Re: Hamilton vs rosberg. Part 265
Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2016 4:34 pm
Need to find the video
I tuned in for the last few laps and caught the incident. Rosberg preventing Hamilton rejoining is where the line was crossed for me. I'm not a fan of drivers pushing each other off on the outside of a corner but it's become accepted by default really at some corners.lamo wrote:They didn't touch when Hamilton re-joined. Taking a line to prevent someone re-joining the track is the worst part of this for me. Very unsportsmanlikes from Rosberg. Basically, Rosberg thinks its ok to push you off track and then prevent you from rejoining it. Crazytrento wrote:The entry point was Rosberg's fault. But Hamilton's re-entry to the track and hitting Rosberg looks wrong too.
Often drivers that receive penalty during race still don't lose any position. There question is whether 10 seconds penalties were given for similar incidents in the past. If so you can't really complain.Yellowbin74 wrote:Then that's a farce. No penalty at all really. Nice to see the stewards bottled it again.
Maybe he wants to feel he has natural peers and is in the right place.dizlexik wrote:Did they hurt you?Unparalleled wrote:Sorry but anyone that thinks Lewis was at fault has no business on a racing forum. It was clear cut.dizlexik wrote:They are people who have different opinions, no need to call them animals. Lets respect each other.
So what's the point of a penalty that isn't actually a penalty?dizlexik wrote:Often drivers that receive penalty during race still don't lose any position. There question is whether 10 seconds penalties were given for similar incidents in the past. If so you can't really complain.Yellowbin74 wrote:Then that's a farce. No penalty at all really. Nice to see the stewards bottled it again.
Proves nothing, If Nico had gone straight forward like what happened to Montoya, both drivers would have been out.Flash2k11 wrote:...and this proves what?trento wrote:Same incident. 0:30 onwards. Just that Montoya braked much later.
Did you read my post? It's like free kick in football. It might not change result, but nevertheless it's making it a bit more difficult for the side that committed foul. In fact in most of cases it changes nothing.Yellowbin74 wrote:So what's the point of a penalty that isn't actually a penalty?dizlexik wrote:Often drivers that receive penalty during race still don't lose any position. There question is whether 10 seconds penalties were given for similar incidents in the past. If so you can't really complain.Yellowbin74 wrote:Then that's a farce. No penalty at all really. Nice to see the stewards bottled it again.
I don't think they're supposed to look at the proximity of the cars behind. They just pick the punishment they feel is fitting of the crimeYellowbin74 wrote:So what's the point of a penalty that isn't actually a penalty?dizlexik wrote:Often drivers that receive penalty during race still don't lose any position. There question is whether 10 seconds penalties were given for similar incidents in the past. If so you can't really complain.Yellowbin74 wrote:Then that's a farce. No penalty at all really. Nice to see the stewards bottled it again.
Not that dumb, he won, if he hadn't the WC Standings would be a difference of 31 points instead of 11 with NR maintaining momentum, now Nico is in a hole mentally and LH has reasserted his authority.Blinky McSquinty wrote: Morally Rosberg was in the wrong and Hamilton was in the right. But intellectually, come on guys, even my stupid goldfish knew that if both drivers continued to contest that corner it would end in tears. That was dumb on Hamilton's part to make that collision inevitable, it was going to happen.
Without the grid penalty Nico would probably have won easily as he almost did it anyways so I don´t see him thinking that at all.Option or Prime wrote:Not that dumb, he won, if he hadn't the WC Standings would be a difference of 31 points instead of 11 with NR maintaining momentum, now Nico is in a hole mentally and LH has reasserted his authority.Blinky McSquinty wrote: Morally Rosberg was in the wrong and Hamilton was in the right. But intellectually, come on guys, even my stupid goldfish knew that if both drivers continued to contest that corner it would end in tears. That was dumb on Hamilton's part to make that collision inevitable, it was going to happen.
Rosberg must be thinking "what do I have to do to beat him, even when I try to run him off the road he wins!" Could well be critical in this years WC especiallly if Toto throws his toys!
