Rightio. Who's it gunna be??

[UnlikeUday]

I think Bottas will get it as he is a fast safe pair of hands who is also quite unemotional which should not ignite any team strife. Although I think his racecraft is no better than Rosberg's one can't argue with his consistent multi-year domination of Massa which is Alonso like and does indicate a high natural speed. As for Williams they could always ask Massa to reconsider and stay if they needed a big name or loan Button for a year. Wehrlein has not shown he is ready for prime time yet.

Bottas if went to Mercedes, can You imagine the amount of quicksand Williams would be in?

Wehrlein with Stroll, a rookie. Williams could languish at the bottom end of the WCC chain!

There is a chance Merc could broker a deal for another driver to go to Williams ( for free even? ) It could be that they pay the dues of another driver or supply one already on their books. I know it will get stick here, but Di Resta is a very capable driver and is still on Merc books. Maybe Williams would not choose him in normal times, but if he came free?

Di Resta is a good option. He's not that bad as some assume he is.

The point is they need an experienced driver in place of Bottas as Stroll being a rookie, will be possibly weak in 2017. Hence, a strong team mate is required for Williams or they will be languishing close to the bottom of the pecking order!

[Zoue]

Di Resta hasn't driven single seaters for years. He wasn't that great when he was in F1 originally that they would want to dust him off over talent with more recent relative experience, surely?

[moby]

Di Resta hasn't driven single seaters for years. He wasn't that great when he was in F1 originally that they would want to dust him off over talent with more recent relative experience, surely?

Depends on the financial benefit?

[wolfticket]

I think there's an element of people treating Wehrlein like more of a Rookie than he actually is.

He's had a whole season in what I imagine is quite a difficult car and against two different team mates where he's hardly made a lot of rookie errors, plus a couple of years as an F1 test driver before that. I'd also factor in that it is a somewhat different formula next season which to some extent could act as a reset button for driver's useful experience.

If he does go to Mercedes (or somewhere else) next year he's not going to be a super experienced old hand but he's hardly going to be totally green either. I'm certainly not convinced dropping someone like Di Resta back into a team after a few years out would be any better.

[mas]

If they do choose Wehrlein and he flops at least they know they will have Alonso/Vettel/Bottas etc to choose from in 2018. I suppose the crux of the decision is do they feel brave enough to risk 2017 Wcc money on such a gamble ?

[moby]

I think there's an element of people treating Wehrlein like more of a Rookie than he actually is.

He's had a whole season in what I imagine is quite a difficult car and against two different team mates where he's hardly made a lot of rookie errors, plus a couple of years as an F1 test driver before that. I'd also factor in that it is a somewhat different formula next season which to some extent could act as a reset button for driver's useful experience.

If he does go to Mercedes (or somewhere else) next year he's not going to be a super experienced old hand but he's hardly going to be totally green either. I'm certainly not convinced dropping someone like Di Resta back into a team after a few years out would be any better.

I dont know that the problem with "Princess Pascal" is his skills. Teams have to pick personnel who work together.

[lamo]

Williams reject Bottas move, Bottas seems like first choice...

Lowe also going to Williams it seems...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/38282791

[scotlandforever]

Di Resta hasn't driven single seaters for years. He wasn't that great when he was in F1 originally that they would want to dust him off over talent with more recent relative experience, surely?

In fairness to di Resta IF it was to get the Williams team drive he knows how the team works as he is their reserve driver and I can't see there being a problem in fact with him being a driver from the British Isles it might give the team a little more exposure?

As for di Resta not being great in F1?
He did well after he was in an underfunded car and I remember other drivers who were in a better team crashing all over the place and they have been given a second chance in F1 and are doing well.

[Zoue]

Di Resta hasn't driven single seaters for years. He wasn't that great when he was in F1 originally that they would want to dust him off over talent with more recent relative experience, surely?

