at the end of the Mexican grand prix last year as mentally weak?
I really don't know what your "aha" moment was all about. You came with "bizarre" to "assume" that such thing as a mental weakness would be a factor for Hamilton. Hence my sarcastic reply... fairy cakes, then Hamilton must be not a normal human being as the rest of us, that to not be affected by such... in the eyes of his supporters only, I guessed so. :uhoh:

I don't recall exactly that particular situation with Vettel last year was in order to evaluate it along these lines. He wasn't in any title fight anyway. But yes, of course he too can and does succumb to this kinds od mental state at occasions. The greatest part of the year with Ricciardo, for example, would go there, if you ask me. He strikes me as the driver that when all works his way, he is incredibly focused on the one and only one goal of winning the title, and unwavering in his mind. You could put his toes on fire, he won't blink. But if not, he can be "all over the place" and crying like a little bitch.

It happens to others, sure. Take Rosberg, he undoubtedly had his periods of mental strength and resolution, but then also, he was a mental wreck for a long time after the Spa-gate. You could use him to wipe the floors in paddocks. And back to Hamilton, he can be a yo-yo. I believe that he lost the very first title bid back in McLaren due to his mental fart in that next-to last race of the season, in China. That was historical. Good for Kimi, though.

One driver who strikes me most consistent in that regard, compared to other top drivers, Ricciardo. Alonso following,
Pretty good psychological assessment there, I'd say

mikeyg123
Posts: 18462
Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2012 4:13 pm

Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by mikeyg123 »

Zoue wrote:
Prema wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Prema wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote: I just find it bizarre that you assume Hamilton's mental weakness will be a factor when the latest evidence we have is Hamilton showing mental resilience.

I think Hamilton in the past has had issues with his mental state but those days are gone. I get fed up with people just assuming because he happens to be comfortable showing more emotions than most that he would be mentally weak.
Well, normal humans do get affected by the state of their minds such as weakness. But then, it's Hamilton we are talking about here, so my "assumption" must be bizarre by de fault. Obviously so.

What I am predicting is that, shall the next race or two go Vettel's way, we will see more of Hamilton "showing emotions" of a kind. If so, then you might keep referring to it as his "mental strength" if you please.
Aha, the flailing sound of someone who knows they are in the wrong. Unfounded accusations of bias. Worth a try. Unfortunately for you if given a choice I would probably rather Vettel one the WDC. I think I would just find that more interesting than another Merc win and it would hopefully shut up a few people who claimed he could only win in a "Newey rocketship".

Just a thought, I assume you considered Vettel's melt down at the end of the Mexican grand prix last year as mentally weak?
I really don't know what your "aha" moment was all about. You came with "bizarre" to "assume" that such thing as a mental weakness would be a factor for Hamilton. Hence my sarcastic reply... fairy cakes, then Hamilton must be not a normal human being as the rest of us, that to not be affected by such... in the eyes of his supporters only, I guessed so. :uhoh:

I don't recall exactly that particular situation with Vettel last year was in order to evaluate it along these lines. He wasn't in any title fight anyway. But yes, of course he too can and does succumb to this kinds od mental state at occasions. The greatest part of the year with Ricciardo, for example, would go there, if you ask me. He strikes me as the driver that when all works his way, he is incredibly focused on the one and only one goal of winning the title, and unwavering in his mind. You could put his toes on fire, he won't blink. But if not, he can be "all over the place" and crying like a little bitch.

It happens to others, sure. Take Rosberg, he undoubtedly had his periods of mental strength and resolution, but then also, he was a mental wreck for a long time after the Spa-gate. You could use him to wipe the floors in paddocks. And back to Hamilton, he can be a yo-yo. I believe that he lost the very first title bid back in McLaren due to his mental fart in that next-to last race of the season, in China. That was historical. Good for Kimi, though.

One driver who strikes me most consistent in that regard, compared to other top drivers, Ricciardo. Alonso following,
Pretty good psychological assessment there, I'd say
I'm not a Hamilton supporter. Stop trying to put that label on me, it does you a disservice.

Zoue
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Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by Zoue »

mikeyg123 wrote:
Zoue wrote:
Prema wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Prema wrote:
Well, normal humans do get affected by the state of their minds such as weakness. But then, it's Hamilton we are talking about here, so my "assumption" must be bizarre by de fault. Obviously so.

What I am predicting is that, shall the next race or two go Vettel's way, we will see more of Hamilton "showing emotions" of a kind. If so, then you might keep referring to it as his "mental strength" if you please.
Aha, the flailing sound of someone who knows they are in the wrong. Unfounded accusations of bias. Worth a try. Unfortunately for you if given a choice I would probably rather Vettel one the WDC. I think I would just find that more interesting than another Merc win and it would hopefully shut up a few people who claimed he could only win in a "Newey rocketship".

Just a thought, I assume you considered Vettel's melt down at the end of the Mexican grand prix last year as mentally weak?
I really don't know what your "aha" moment was all about. You came with "bizarre" to "assume" that such thing as a mental weakness would be a factor for Hamilton. Hence my sarcastic reply... fairy cakes, then Hamilton must be not a normal human being as the rest of us, that to not be affected by such... in the eyes of his supporters only, I guessed so. :uhoh:

I don't recall exactly that particular situation with Vettel last year was in order to evaluate it along these lines. He wasn't in any title fight anyway. But yes, of course he too can and does succumb to this kinds od mental state at occasions. The greatest part of the year with Ricciardo, for example, would go there, if you ask me. He strikes me as the driver that when all works his way, he is incredibly focused on the one and only one goal of winning the title, and unwavering in his mind. You could put his toes on fire, he won't blink. But if not, he can be "all over the place" and crying like a little bitch.

