Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

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pendulumeffect
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Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by pendulumeffect »

Given his greater experience with faster, grippier F1 cars is there a chance he may do better than Vettel or even Lewis this year? He used to have a lot of lap records and has shown pace in Barcelona. I believe he is now the oldest driver on the grid if I am not mistaken? Or will Vettel and Lewis still be much faster?

Personally I think he may adapt to the new rules much quicker and have a tiny advantage around the tricky circuits and the early races before the other drivers adapt to keep up. The Ferrari could be a championship contender this year and I hope he proves his doubters wrong. Good luck Kimi!

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Exediron
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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by Exediron »

If the Ferrari testing form is real, then I think Kimi is a very real possibility for the WDC. His Achilles heel these last few seasons relative to Seb has been managing the tyres throughout a race, which - if Pirelli has delivered upon their promises - will be far less important this year.

I think Vettel would have to be the favorite even if the Ferrari is the quickest car, but Kimi is certainly in with a shout this year. If Ferrari's form is real...
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Lt. Drebin
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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by Lt. Drebin »

Vettel is overall faster package, so it will take a lot of bad luck for him, in order for Kimi to be a WDC.
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Black_Flag_11
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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by Black_Flag_11 »

Part of me would love to see it, but I think if a Ferrari driver is going to win the WDC it would take a huge turnaround in form for it to be Kimi. He's been pretty comfortably outperformed these last two seasons and I don't think the tyres will have changed enough to change that.

Caserole of Nonsense
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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by Caserole of Nonsense »

I dont think he can beat vettel or hamilton over a season but if the ferrari is a potential race winner he could get a win or two

however average vettel was last season, for kimi to beat him in quali was i think underestimated by a lot of people. i dont think vettel lost any speed over 1 lap last year so that was majorly impressive to me.

the other reason i dont think he will beat vettel is ferrari wont let him to a certain extent. im a kimi fan and therefore concentrate on his and vettels performances. ive lost count of the times vettel has ended up with the better strategy and kimi is used as a guinea pig. whether you disagree or not, i know it for a fact from watching the data. sometimes vettel has called it and ended up better and sometimes ferrari has called it. sometimes ferrari screws them both but generally kimi. After all they are paying vettel 4 or 5 times kimis wage i think and he is the number 1 in all but writing. unnfortunately i dont see this changing next year.

and just to clarify i think vettel is the faster of the 2 at this stage of their careers (which he should be) and doesnt need ferraris help.

although vettel was overall the better race driver last year, he was often ahead due to strategy rather then outright pace. at most curcuits they were very close pace wise. it would be great to see a truly fair battle. mercedes seem to be fair to both drivers when it comes to strategy. hopefully ferrari will be too.

ps ferrari need a huge improvement in the strategy department for either driver to win. they are generally absolute S***e

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by RaggedMan »

I would love that but it would require
a) the Ferrari to be the best/equal best car
b) Seb to be unluckily a time or two
c) the drivers of any competitive team to take points off each other
d) Kimi to be nearly flawless
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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by jimmyj »

RaggedMan wrote:I would love that but it would require
a) the Ferrari to be the best/equal best car
b) Seb to be unluckily a time or two
c) the drivers of any competitive team to take points off each other
d) Kimi to be nearly flawless
This. Love Kimi but I don't see it.

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by sandman1347 »

It's certainly now or never. I can see him potentially beating Seb but whether the car will be quick enough for him to beat Lewis is a different question all together. Overall my money would still be on Vettel to win the matchup at Ferrari but I do expect Kimi to have a strong season.

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by lamo »

Lt. Drebin wrote:Vettel is overall faster package, so it will take a lot of bad luck for him, in order for Kimi to be a WDC.
I agree, it will take a Rosberg type scenario for Kimi to beat Vettel.

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by UnlikeUday »

The 2nd test will reveal much more than the test that concluded.

Ferrari no doubt are looking in better shape but Red Bull hasn't shown its hand yet.

Mercedes still seem the strongest package there & will still be hard to beat.