In fairness to di Resta IF it was to get the Williams team drive he knows how the team works as he is their reserve driver and I can't see there being a problem in fact with him being a driver from the British Isles it might give the team a little more exposure?

As for di Resta not being great in F1?
He did well after he was in an underfunded car and I remember other drivers who were in a better team crashing all over the place and they have been given a second chance in F1 and are doing well.

Perhaps I could have worded that better. I didn't mean to imply he was rubbish, just that he didn't exactly set the world alight. Let's say average to just above. But he's been out for three years. What's he worth investing in that other junior drivers aren't?

[mikeyg123]

Di Resta hasn't driven single seaters for years. He wasn't that great when he was in F1 originally that they would want to dust him off over talent with more recent relative experience, surely?

In fairness to di Resta IF it was to get the Williams team drive he knows how the team works as he is their reserve driver and I can't see there being a problem in fact with him being a driver from the British Isles it might give the team a little more exposure?

As for di Resta not being great in F1?
He did well after he was in an underfunded car and I remember other drivers who were in a better team crashing all over the place and they have been given a second chance in F1 and are doing well.

Perhaps I could have worded that better. I didn't mean to imply he was rubbish, just that he didn't exactly set the world alight. Let's say average to just above. But he's been out for three years. What's he worth investing in that other junior drivers aren't?

I don't know but most teams seem very keen on not taking rookies for next season and Williams already have one. I think Di Resta is possibly the best option for them if they lose Bottas.

[scotlandforever]

Di Resta hasn't driven single seaters for years. He wasn't that great when he was in F1 originally that they would want to dust him off over talent with more recent relative experience, surely?

In fairness to di Resta IF it was to get the Williams team drive he knows how the team works as he is their reserve driver and I can't see there being a problem in fact with him being a driver from the British Isles it might give the team a little more exposure?

As for di Resta not being great in F1?
He did well after he was in an underfunded car and I remember other drivers who were in a better team crashing all over the place and they have been given a second chance in F1 and are doing well.

Perhaps I could have worded that better. I didn't mean to imply he was rubbish, just that he didn't exactly set the world alight. Let's say average to just above. But he's been out for three years. What's he worth investing in that other junior drivers aren't?

Di Resta was driving in an underfunded Force India in fact he and the team punched above their weight at times.

Williams do have a junior driver driving for them next season, Di Resta at this time would be an ideal choice for Williams, this is all buts lets see whats happens at Mercedes first.

[sandman1347]

Williams reject Bottas move, Bottas seems like first choice...

Lowe also going to Williams it seems...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/38282791

Lowe is a big pick up for Williams. Maybe their chassis will finally begin to produce competitive levels of downforce. Mercedes are going to have to promote Pascal it seems.

[AFCTUJacko]

Merc will get their man, but Williams are doing the right thing in playing hardball for now - make them pay as much as possible.

Nasr is the best option for Williams if Bottas goes IMO. I don't think they can take the risk of having two youngsters - their position in the WCC is too big financially to take that risk.

Lowe is a massive coup for them, and a genuine sign of intent after a poor year.

[AngusWolfe]

I heard Sainz is their backup if they can't get Bottas. I think this stuff about Pascal having a bad reputation must be true if Mercedes haven't given up yet.

[Schumacher forever#1]

I just can't see William's getting much in the way of Bottas going to Mercedes if Mercedes really want him. Surely Bottas would be dying to get the seat as well?

Hopefully it's only just their preferred option and they would be open to bringing in another driver like Sainz if it's too much effort to get Bottas in (Yes, I'm not a fan of Bottas). Although Sainz is loyal to the Red Bull program so he might not be easy to get either.

[AngusWolfe]

I just can't see William's getting much in the way of Bottas going to Mercedes if Mercedes really want him. Surely Bottas would be dying to get the seat as well?

Hopefully it's only just their preferred option and they would be open to bringing in another driver like Sainz if it's too much effort to get Bottas in (Yes, I'm not a fan of Bottas). Although Sainz is loyal to the Red Bull program so he might not be easy to get either.