So what you are saying is that its dumb for one driver to try and pass the other at this point?'Blinky McSquinty wrote:As soon as the TV displayed Hamilton getting a better drive out of turn one, my mind immediately sprang to Suzuka 1990 where two title contenders in the form of Senna and Prost went into a corner, none came out, and one held onto the title. Then while braking and as the situation developed, it was obvious that Rosberg had adopted a brass knuckles approach of, "if you don't back out, we will collide or I will push you far off the track".
So yes, Rosberg was playing very rough, and I have labelled such driving as dirty. It was dirty. I can understand where this has come from, Hamilton has done that very same thing to him, my mind recalls last year at Suzuka and just back in Canada. But two rights don't make a wrong, it was dirty driving on Rosberg's part.
Morally Rosberg was in the wrong and Hamilton was in the right. But intellectually, come on guys, even my stupid goldfish knew that if both drivers continued to contest that corner it would end in tears. That was dumb on Hamilton's part to make that collision inevitable, it was going to happen.
Without the grid penalty Nico would not have undercut Hamilton at the first pitstop, the sole reason he had track position.Covalent wrote:Without the grid penalty Nico would probably have won easily as he almost did it anyways so I don´t see him thinking that at all.Option or Prime wrote:Not that dumb, he won, if he hadn't the WC Standings would be a difference of 31 points instead of 11 with NR maintaining momentum, now Nico is in a hole mentally and LH has reasserted his authority.Blinky McSquinty wrote: Morally Rosberg was in the wrong and Hamilton was in the right. But intellectually, come on guys, even my stupid goldfish knew that if both drivers continued to contest that corner it would end in tears. That was dumb on Hamilton's part to make that collision inevitable, it was going to happen.
Rosberg must be thinking "what do I have to do to beat him, even when I try to run him off the road he wins!" Could well be critical in this years WC especiallly if Toto throws his toys!
Potential steward then !Teddy007 wrote:Will also add my other half thought it was Lewis's fault because she thought he was the inside driver. She was like why do i think Lewis was innocent? He crashed in to Nico? I said because Lewis was on the outside and Nico was the inside. Her response was Ohhhhh I thought Lewis was the inside one. She doesnt watch F1 and isnt fussed at all about the outcome.
Option or Prime wrote:Potential steward then !Teddy007 wrote:Will also add my other half thought it was Lewis's fault because she thought he was the inside driver. She was like why do i think Lewis was innocent? He crashed in to Nico? I said because Lewis was on the outside and Nico was the inside. Her response was Ohhhhh I thought Lewis was the inside one. She doesnt watch F1 and isnt fussed at all about the outcome.
Count me in.Lojik wrote:Can the people who vote Hamilton please let me let me know who they are so I can safely disregard anything they say in future. That's nuts.
It's not the team saying that it is the stewards! Not only that its not as though the its a 50:50 situation, the votes are either 80:20 or 90:10 that Rosberg was to blame.babararacucudada wrote:Count me in.Lojik wrote:Can the people who vote Hamilton please let me let me know who they are so I can safely disregard anything they say in future. That's nuts.
Hamilton has established in the team that if you are on the inside, you can go off the racing line to force your team mate off the track. He did that in Hungary and the USA and Mercedes did nothing about it, so by doing that they said it was OK to do it.
Now, because Rosberg does it, does that mean the team have one rule for Hamilton and one rule for Rosberg?
BIBhittheapex wrote:I tuned in for the last few laps and caught the incident. Rosberg preventing Hamilton rejoining is where the line was crossed for me. I'm not a fan of drivers pushing each other off on the outside of a corner but it's become accepted by default really at some corners.lamo wrote:They didn't touch when Hamilton re-joined. Taking a line to prevent someone re-joining the track is the worst part of this for me. Very unsportsmanlikes from Rosberg. Basically, Rosberg thinks its ok to push you off track and then prevent you from rejoining it. Crazytrento wrote:The entry point was Rosberg's fault. But Hamilton's re-entry to the track and hitting Rosberg looks wrong too.
I'm surprised at the leniency of the stewards on this one. As ever, dangerous driving gets punished much more severely when it results in a serious accident. For example Grosjean at Spa vs Maldonado at Monaco. When the other driver in the incident takes action to avoid a dangerous accident, or gets through relatively unscathed, the perpetrator comparatively gets a slap on the wrist.