It happens to others, sure. Take Rosberg, he undoubtedly had his periods of mental strength and resolution, but then also, he was a mental wreck for a long time after the Spa-gate. You could use him to wipe the floors in paddocks. And back to Hamilton, he can be a yo-yo. I believe that he lost the very first title bid back in McLaren due to his mental fart in that next-to last race of the season, in China. That was historical. Good for Kimi, though.

One driver who strikes me most consistent in that regard, compared to other top drivers, Ricciardo. Alonso following,
Pretty good psychological assessment there, I'd say
I'm not a Hamilton supporter. Stop trying to put that label on me, it does you a disservice.
Was that directed at me? I was talking about the assessment of the drivers

mikeyg123
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Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by mikeyg123 »

Apologies, it was aimed at the BIB of the post you quoted.

Prema
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Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by Prema »

mikeyg123 wrote: I'm not a Hamilton supporter. Stop trying to put that label on me, it does you a disservice.
I was rather generic, and I guessed that such extreme view of Hamilton's, virtually super-natural ability to not be affected by his state of mind, could be rather his die-hard followers' view only. Whether you are the one or you only happened to share that view, makes no difference to me there. And if it does me a "disservice"... that is what I am fine with. :nod:

mikeyg123
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Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by mikeyg123 »

I think everybody should have the ability not to let their emotions negatively effect their behaviour or performance. Just because something might make me angry does not mean I have to act angrily or let that anger effect my decision making. I'd be pretty concerned about any adult who was a complete slave to whatever emotion they happened to feel at any given time.

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Robot
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Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by Robot »

Mind games won't work because Vettel is not going to play, if it was against Alonso, this will be an all out war, but with Vettel, never

Prema
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Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by Prema »

mikeyg123 wrote:I think everybody should have the ability not to let their emotions negatively effect their behaviour or performance. Just because something might make me angry does not mean I have to act angrily or let that anger effect my decision making. I'd be pretty concerned about any adult who was a complete slave to whatever emotion they happened to feel at any given time.
Well... Trump, there you go.. :]

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Lt. Drebin
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Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by Lt. Drebin »

Robot wrote:Mind games won't work because Vettel is not going to play, if it was against Alonso, this will be an all out war, but with Vettel, never
Vettel is one of the most relaxed drivers out there, anti-political and no mind games person.
The end is near

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Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by F1_Ernie »

Lt. Drebin wrote:
Robot wrote:Mind games won't work because Vettel is not going to play, if it was against Alonso, this will be an all out war, but with Vettel, never
Vettel is one of the most relaxed drivers out there, anti-political and no mind games person.
Who was constantly moaning over the radio last year.
PF1 Pick 10 Competition

2016: 24th place
2017: 4th place
2018: 12th place

Wins: Spain 2016, Canada 2017, Malaysia 2017
Podiums: 2nd Germany 2016, 3rd Mexico 2016, 3rd China 2018, 3rd Japan 2018, 2nd Mexico 2018

Zoue
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Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by Zoue »

F1_Ernie wrote:
Lt. Drebin wrote:
Robot wrote:Mind games won't work because Vettel is not going to play, if it was against Alonso, this will be an all out war, but with Vettel, never
Vettel is one of the most relaxed drivers out there, anti-political and no mind games person.
Who was constantly moaning over the radio last year.
What does that have to do with mind games?

F1_Ernie
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Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by F1_Ernie »

Zoue wrote:
F1_Ernie wrote:
Lt. Drebin wrote:
Robot wrote:Mind games won't work because Vettel is not going to play, if it was against Alonso, this will be an all out war, but with Vettel, never
Vettel is one of the most relaxed drivers out there, anti-political and no mind games person.
Who was constantly moaning over the radio last year.
What does that have to do with mind games?
Doesn't make you look a very relaxed person when you're moaning which Vettel did quite a lot of last year.
PF1 Pick 10 Competition

2016: 24th place
2017: 4th place
2018: 12th place

Wins: Spain 2016, Canada 2017, Malaysia 2017
Podiums: 2nd Germany 2016, 3rd Mexico 2016, 3rd China 2018, 3rd Japan 2018, 2nd Mexico 2018

Zoue
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Re: The mind games have started - Lewis takes the first shot

Post by Zoue »

F1_Ernie wrote:
Zoue wrote:
F1_Ernie wrote:
Lt. Drebin wrote:
Robot wrote:Mind games won't work because Vettel is not going to play, if it was against Alonso, this will be an all out war, but with Vettel, never
Vettel is one of the most relaxed drivers out there, anti-political and no mind games person.
Who was constantly moaning over the radio last year.
What does that have to do with mind games?
Doesn't make you look a very relaxed person when you're moaning which Vettel did quite a lot of last year.
well, Kimi is known as the Iceman but often sounds anything but cool in the car. Think you're confusing persona with adrenaline-fuelled reactions.

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