If Kimi becomes a world champion, this would be such a great feeling for F1 overall.
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Blake
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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by Blake »

As much as a Ferrari WDC//WCC would please me, regardless of driver, I feel that it much too early for me to be entertaining such thoughts. IF, and that is a major IF, Ferrari has the car, the strategies, eliminates both management and technical mistakes, then I feel either Kimi or Seb certainly have the ability to win.
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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by Warheart01 »

jimmyj wrote:
RaggedMan wrote:I would love that but it would require
a) the Ferrari to be the best/equal best car
b) Seb to be unluckily a time or two
c) the drivers of any competitive team to take points off each other
d) Kimi to be nearly flawless
This. Love Kimi but I don't see it.
It would be possible though. Just look at how flawless Kimi was in 2012 and 2013 when he had a car that was to his liking. So if the car is, and he is very sensitive to that, then I think he could really give Vettel a challenge. Sure those years are some time ago now and he is even older but I can't write him off just yet.

What I'm concerned about is would Ferrari let him beat Vettel?

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by AnRs »

sandman1347 wrote:It's certainly now or never. I can see him potentially beating Seb but whether the car will be quick enough for him to beat Lewis is a different question all together. Overall my money would still be on Vettel to win the matchup at Ferrari but I do expect Kimi to have a strong season.
I love it when people forget about Bottas totally, more of that..

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by rivf1 »

Ferrari topped the sheets in the first test last season too, I wouldn't get carried away just yet. I lost count how many times last season i thought, gee this ferrari is putting in good times in practice, they are going to be super competitive this weekend, come qualifying nowhere to be seen. During testing in the last week(yes very early days), i have not seen anything to suggest the mercedes dominance will be stopped.

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by Exediron »

rivf1 wrote:During testing in the last week(yes very early days), i have not seen anything to suggest the mercedes dominance will be stopped.
That may be true, but objectively there was also nothing at all to suggest Mercedes dominance will continue. They weren't the quickest, they weren't the most reliable, and their car isn't the most radical. Granted, Mercedes could very well be the team to beat again, but objectively the only reason to believe Mercedes will be dominant right now is if you already assume they will be.
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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by Zoue »

Like others, I think it largely boils down to the tyres. If they require significantly less managing, then I expect he'll give a strong performance and is capable of matching Vettel. He's already shown he can do so in one lap pace. I tend to agree that he was largely given the duff strategies last year but in all fairness Vettel was demonstrably better for the most part, so it's hard to blame Ferrari for focusing on him.

As to the WDC, well, way too early to tell as there are so many variable. If the above is true and the tyres give him the confidence to push without penalty, then I don't see why he can't challenge anybody. He's certainly shown himself capable in the past and I don't think drivers lose that too much. You'd have to make a huge assumption that Ferrari are Merc's equal now and frankly I'm finding that to imagine.

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by Zoue »

Warheart01 wrote:
jimmyj wrote:
RaggedMan wrote:I would love that but it would require
a) the Ferrari to be the best/equal best car
b) Seb to be unluckily a time or two
c) the drivers of any competitive team to take points off each other
d) Kimi to be nearly flawless
This. Love Kimi but I don't see it.
It would be possible though. Just look at how flawless Kimi was in 2012 and 2013 when he had a car that was to his liking. So if the car is, and he is very sensitive to that, then I think he could really give Vettel a challenge. Sure those years are some time ago now and he is even older but I can't write him off just yet.

What I'm concerned about is would Ferrari let him beat Vettel?
If they stay true to form Ferrari will focus on the stronger driver. But if Kimi is strong from the outset there's no reason to believe that Ferrari won't give him a fighting chance.

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by AravJ »

Kimi was much younger when he used to set those fastest lap, if he is as fit as he was then, then maybe.
Ferrari, has not been at the front for a long time, "track side" they still need to get back to winning ways, pitstops and strategy.
We saw a number of errors last year.

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by Randine »

I don't see why not.
The thing with Kimi is that he only seems to give the absolute maximum when he can win.
If Ferrari is in a spot to win consistently this year then I wouldn't count him out.
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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by MistaVega23 »

As good as their testing form has been this week, I still can't help but feel they're going to disappoint in 2017.

