Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes?- motorsport.com(Italy)

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Lotus49
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Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes?- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Lotus49 »

http://it.motorsport.com/f1/news/clamor ... ri-858147/

Italian Motorsport.com is reporting Lowe has left Mercedes after failing to agree new terms. James Allison likely to replace him.

I posted a link in the McLaren thread yesterday about a story from F1-AT, another Italian site, linking Lowe with a return to McLaren. Zak Brown had apparently approached Allison to bolster McLarens technical department but was turned down as JA had a pre contract to join Mercedes when his gardening leave runs out.

McLaren then turned their attention to bringing Lowe back and that now looks the likely destination if you believe the reports.

Thoughts?. I think it would be huge for McLaren to get a hold of that kind of knowledge from Mercedes, just the kind of boost they need really.

EDIT: Williams now looking the likely destination 8O

http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/merce ... ch-858449/
Last edited by Lotus49 on Sat Dec 10, 2016 10:24 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Lotus49 »

The post from the McLaren thread...

http://www.f1analisitecnica.com/2016/12 ... cedes.html

According to F1-AT, McLaren's new boss Zak Brown has made contact with Paddy Lowe about a return to McLaren. Apparently one thing he's determined to do is sign another technical boss to work with Prod.

An approach to James Allison was turned down flat because he has already a pre contract for Mercedes so Brown turned his attention to getting Lowe back.


No idea if true, the website has been spot on before about a lot of things, usually about Ferrari it has to be said, but has had some misses too. Usually the technical information is more accurate than the paddock gossip but I thought it was worth posting but didn't know if it was thread worthy or not so just put it here.

Would be great for McLaren and a welcome boost after the disappointment of losing Exxon Mobil. The information Paddy has alone is a huge benefit and exactly what McLaren needs.
Last edited by Lotus49 on Fri Dec 09, 2016 3:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Clark came through at the end of the first lap so far ahead that we in the pits were convinced that the rest of the field must have been wiped out in an accident."
-Eddie Dennis, describing the dominance of Jim Clark in the Lotus 49 at Spa 1967

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Zoue »

Wow, great news for McLaren if true. Surprised, though. Did you hear any detail on why they couldn't agree? Trouble in Paradise?

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by moby »

Zoue wrote:Wow, great news for McLaren if true. Surprised, though. Did you hear any detail on why they couldn't agree? Trouble in Paradise?
I think I read last week, but dont recall where, it was about who " reports to " who.
Wil look for the Item but dont remember (if anyone does, link pls)

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Lotus49 »

Zoue wrote:Wow, great news for McLaren if true. Surprised, though. Did you hear any detail on why they couldn't agree? Trouble in Paradise?
Money was the stumbling block apparently. You never really know though, it could be length of contract or bonuses rather than just salary related.

Wild theory time but when it was just Ferrari sniffing around Lowe maybe Mercedes felt confident he wasn't interested in going over there and felt he'd lower his demands but McLaren coming in caught them out?.

Although if it's true Allison has a pre contract it would suggest Mercedes are happy enough with losing Paddy.

Agree it would be great for McLaren. His knowledge of their suspension and PU makes him worth his weight in gold. Good job Zak if he pulls it off.
"Clark came through at the end of the first lap so far ahead that we in the pits were convinced that the rest of the field must have been wiped out in an accident."
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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Lt. Drebin »

Mercedes, so mighty, so shaken.
The end is near

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Zoue »

http://www.mundodeportivo.com/motor/f1/ ... laren.html

The above report says his renewal offer was lower than would be expected in a leading team, so were Mercedes trying to be cheap with him?

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Zoue »

Lotus49 wrote:
Zoue wrote:Wow, great news for McLaren if true. Surprised, though. Did you hear any detail on why they couldn't agree? Trouble in Paradise?
Money was the stumbling block apparently. You never really know though, it could be length of contract or bonuses rather than just salary related.

Wild theory time but when it was just Ferrari sniffing around Lowe maybe Mercedes felt confident he wasn't interested in going over there and felt he'd lower his demands but McLaren coming in caught them out?.

Although if it's true Allison has a pre contract it would suggest Mercedes are happy enough with losing Paddy.

Agree it would be great for McLaren. His knowledge of their suspension and PU makes him worth his weight in gold. Good job Zak if he pulls it off.
Good point about Allison. Does suggest a bit of a falling out, though (unless it's my paranoia). Why change a winning formula?

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by olly-44 »

Personally as a Mercedes fan (only due to Lewis - non fanboy, just fan)...I think its a good thing.