Williams issue is the uncertanty of the next few years. Yes, they could earn a lot of money, but Martini need a driver over 25, and a strong one to avoid falling too far down the constructors table. If it all goes tits up next year and their car is worse in comparison to the rest of the field, and they have two weaker inexperienced drivers, then they could loose a hell of a lot more than they could gain by letting Mercedes take Bottas. Bottas is probably begging Mercedes for a contract for 2018 to give Williams time to prepare, but I think if they take Sainz it'll be over for him.

While I don't think Sainz has an issue with the Red Bull system, in fact, I imagine he's grateful it got him to F1, but Red Bull currently have two young drivers in their A team, who don't look like their going anywhere soon. Gasly wants a seat in F1 soon, and I don't think Camara is too far behind him, so if Sainz wants to stay in F1, he better find another team sooner or later. He could have a long career in the Mercedes if he performs decently, he'd be stupid not to take it. it'd also let Red Bull put Gasly in the Rosso next year, which I wouldn't mind seeing at all.

[Jezza13]

....but Red Bull currently have two young drivers in their A team, who don't look like their going anywhere soon.

Mmmm. I'm not convinced this is the case.

If the 2017 RB is as good a car as we all hope & think it'll be, I wouldn't mind betting we'll be seeing the manager of one of them with his phone out quite a bit as the season progresses.

I expect real fire works next year from Ricciardo and Verstappen and i'm just wondering when we'll start to read reports of disharmony in the team. I don't think it's a case of if, but more a case of when.

[Schumacher forever#1]

I just can't see William's getting much in the way of Bottas going to Mercedes if Mercedes really want him. Surely Bottas would be dying to get the seat as well?

Hopefully it's only just their preferred option and they would be open to bringing in another driver like Sainz if it's too much effort to get Bottas in (Yes, I'm not a fan of Bottas). Although Sainz is loyal to the Red Bull program so he might not be easy to get either.

Williams issue is the uncertanty of the next few years. Yes, they could earn a lot of money, but Martini need a driver over 25, and a strong one to avoid falling too far down the constructors table. If it all goes tits up next year and their car is worse in comparison to the rest of the field, and they have two weaker inexperienced drivers, then they could loose a hell of a lot more than they could gain by letting Mercedes take Bottas. Bottas is probably begging Mercedes for a contract for 2018 to give Williams time to prepare, but I think if they take Sainz it'll be over for him.

While I don't think Sainz has an issue with the Red Bull system, in fact, I imagine he's grateful it got him to F1, but Red Bull currently have two young drivers in their A team, who don't look like their going anywhere soon. Gasly wants a seat in F1 soon, and I don't think Camara is too far behind him, so if Sainz wants to stay in F1, he better find another team sooner or later. He could have a long career in the Mercedes if he performs decently, he'd be stupid not to take it. it'd also let Red Bull put Gasly in the Rosso next year, which I wouldn't mind seeing at all.

Good analysis! I'm not too sure on Red Bulls drivers sticking around. Sainz has said before, if he had to choose, he would pick Red Bull to be his first championship winning team. I don't think Ricciardo is that loyal to RB, and, given a better opportunity, he would take it IMO, especially if Verstappen steps up another gear. Then again I think most drivers would probably like to take their chances with another team than be paired with Verstappen, so maybe it isn't in Sainz' best interest to stay. If Red Bull do allow Sainz to go, then yes he should take it, and I'd probably agree he would take it.

I agree on Bottas. If he doesn't get on this Mercedes train I don't think he'll ever make it to the top. Williams could definitely get sunk down into a Sauber-esque situation with two pay drivers performing poorly with a car that's 7th or 8th best.

[Randine]

I just can't see William's getting much in the way of Bottas going to Mercedes if Mercedes really want him. Surely Bottas would be dying to get the seat as well?