I hope I'm wrong. I would love Kimi more than Seb to take the fight to Mercedes if the car is to his liking. We all saw what he could do with the Lotus in '12 and '13. The only sticking point could be the Ferrari pit wall and their strategy calls.
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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by d_dingbat »

Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?
'No'. More like a White Elephant

Times in these tests do not reflect the actual pecking order. Getting your hopes up due to these times will lead to being disappointed.

Stay tuned till Melbourne Qualifying to see who stands where.

I would love to see Kimi do something substantial this year before he hangs his boots. Been a Kimi Fan since 2003 and would love to see him leave on a high note unlike how he was thrown out at the end of 2009. Go Kimi!!!

Guys let's revive the good old Kimi thread.

P.S. I call him a white elephant because at times supporting him is absolutely infuriating

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by F1Oz »

if all things are equal and there are no reliability issues like last year - I can see KR ahead of SV (who I think only thrives with total team support) - so if KR gets ahead early - I can see SV sulking - and frankly I don't rate SV in the 'top' echelon

it all depends on the car

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by UnlikeUday »

Flavio Briatore not impressed by Ferrari:
http://www.sportsmole.co.uk/formula-1/f ... 91176.html

Excerpts from the article:
'"The team is still the same," said Briatore. "When you have the same oven and the same bakers, the quality of the bread is also the same.

"It seems to me that the only thing different is that [Sergio] Marchionne has made no statements."'
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slide
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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by slide »

Ferrari is there or there abouts and I look forward to them racing the mercs and others but merc will save some - think back to most qualifying sessions , but Ferrari do look like winning races and mounting a challange

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by Ruste13 »

Just as long as he wins Spa

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by rivf1 »

Exediron wrote:
rivf1 wrote:During testing in the last week(yes very early days), i have not seen anything to suggest the mercedes dominance will be stopped.
That may be true, but objectively there was also nothing at all to suggest Mercedes dominance will continue. They weren't the quickest, they weren't the most reliable, and their car isn't the most radical. Granted, Mercedes could very well be the team to beat again, but objectively the only reason to believe Mercedes will be dominant right now is if you already assume they will be.
I think we all know the 'electrical fault' was bollocks as ham was not keen on the wet track day and obviously merc where not either. Overall mercedes 2,597km and ferrari 2178.4 km. Looks pretty reliable to me ;) . I would be more than happy to be proven wrong, if dan the man can't win the championship, i would love to see kimi grab another title, it would be a great change from the bore fest of the last three years.

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by GingerFurball »

rivf1 wrote:Ferrari topped the sheets in the first test last season too, I wouldn't get carried away just yet. I lost count how many times last season i thought, gee this ferrari is putting in good times in practice, they are going to be super competitive this weekend, come qualifying nowhere to be seen. During testing in the last week(yes very early days), i have not seen anything to suggest the mercedes dominance will be stopped.
Ferrari should also have won a couple of races early last season, particularly Australia. Ferrari topping the timing sheets was indicative that they were fast out the box.

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by UnlikeUday »

GingerFurball wrote:
rivf1 wrote:Ferrari topped the sheets in the first test last season too, I wouldn't get carried away just yet. I lost count how many times last season i thought, gee this ferrari is putting in good times in practice, they are going to be super competitive this weekend, come qualifying nowhere to be seen. During testing in the last week(yes very early days), i have not seen anything to suggest the mercedes dominance will be stopped.
Ferrari should also have won a couple of races early last season, particularly Australia. Ferrari topping the timing sheets was indicative that they were fast out the box.
Speed doesn't always win you races, pit strategies mainly do.
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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by Covalent »

UnlikeUday wrote:
GingerFurball wrote:
rivf1 wrote:Ferrari topped the sheets in the first test last season too, I wouldn't get carried away just yet. I lost count how many times last season i thought, gee this ferrari is putting in good times in practice, they are going to be super competitive this weekend, come qualifying nowhere to be seen. During testing in the last week(yes very early days), i have not seen anything to suggest the mercedes dominance will be stopped.
Ferrari should also have won a couple of races early last season, particularly Australia. Ferrari topping the timing sheets was indicative that they were fast out the box.
Speed doesn't always win you races, pit strategies mainly do.
Tell that to the slow teams...