Lowe started to seem unhappy and after the Abu Dhabi debacle, he seemed genuinely annoyed with Lewis. Maybe its best for him to move on and for both parties not to get stale.

Yes the regulations are changing but if James Allison is coming in, he would've had a lot of free time to be "trained up" so to speak.
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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Lotus49 »

Zoue wrote:
Lotus49 wrote:
Zoue wrote:Wow, great news for McLaren if true. Surprised, though. Did you hear any detail on why they couldn't agree? Trouble in Paradise?
Money was the stumbling block apparently. You never really know though, it could be length of contract or bonuses rather than just salary related.

Wild theory time but when it was just Ferrari sniffing around Lowe maybe Mercedes felt confident he wasn't interested in going over there and felt he'd lower his demands but McLaren coming in caught them out?.

Although if it's true Allison has a pre contract it would suggest Mercedes are happy enough with losing Paddy.

Agree it would be great for McLaren. His knowledge of their suspension and PU makes him worth his weight in gold. Good job Zak if he pulls it off.
Good point about Allison. Does suggest a bit of a falling out, though (unless it's my paranoia). Why change a winning formula?
It's definitely a little strange to me too. I like Allison and rate him highly but Paddy is way more proven, is on good terms with their star driver (And rumoured to be the only one Lewis even speaks to) and his knowledge of Mercedes secrets make him highly sought after elsewhere.

It's very strange to throw that away and hand a competitor a major boost over just money.
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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Lotus49 »

Motorsport.com(Global) Helpfully muddying the waters. Claiming talks with Mercedes are at a crunch phase and a return to Williams may be on the cards in return for some equity.

http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/rival ... ks-858200/
Last edited by Lotus49 on Fri Dec 09, 2016 4:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Clark came through at the end of the first lap so far ahead that we in the pits were convinced that the rest of the field must have been wiped out in an accident."
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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Zoue »

http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/rival ... ks-858200/

This article suggests it's not a done deal yet, but links him to Williams as "the most logical destination," not McLaren. I think he'd have more chance to be at the front at McLaren, personally. Not sure I see the attraction of Williams. They don't seem ambitious enough for me

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Lotus49 »

Snap! :lol:
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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Black_Flag_11 »

If the rumour is true that Lowe is the only person in Mercedes management that Lewis is on good terms with I wonder where that leaves him.

Incredible that despite being one of the most dominant teams ever they are completely falling apart. They're breezing to world championships yet both drivers and the Technical Director have quit in the same year.
Last edited by Black_Flag_11 on Fri Dec 09, 2016 5:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Zoue »

Lotus49 wrote:Snap! :lol:
:lol:

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Invade »

Hmmmmmm.

Not surprising on either front, given the nuggets from the grapevine that James Allison would be joining; and I can only imagine that the main issue is too many cooks, hence why Mercedes might have tried to cheap out Paddy Lowe.

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by shoot999 »

Black_Flag_11 wrote:If the rumour is true that Lowe is the only person in Mercedes management that Lewis is on good terms with I wonder where that leaves him.

Incredible that despite being one of the most dominant teams ever they are completely falling apart. They're breezing to world championships yet both drivers and the Technical Director have quit in the same year.
Think I posted on this yesterday. Whether he wins the WDC or not in 2017, I see him signing for someone else by mid summer 18. All those behind recruiting him in the first place have left. Clear was his man in 14 and left. Lauda always fought in his corner before deciding to switch sides this year, Brundle said Lowe was the only point of contact in Mercedes top management for Lewis,and apart from a brief period in 15 him and Wolff have never been close.

I should add that I trust a motorsport.com exclusive somewhat below that of a rabid fanboy's. :D

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Lotus49 »

Mods- Because of the different reports maybe a question mark after the Mercedes is in order.
"Clark came through at the end of the first lap so far ahead that we in the pits were convinced that the rest of the field must have been wiped out in an accident."
-Eddie Dennis, describing the dominance of Jim Clark in the Lotus 49 at Spa 1967

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by sandman1347 »

shoot999 wrote:
Black_Flag_11 wrote:If the rumour is true that Lowe is the only person in Mercedes management that Lewis is on good terms with I wonder where that leaves him.

Incredible that despite being one of the most dominant teams ever they are completely falling apart. They're breezing to world championships yet both drivers and the Technical Director have quit in the same year.
Think I posted on this yesterday. Whether he wins the WDC or not in 2017, I see him signing for someone else by mid summer 18. All those behind recruiting him in the first place have left. Clear was his man in 14 and left. Lauda always fought in his corner before deciding to switch sides this year, Brundle said Lowe was the only point of contact in Mercedes top management for Lewis,and apart from a brief period in 15 him and Wolff have never been close.