Hopefully it's only just their preferred option and they would be open to bringing in another driver like Sainz if it's too much effort to get Bottas in (Yes, I'm not a fan of Bottas). Although Sainz is loyal to the Red Bull program so he might not be easy to get either.

Williams issue is the uncertanty of the next few years. Yes, they could earn a lot of money, but Martini need a driver over 25, and a strong one to avoid falling too far down the constructors table. If it all goes tits up next year and their car is worse in comparison to the rest of the field, and they have two weaker inexperienced drivers, then they could loose a hell of a lot more than they could gain by letting Mercedes take Bottas. Bottas is probably begging Mercedes for a contract for 2018 to give Williams time to prepare, but I think if they take Sainz it'll be over for him.

While I don't think Sainz has an issue with the Red Bull system, in fact, I imagine he's grateful it got him to F1, but Red Bull currently have two young drivers in their A team, who don't look like their going anywhere soon. Gasly wants a seat in F1 soon, and I don't think Camara is too far behind him, so if Sainz wants to stay in F1, he better find another team sooner or later. He could have a long career in the Mercedes if he performs decently, he'd be stupid not to take it. it'd also let Red Bull put Gasly in the Rosso next year, which I wouldn't mind seeing at all.

Good analysis! I'm not too sure on Red Bulls drivers sticking around. Sainz has said before, if he had to choose, he would pick Red Bull to be his first championship winning team. I don't think Ricciardo is that loyal to RB, and, given a better opportunity, he would take it IMO, especially if Verstappen steps up another gear. Then again I think most drivers would probably like to take their chances with another team than be paired with Verstappen, so maybe it isn't in Sainz' best interest to stay. If Red Bull do allow Sainz to go, then yes he should take it, and I'd probably agree he would take it.

I agree on Bottas. If he doesn't get on this Mercedes train I don't think he'll ever make it to the top. Williams could definitely get sunk down into a Sauber-esque situation with two pay drivers performing poorly with a car that's 7th or 8th best.

I think Williams are in trouble with or with out Bottas.
With Renault introducing a new engine design, Toro Rosso moving from year old engines back to Renault, Honda confident of a step forward to help McLaren, Force India with more prize money than ever, I could see Williams slipping to 8th in the constructors next year.

There only saving grace might be if they diverted funding away from this year to concentrate early on next years car.
The edge the Merc engine once gave them is slipping year by year.
They picked up 2 big sponsors from Lotus and with the 3rd in the constructors was estimated to be an extra 55 million for their budget for 2016.
But what did they do with the extra funds? It didn't translate to on track performance.

On the Merc replacement, there is an interesting article on ESPN that looks at some of the more obscure possibilities to fill the seat including Pastor!!!

http://www.espn.com.au/f1/story/_/id/18 ... edes-drive

[UnlikeUday]

Williams reject Bottas move, Bottas seems like first choice...

Lowe also going to Williams it seems...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/38282791

This just proves that Mercedes aren't comfortable in putting Wehrlein in the 2nd seat atleast for 2017!

[LKS1]

Williams reject Bottas move, Bottas seems like first choice...

Lowe also going to Williams it seems...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/38282791

This just proves that Mercedes aren't comfortable in putting Wehrlein in the 2nd seat atleast for 2017!

I'm inclined to agree, but they may have little choice.

If Williams are seriously intending to get back to the top (and signing Lowe is an indication that they may be), then it can only harm them to let Bottas move to Merc - leaving them with two rookies as drivers. Not only Martini would be concerned about this, any other sponsors would possibly take this as an indication that they're not equipped/determined to do everything possible to become a WCC/WDC contender.

[Grizzly B]

Williams reject Bottas move, Bottas seems like first choice...

Lowe also going to Williams it seems...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/38282791

That article also mentions Sainz as an outside option if they cannot get Bottas. That would be pretty exciting and would represent the least destabilising as they have the current GP2 Champion that can jump into the seat left vacant by Sainz.