Warheart01

Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by Warheart01 »

Or your teammate breaking down, ask Nico! :lol:

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by Exediron »

rivf1 wrote:I think we all know the 'electrical fault' was bollocks as ham was not keen on the wet track day and obviously merc where not either. Overall mercedes 2,597km and ferrari 2178.4 km. Looks pretty reliable to me ;) . I would be more than happy to be proven wrong, if dan the man can't win the championship, i would love to see kimi grab another title, it would be a great change from the bore fest of the last three years.
No, I don't think we know that at all. If Hamilton didn't want to drive in the wet, they could easily have swapped him and Bottas. There's no reason to fake an electrical issue.
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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by Herb »

Exediron wrote:
rivf1 wrote:I think we all know the 'electrical fault' was bollocks as ham was not keen on the wet track day and obviously merc where not either. Overall mercedes 2,597km and ferrari 2178.4 km. Looks pretty reliable to me ;) . I would be more than happy to be proven wrong, if dan the man can't win the championship, i would love to see kimi grab another title, it would be a great change from the bore fest of the last three years.
No, I don't think we know that at all. If Hamilton didn't want to drive in the wet, they could easily have swapped him and Bottas. There's no reason to fake an electrical issue.
In fact the evidence points towards it not being 'bollocks'.

Once it was fixed - close to the end of the morning, they ran Bottas for a few laps. By that point it probably wasn't worth setting the car up for Lewis, only to set it up again for Bottas in the afternoon.

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by jeffw »

First race of the year, merc will stop their sandbagging and run away with the race... just like the last 3 years.

yawn again.

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by Rockie »

Lol how people can come to the conclusion that Kimi will beat Vettel if the Ferrari is good enough to win the championship is beyond ridiculous.
I think last season made people forget how one sided '15 was!
If the car is good enough for the championship, I suspect you will see the '13 Vettel!

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by Nosebuckle »

Way too early to suggest anyone other than one of the Mercs. Ferrari has impressed like this in previous tests, but I will admit, considering the reliability and times on the medium compound, they haven't built a dud. But there are some many unknowns with the new tyres, not to mention the new technical regulations, that it's hard to have confidence in anyone after little more than 3 days of actual testing.

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by VDV23 »

I doubt it. In my opinion, Kimi has been past it for quite some time now. Not to mention he's been having not-so-great luck often when he's having a good race. And he's been incredibly consistent in qualifying, sadly for him and Ferrari fans like me - not the good way of consistent.

And if Ferrari are truly a WCC/WDC challenger, I definitely see Vettel outperforming him.

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by Warheart01 »

Rockie wrote:Lol how people can come to the conclusion that Kimi will beat Vettel if the Ferrari is good enough to win the championship is beyond ridiculous.
I think last season made people forget how one sided '15 was!
If the car is good enough for the championship, I suspect you will see the '13 Vettel!
I get your drift, but I think too many have written Kimi off because of 14'-15'. In 2016 he gave Vettel a good run for his money.
When Kimi is comfortable with the car I believe he is still up there with the best. Just look at 12' and 13'.
Vettel is probably still better than Kimi but he too is very sensitive for how the car performs. He is not good with cars that arn't glued to the ground, but luckily for him they will be more so than in 14'-16'. So with that in mind it might be even more troublesome for Kimi to beat him.
That being said, if Kimi is 100% happy with the car and Vettel is not then I think Kimi will take it and he might not even have to rely on reliabilityproblems and strategyerrors hitting Vettel either.
Also I suspect that Ferrari will focus on Vettel from the getgo as I believe he is their unofficial no.1.

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by F1Oz »

If Ferrari has a competitive car - and the team don't discriminate against KR to support SV - then clearly he has a chance

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by mikeyg123 »

F1Oz wrote:If Ferrari has a competitive car - and the team don't discriminate against KR to support SV - then clearly he has a chance
A very small one unless he can get on terms with Vettel in races. He's shown little sign of being able to do that thus far.

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Re: Is Kimi Raikkonnen the dark horse for 2017?

Post by Pullrod »

If Vettel retires more than once in the first lap and has crap reliability he may have a chance(but just)..

He must also absolutely hope there will be no wet races...

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