I should add that I trust a motorsport.com exclusive somewhat below that of a rabid fanboy's. :D
That being said, business is business. If the success continues, it's likely the partnership will as well.

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Invade »

Lotus49 wrote:Mods- Because of the different reports maybe a question mark after the Mercedes is in order.
Yes, it would seem so.

(Off-topic: Kovalev won that fight... I had it close but winning.)

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Lotus49 »

Invade wrote:
Lotus49 wrote:Mods- Because of the different reports maybe a question mark after the Mercedes is in order.
Yes, it would seem so.

(Off-topic: Kovalev won that fight... I had it close but winning.)
Yeah me too :x
"Clark came through at the end of the first lap so far ahead that we in the pits were convinced that the rest of the field must have been wiped out in an accident."
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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by sandman1347 »

Invade wrote:
Lotus49 wrote:Mods- Because of the different reports maybe a question mark after the Mercedes is in order.
Yes, it would seem so.

(Off-topic: Kovalev won that fight... I had it close but winning.)
The fight was close enough that it could have gone either way. My knee-jerk reaction was that I thought Kovalev won but it certainly wasn't a robbery.

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Invade »

sandman1347 wrote:
Invade wrote:
Lotus49 wrote:Mods- Because of the different reports maybe a question mark after the Mercedes is in order.
Yes, it would seem so.

(Off-topic: Kovalev won that fight... I had it close but winning.)
The fight was close enough that it could have gone either way. My knee-jerk reaction was that I thought Kovalev won but it certainly wasn't a robbery.
Agree entirely, but it's hard to calm down the rabid boxing forums. Certainly no robbery, and I had Ward winning 6 rounds with the knockdown being the difference.

Back on topic, I suppose.

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Ruste13 »

That seems like a big win for the new boss at McLaren. I wonder is they move was in play before Ron left or if it is a new signing by the new leadership.

If its a new signing then would look very good for Zac Brown.

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Covalent »

Lotus49 wrote:Mods- Because of the different reports maybe a question mark after the Mercedes is in order.
You can edit the title yourself.

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Lotus49 »

Covalent wrote:
Lotus49 wrote:Mods- Because of the different reports maybe a question mark after the Mercedes is in order.
You can edit the title yourself.
I've never been able to find the edit option :lol:

Pointers please?.
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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Exediron »

If (and it's still a big if at this point) Lowe does go to McLaren, that would be a great coup for the new boss. Now he just needs to get us a title sponsor and replace all the long-time partners who fled to the arms of Red Bull!

Interesting times for Mercedes, it seems. I've suspected since about mid-2015 that all was not well beneath the surface of the juggernaut, and that seems to be borne out by recent events. Imagine the shock if Lewis quits before the start of 2017 too! :lol:
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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Exediron »

Lotus49 wrote:I've never been able to find the edit option :lol:

Pointers please?.
You edit the first post just like you would any other, with the edit button in the lower right. Then just change the subject at the top.
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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Lotus49 »

Lotus49 wrote:
Covalent wrote:
Lotus49 wrote:Mods- Because of the different reports maybe a question mark after the Mercedes is in order.
You can edit the title yourself.
I've never been able to find the edit option :lol:

Pointers please?.
Got it never mind. :thumbup:
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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes?- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Badgeronimous »

Losing Lowe and gaining Allison isn't really a loss as such.

He is being replaced by somebody as good, if not better.

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes?- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Pest44 »

It's hard to believe that there's so much discontent within Merc after all the success they've had. I'm surprised they would let Lowe go so easily. Remember when Ferrari and Schumacher were dominating in the early noughties they always kept the same team together which brought so much success. If they let Lowe go and replace him with Allison then I think it's a big risk. Whilst we all know Allison is highly rated it's still a big risk to break up the technical team that has dominated F1 like never before.

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Lotus49 »

Exediron wrote:
Lotus49 wrote:I've never been able to find the edit option :lol:

Pointers please?.
You edit the first post just like you would any other, with the edit button in the lower right. Then just change the subject at the top.
Yeah it dawned on me to try that just after I made the post asking Covalent :idea:

Only took me 3 and a half years to figure it out. :blush:
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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes?- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by babararacucudada »

Pest44 wrote:It's hard to believe that there's so much discontent within Merc after all the success they've had. I'm surprised they would let Lowe go so easily. Remember when Ferrari and Schumacher were dominating in the early noughties they always kept the same team together which brought so much success. If they let Lowe go and replace him with Allison then I think it's a big risk. Whilst we all know Allison is highly rated it's still a big risk to break up the technical team that has dominated F1 like never before.
I didn't think Lowe brought a lot from McLaren to Mercedes. IMO the bigger issue would be Lowe taking what he learned at Mercedes somewhere else.