Even Button commented after the race words to the effect of, 'he didn't even give him room to come back on the track!' DC on the C4 highlights coverage also made a point of mentioning it. Very petulant behavior from Rosberg.babararacucudada wrote:BIBhittheapex wrote:I tuned in for the last few laps and caught the incident. Rosberg preventing Hamilton rejoining is where the line was crossed for me. I'm not a fan of drivers pushing each other off on the outside of a corner but it's become accepted by default really at some corners.lamo wrote:They didn't touch when Hamilton re-joined. Taking a line to prevent someone re-joining the track is the worst part of this for me. Very unsportsmanlikes from Rosberg. Basically, Rosberg thinks its ok to push you off track and then prevent you from rejoining it. Crazytrento wrote:The entry point was Rosberg's fault. But Hamilton's re-entry to the track and hitting Rosberg looks wrong too.
I'm surprised at the leniency of the stewards on this one. As ever, dangerous driving gets punished much more severely when it results in a serious accident. For example Grosjean at Spa vs Maldonado at Monaco. When the other driver in the incident takes action to avoid a dangerous accident, or gets through relatively unscathed, the perpetrator comparatively gets a slap on the wrist.
Its the responsibility of the driver re-joining the track to re-join safely. The driver on the track is not required to make room for him.
So your argument is that if more people say one thing it is automatically right?Option or Prime wrote:It's not the team saying that it is the stewards! Not only that its not as though the its a 50:50 situation, the votes are either 80:20 or 90:10 that Rosberg was to blame.babararacucudada wrote:Count me in.Lojik wrote:Can the people who vote Hamilton please let me let me know who they are so I can safely disregard anything they say in future. That's nuts.
Hamilton has established in the team that if you are on the inside, you can go off the racing line to force your team mate off the track. He did that in Hungary and the USA and Mercedes did nothing about it, so by doing that they said it was OK to do it.
Now, because Rosberg does it, does that mean the team have one rule for Hamilton and one rule for Rosberg?
I admire your support of Rosberg, nothing wrong with that, but don't let that support blind you to the facts.
Rosberg has learned well from Hamilton and Mercedes. This was bound to happen because Rosberg was forced to act the same way as Hamilton.PzR Slim wrote:Even Button commented after the race words to the effect of, 'he didn't even give him room to come back on the track!' DC on the C4 highlights coverage also made a point of mentioning it. Very petulant behavior from Rosberg.babararacucudada wrote:BIBhittheapex wrote:I tuned in for the last few laps and caught the incident. Rosberg preventing Hamilton rejoining is where the line was crossed for me. I'm not a fan of drivers pushing each other off on the outside of a corner but it's become accepted by default really at some corners.lamo wrote:They didn't touch when Hamilton re-joined. Taking a line to prevent someone re-joining the track is the worst part of this for me. Very unsportsmanlikes from Rosberg. Basically, Rosberg thinks its ok to push you off track and then prevent you from rejoining it. Crazytrento wrote:The entry point was Rosberg's fault. But Hamilton's re-entry to the track and hitting Rosberg looks wrong too.
I'm surprised at the leniency of the stewards on this one. As ever, dangerous driving gets punished much more severely when it results in a serious accident. For example Grosjean at Spa vs Maldonado at Monaco. When the other driver in the incident takes action to avoid a dangerous accident, or gets through relatively unscathed, the perpetrator comparatively gets a slap on the wrist.
Its the responsibility of the driver re-joining the track to re-join safely. The driver on the track is not required to make room for him.
Let me check ... umm, yes, that's what I wrote.mikeyg123 wrote:So what you are saying is that its dumb for one driver to try and pass the other at this point?'Blinky McSquinty wrote:As soon as the TV displayed Hamilton getting a better drive out of turn one, my mind immediately sprang to Suzuka 1990 where two title contenders in the form of Senna and Prost went into a corner, none came out, and one held onto the title. Then while braking and as the situation developed, it was obvious that Rosberg had adopted a brass knuckles approach of, "if you don't back out, we will collide or I will push you far off the track".