[mikeyg123]

Williams reject Bottas move, Bottas seems like first choice...

Lowe also going to Williams it seems...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/38282791

That article also mentions Sainz as an outside option if they cannot get Bottas. That would be pretty exciting and would represent the least destabilising as they have the current GP2 Champion that can jump into the seat left vacant by Sainz.

Red Bull won't let Sainz go so it's a non starter.

[stevey]

Is Bottas not a huge conflict in interest given who his manager is?

I'd love to see Sainz in it, I really rate him.

[shoot999]

Is Bottas not a huge conflict in interest given who his manager is?

I'd love to see Sainz in it, I really rate him.

Not sure of the legal status with respect to 'conflict of interest'; but you can bet on some serious 'conflict' next year if a team order benefits Bottas to the detriment of Hamilton.
Possibly why Hamilton was at Wolff's house this weekend. To sort out a few ground rules?

[Grizzly B]

Williams reject Bottas move, Bottas seems like first choice...

Lowe also going to Williams it seems...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/38282791

That article also mentions Sainz as an outside option if they cannot get Bottas. That would be pretty exciting and would represent the least destabilising as they have the current GP2 Champion that can jump into the seat left vacant by Sainz.

Red Bull won't let Sainz go so it's a non starter.

The article seems to suggest otherwise.

[moby]

I just can't see William's getting much in the way of Bottas going to Mercedes if Mercedes really want him. Surely Bottas would be dying to get the seat as well?

Hopefully it's only just their preferred option and they would be open to bringing in another driver like Sainz if it's too much effort to get Bottas in (Yes, I'm not a fan of Bottas). Although Sainz is loyal to the Red Bull program so he might not be easy to get either.

Williams issue is the uncertanty of the next few years. Yes, they could earn a lot of money, but Martini need a driver over 25, and a strong one to avoid falling too far down the constructors table. If it all goes tits up next year and their car is worse in comparison to the rest of the field, and they have two weaker inexperienced drivers, then they could loose a hell of a lot more than they could gain by letting Mercedes take Bottas. Bottas is probably begging Mercedes for a contract for 2018 to give Williams time to prepare, but I think if they take Sainz it'll be over for him.

While I don't think Sainz has an issue with the Red Bull system, in fact, I imagine he's grateful it got him to F1, but Red Bull currently have two young drivers in their A team, who don't look like their going anywhere soon. Gasly wants a seat in F1 soon, and I don't think Camara is too far behind him, so if Sainz wants to stay in F1, he better find another team sooner or later. He could have a long career in the Mercedes if he performs decently, he'd be stupid not to take it. it'd also let Red Bull put Gasly in the Rosso next year, which I wouldn't mind seeing at all.

Good analysis! I'm not too sure on Red Bulls drivers sticking around. Sainz has said before, if he had to choose, he would pick Red Bull to be his first championship winning team. I don't think Ricciardo is that loyal to RB, and, given a better opportunity, he would take it IMO, especially if Verstappen steps up another gear. Then again I think most drivers would probably like to take their chances with another team than be paired with Verstappen, so maybe it isn't in Sainz' best interest to stay. If Red Bull do allow Sainz to go, then yes he should take it, and I'd probably agree he would take it.

I agree on Bottas. If he doesn't get on this Mercedes train I don't think he'll ever make it to the top. Williams could definitely get sunk down into a Sauber-esque situation with two pay drivers performing poorly with a car that's 7th or 8th best.

I think Williams are in trouble with or with out Bottas.
With Renault introducing a new engine design, Toro Rosso moving from year old engines back to Renault, Honda confident of a step forward to help McLaren, Force India with more prize money than ever, I could see Williams slipping to 8th in the constructors next year.

There only saving grace might be if they diverted funding away from this year to concentrate early on next years car.
The edge the Merc engine once gave them is slipping year by year.
They picked up 2 big sponsors from Lotus and with the 3rd in the constructors was estimated to be an extra 55 million for their budget for 2016.
But what did they do with the extra funds? It didn't translate to on track performance.