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by pokerman »

Zoue wrote:Wow, great news for McLaren if true. Surprised, though. Did you hear any detail on why they couldn't agree? Trouble in Paradise?
I heard he is negotiating for more money.
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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by pokerman »

Lotus49 wrote:
Invade wrote:
Lotus49 wrote:Mods- Because of the different reports maybe a question mark after the Mercedes is in order.
Yes, it would seem so.

(Off-topic: Kovalev won that fight... I had it close but winning.)
Yeah me too :x
Someone needs to explain to me how the referee allows Ward to get away with all the holding and wrestling he does, I watched a domestic fight recently and every time the boxers got into a clinch the referee parted them straight away.
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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Invade »

pokerman wrote:
Lotus49 wrote:
Invade wrote:
Lotus49 wrote:Mods- Because of the different reports maybe a question mark after the Mercedes is in order.
Yes, it would seem so.

(Off-topic: Kovalev won that fight... I had it close but winning.)
Yeah me too :x
Someone needs to explain to me how the referee allows Ward to get away with all the holding and wrestling he does, I watched a domestic fight recently and every time the boxers got into a clinch the referee parted them straight away.
I thought the fight was expertly managed. Kovalev was also the instigator of much holding to limit Ward's inside game, which is one of Ward's big strengths. Generally, referees are encouraged to give the fighters chances to fight out of the clinches. For me there's nothing worse than the hyper sensitive referees who are breaking fighters up almost before they're even about to initiate a clinch or hold. Boxing on the inside is a part of the game.

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Zoue »

pokerman wrote:
Zoue wrote:Wow, great news for McLaren if true. Surprised, though. Did you hear any detail on why they couldn't agree? Trouble in Paradise?
I heard he is negotiating for more money.
Thanks. Been reading that another party is making him an offer he's finding it hard to refuse. Supposedly British team, which rules out Ferrari.

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes?- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Lotus49 »

Equity in Williams would be tricky to refuse I suppose. It was his first team and I remember that story a month or two back about Williams snapping up James Key in Amus but I haven't heard or read anything about it since.

Lowe,Symonds and Key would make quite a technical department if they managed to pull it off and a fair statement of intent from Williams to try and get back to the front of the grid. Papa Stroll's money could come in handy too of course.
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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes?- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by Pest44 »

babararacucudada wrote:
Pest44 wrote:It's hard to believe that there's so much discontent within Merc after all the success they've had. I'm surprised they would let Lowe go so easily. Remember when Ferrari and Schumacher were dominating in the early noughties they always kept the same team together which brought so much success. If they let Lowe go and replace him with Allison then I think it's a big risk. Whilst we all know Allison is highly rated it's still a big risk to break up the technical team that has dominated F1 like never before.
I didn't think Lowe brought a lot from McLaren to Mercedes. IMO the bigger issue would be Lowe taking what he learned at Mercedes somewhere else.
He must have brought something to the team. If after 2014 they lost performance to the other teams then I would agree with you but if anything they became stronger in 2015 and 2016. Saying Lowe didn't bring much is harsh on him. I think breaking that team up is always a big risk

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Re: Paddy Lowe leaves Mercedes- motorsport.com(Italy)

Post by F1_Ernie »

Invade wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Lotus49 wrote:
Invade wrote:
Lotus49 wrote:Mods- Because of the different reports maybe a question mark after the Mercedes is in order.
Yes, it would seem so.

(Off-topic: Kovalev won that fight... I had it close but winning.)
Yeah me too :x
Someone needs to explain to me how the referee allows Ward to get away with all the holding and wrestling he does, I watched a domestic fight recently and every time the boxers got into a clinch the referee parted them straight away.
I thought the fight was expertly managed. Kovalev was also the instigator of much holding to limit Ward's inside game, which is one of Ward's big strengths. Generally, referees are encouraged to give the fighters chances to fight out of the clinches. For me there's nothing worse than the hyper sensitive referees who are breaking fighters up almost before they're even about to initiate a clinch or hold. Boxing on the inside is a part of the game.
Exactly right, Kovalev was the instigator of the holding which was a good plan but Ward showed his adability in fights to combat that. The way he come back I thought was a materclass of a performance and he took it for me. He even went upto Kovalevs weight. The channel I watched none of the pundits have the fight to Kovalev. All was a draw or Ward.
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