So yes, Rosberg was playing very rough, and I have labelled such driving as dirty. It was dirty. I can understand where this has come from, Hamilton has done that very same thing to him, my mind recalls last year at Suzuka and just back in Canada. But two rights don't make a wrong, it was dirty driving on Rosberg's part.
Morally Rosberg was in the wrong and Hamilton was in the right. But intellectually, come on guys, even my stupid goldfish knew that if both drivers continued to contest that corner it would end in tears. That was dumb on Hamilton's part to make that collision inevitable, it was going to happen.
The Mercedes team have said that in the past by not reacting when Hamilton went way off the racing line to force Rosberg off the track in the past.Option or Prime wrote:It's not the team saying that it is the stewards! Not only that its not as though the its a 50:50 situation, the votes are either 80:20 or 90:10 that Rosberg was to blame.babararacucudada wrote:Count me in.Lojik wrote:Can the people who vote Hamilton please let me let me know who they are so I can safely disregard anything they say in future. That's nuts.
Hamilton has established in the team that if you are on the inside, you can go off the racing line to force your team mate off the track. He did that in Hungary and the USA and Mercedes did nothing about it, so by doing that they said it was OK to do it.
Now, because Rosberg does it, does that mean the team have one rule for Hamilton and one rule for Rosberg?
I admire your support of Rosberg, nothing wrong with that, but don't let that support blind you to the facts.
When did Hamilton not allow another driver back onto the track like Rosberg today?babararacucudada wrote:Rosberg has learned well from Hamilton and Mercedes. This was bound to happen because Rosberg was forced to act the same way as Hamilton.
What I stated are facts and you can check it if you want by looking up the videos.Option or Prime wrote:OK so you are already blinded then, you know perfectly well what I mean.
Incidentally there are no facts in your statement, it's your opinion.
I never said he did.PzR Slim wrote:When did Hamilton not allow another driver back onto the track like Rosberg today?babararacucudada wrote:Rosberg has learned well from Hamilton and Mercedes. This was bound to happen because Rosberg was forced to act the same way as Hamilton.
Forced because he was going to be overtaken, he lost his cool and made a clumsy move that led to him ruining his own race and gifting a positions to Verstaphen and Raikkonen as well as points to Hamilton.babararacucudada wrote: Rosberg has learned well from Hamilton and Mercedes. This was bound to happen because Rosberg was forced to act the same way as Hamilton.
I'll just repeat what I said then.babararacucudada wrote:I never said he did.PzR Slim wrote:When did Hamilton not allow another driver back onto the track like Rosberg today?babararacucudada wrote:Rosberg has learned well from Hamilton and Mercedes. This was bound to happen because Rosberg was forced to act the same way as Hamilton.
There is no requirement to let another driver back onto the track.
Last time I said that you started banging on about Rosberg just doing what Hamilton had done, hence why I asked the questionEven Button commented after the race words to the effect of, 'he didn't even give him room to come back on the track!' DC on the C4 highlights coverage also made a point of mentioning it. Very petulant behavior from Rosberg.
really? He didn't even get pole and he wouldn't have got a better strategy if they were 1-2. Same as ever, the driver who lead after lap 1 would have won. But that did go out of the window today because Mercedes broke there rule of both cars running the same strategy and they were both in the same a race at that point running P1 and P3 just 6 seconds behind.Covalent wrote:Without the grid penalty Nico would probably have won easily as he almost did it anyways so I don´t see him thinking that at all.Option or Prime wrote:Not that dumb, he won, if he hadn't the WC Standings would be a difference of 31 points instead of 11 with NR maintaining momentum, now Nico is in a hole mentally and LH has reasserted his authority.Blinky McSquinty wrote: Morally Rosberg was in the wrong and Hamilton was in the right. But intellectually, come on guys, even my stupid goldfish knew that if both drivers continued to contest that corner it would end in tears. That was dumb on Hamilton's part to make that collision inevitable, it was going to happen.
Rosberg must be thinking "what do I have to do to beat him, even when I try to run him off the road he wins!" Could well be critical in this years WC especiallly if Toto throws his toys!