On the Merc replacement, there is an interesting article on ESPN that looks at some of the more obscure possibilities to fill the seat including Pastor!!!

http://www.espn.com.au/f1/story/_/id/18 ... edes-drive

I suspect RBR would do all they can not to let Merc have Sainz, even if they do not intend to renew his contract next year.
First off, whoever is in the Merc will be competing for points if not wins with Red Bull, so anything they can do to reduce the likelihood of a Merc finishing infront of a Bull they will do.

Second, I think they would do it just for "schadenfreude". They were not happy when Merc would not give them an engine and may see this as an opportunity to show them the fingers.

[nixxxon]

I'd really like Sainz to get the seat.

Sainz is really a driver similar to Rosberg as he is not selfish, a top team player, and a focussed, quick and hard working driver.

Red Bull has two top drivers already in their first team. They can't have three.

They should not force sainz to get stuck in a midfield toro rosso if a top team wants to sign him.

[slide]

its down to 2 in my mind , sainz - exciting and fast , or bottas - rock steady and fast

I think merc will whittle it down to these 2 in the end , and either would work very well indeed

young and fast , or experienced and fast , and , not sure about this part - who will score the most points , so possibly bottas on that one , but not sure

[UnlikeUday]

Since Sainz (Toro Rosso) & Bottas (Williams) names have been included in the F1 2017 list published by the FIA, can any driver (including these 2) be swapped & if yes, what's the maximum time within which this could be deemed legal before the start of the season or 2017 year?

[fieldstvl]

Post removed as it consisted solely of unsourced images.

[mcdo]

....but Red Bull currently have two young drivers in their A team, who don't look like their going anywhere soon.

Mmmm. I'm not convinced this is the case.

If the 2017 RB is as good a car as we all hope & think it'll be, I wouldn't mind betting we'll be seeing the manager of one of them with his phone out quite a bit as the season progresses.

I expect real fire works next year from Ricciardo and Verstappen and i'm just wondering when we'll start to read reports of disharmony in the team. I don't think it's a case of if, but more a case of when.

If there's one thing I think we can all be certain about it's that those 2 are going to have an almighty fall out if Red Bull provide a peach of a car

[nixxxon]

Quote removed, post nullified.

[Grizzly B]

Quote removed, post nullified.

[UnlikeUday]

Mercedes won't be delighted to sign Wehrlein as they probably feel it's premature signing him for 2017.

With no other option available, Mercedes will sign Wehrlein. Good for Hamilton though.

[Lt. Drebin]

Mercedes won't be delighted to sign Wehrlein as they probably feel it's premature signing him for 2017.

With no other option available, Mercedes will sign Wehrlein. Good for Hamilton though.

Yes, unless he starts beating him occasionally and then more regularly, just as he did it to Alonso 10 years ago.

[AngusWolfe]

Since Sainz (Toro Rosso) & Bottas (Williams) names have been included in the F1 2017 list published by the FIA, can any driver (including these 2) be swapped & if yes, what's the maximum time within which this could be deemed legal before the start of the season or 2017 year?

considering there have been mid-season changes for years in F1, I'd say the Thursday before any given race weekend.

[mikeyg123]

Since Sainz (Toro Rosso) & Bottas (Williams) names have been included in the F1 2017 list published by the FIA, can any driver (including these 2) be swapped & if yes, what's the maximum time within which this could be deemed legal before the start of the season or 2017 year?

considering there have been mid-season changes for years in F1, I'd say the Thursday before any given race weekend.

They can bring a new driver in just before qualifying if they want. I remember De La Rosa stepping in for Perez at Canada 2011.

[moby]

They did it with max and Rio last year mid season, but I think there is a limit (3?)

[mikeyg123]

They did it with max and Rio last year mid season, but I think there is a limit (3?)

A team is only allowed to use 4 drivers per season. I've no idea why.