Jerez Testing

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sandman1347
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by sandman1347 »

AstoriaisBACK wrote:
mds wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
AstoriaisBACK wrote:
dizlexik wrote:I still can't see Ferrari being good. Ferrari has always been quite reliable during winter.

Everyone as an opinion, your is as good as anyones else's. The only real thing you have is numbers, and right now the numbers don't prove your position.
No you also have experience.
Well experience isn't really the issue here. The point is: the numbers today don't prove that they're not good - AstoriaisBACK has a point there. However, the numbers don't disprove that they're not good as well.

Furthermore, contrary to AstoriaisBACK's conclusion, the numbers do not say that Ferrari were fast today. They merely say they were the fastest. That doesn't sound like a big difference, but it's a HUGE difference. Being "the fastest" is relative. Being "fast" is objective.

Half a second faster than McLaren were last year, that's still not tremendously fast considering the McLaren was not a great car, PU's were being eased in one year ago and speed wasn't really unleashed before Bahrain. Whereas now, PU's are evolutions instead of revolutions and can be ran full blast much sooner.

Your incorrect. the numbers say that today Ferrari was fast. they beat the best testing times of last year, they bested every team that ran today. so today there were the fastest and today they were fast. I don't know what planet you come from however the numbers are the numbers. Ferrari was fastest and Ferrari was fast. Thats all I said and that is fact
Actually today's numbers don't tell us anything about how fast they were; not in absolute terms nor in relation to the other teams. In order to know that they were fast we would have to have some idea of what programs were being run and what fuel loads, engine revs, etc. (both by them and by the other teams). All we know is that they logged the lowest lap time today (much like they did at this time last year). That lap time does not tell us that the car was fast at all.

RunningMan
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by RunningMan »

mds wrote:
Colo134 wrote:was anyone at the test today? how to the cars look and sound this year on track?
Well the Honda engine sounds horrible: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fr1ooM8s5pI

And this is the Ferrari: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eoq-ORJBmyg
The guys down at autosport live thought that the Honda was on half power or something, which could explain why it sounds like it does.
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mds
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by mds »

JohnnyGuitar wrote:
mds wrote:
Colo134 wrote:was anyone at the test today? how to the cars look and sound this year on track?
Well the Honda engine sounds horrible: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fr1ooM8s5pI

And this is the Ferrari: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eoq-ORJBmyg
A car warming up in a garage then driving down the pitlane on a limiter vs one on a quick lap. Nice, fair comparison.
Who said I was comparing them? Someone asked for material so I posted two clips. I'm sorry, next time I won't post anymore.

Apart from that, the Honda does sound bad and it's clearly not just the pit limiter. Don't know if you've watched the full clip but it's not just in the pit lane.
Not that it's unusual for the thing to sound suboptimal at this point.
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Zoue
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by Zoue »

@mds. Please do keep posting clips if you come across them. Some are grateful for it, thank you.

It doesn't sound that healthy. That being said, as has been pointed out, by you and others, it's not unique to Honda at this stage of development. I don't think it should come as a surprise

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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by JohnnyGuitar »

mds wrote:
JohnnyGuitar wrote:
mds wrote:
Colo134 wrote:was anyone at the test today? how to the cars look and sound this year on track?
Well the Honda engine sounds horrible: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fr1ooM8s5pI

And this is the Ferrari: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eoq-ORJBmyg
A car warming up in a garage then driving down the pitlane on a limiter vs one on a quick lap. Nice, fair comparison.
Who said I was comparing them? Someone asked for material so I posted two clips. I'm sorry, next time I won't post anymore.

Apart from that, the Honda does sound bad and it's clearly not just the pit limiter. Don't know if you've watched the full clip but it's not just in the pit lane.
Not that it's unusual for the thing to sound suboptimal at this point.
Yes I've seen the whole thing because it's made of up of two separate clips I saw earlier today.

I don't think it's fair to say it sounds horrible when it's clearly not running properly yet.

When they open the taps up it'll sound similar to the others; it's bound to because it's a similar unit.

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mds
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by mds »

JohnnyGuitar wrote: Yes I've seen the whole thing because it's made of up of two separate clips I saw earlier today.

I don't think it's fair to say it sounds horrible when it's clearly not running properly yet.

When they open the taps up it'll sound similar to the others; it's bound to because it's a similar unit.
It's not two separate clips - it's five or six actually, and after the first few there are a couple of clips of the car running on track.

I disagree, it's perfectly fair to say it sounds horrible when it does sound horrible. It would be unfair to conclude anything from that or slate them for it, but I'm not doing that. I'm doing nothing more than stating fact.

Honestly speaking I think, from what I hear, that it has the potential to be the best sounding engine of all (trying to listen between all the chokes and coughs). But right now, they have work to do - and as I said, that is not abnormal at this point. But I don't think it's just because it's running restricted.
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RaggedMan
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by RaggedMan »

On the ESPN feed they said that the problem with the McLaren was with the sensors not talking to each other properly which I'm sure would've effected the timing and mapping which could certainly make any engine sound horrible.

The Ferrari looks good on track and sounded pretty good while at it.
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by Laura23 »

RaggedMan wrote:On the ESPN feed they said that the problem with the McLaren was with the sensors not talking to each other properly which I'm sure would've effected the timing and mapping which could certainly make any engine sound horrible.

The Ferrari looks good on track and sounded pretty good while at it.
Ferrari had some sensor issues too I believe which does make their pace look fairly decent but it remains to be seen if they can do consistent long runs like Mercedes.
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specdecible
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by specdecible »

Ok so after getting back from the circuit here's my impressions:

Rosberg did a lot of running, eventually he jumped inside the car and did some laps too.
Vettel was fastest by the end of the day, he celebrated by showing his finger to everyone he met.
The Sauber had an unusually high number of Ukrainian supporters.
Apparently Red Bull were sporting a new testing livery, had a look around, couldn't see it.
When Williams did a lap it was quite impressive, I thought she was supposed to be at the Australian Open at the moment.
Torro Rosso spent a lot of time working with the new drivers, they had a lot of homework to finish before school starts again.
McLaren did a handful of laps, well two handfuls actually if you discount the thumbs and two other fingers
While the Lotus car wasn't at the circuit, the mechanics tried to fool the other teams into thinking they had something there by making engine noises with their mouths.

So far from day 1 testing we can conclude that Force India are so confident in their design they didn't even come, therefore season over FI WC roll on 2016.
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mds
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by mds »

specdecible wrote:...
:lol: thanks for the good laughs. That was pretty good actually :)


Day two has started. Reports of the Honda still sounding pretty unhealthy. Meanwhile Vettel and Ferrari seem to be keen on doing laps at reasonable speed - posting in the low 1:23's with medium tyres. If anything he'll be happy to be doing more laps than he did last year in Jerez...
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Clarky
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by Clarky »

Vettel does a 1m21.884

beastlymaiden
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by beastlymaiden »

Hmm.. Are Ferrari looking good this year ??

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mds
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by mds »

Clarky wrote:Vettel does a 1m21.884
At the beginning of a seven-lap run on medium tyres.
Which goes to show that yesterday's time was nowhere near "fast".

4 seconds to go and we're in 2013 territory ;)
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by Exediron »

beastlymaiden wrote:Hmm.. Are Ferrari looking good this year ??
I wouldn't get my hopes up. Ferrari always aim to overperform in testing and free practice, then get caught out when every other team improves when it really matters. They practically invented glory running.

... But I would love it if they can really take the challenge to Merc this year; that Ferrari is a fine looking car, the more I see it the more I like it.
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by Warheart01 »

That Lotus is looking fantastic!

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SwedeForceOne
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by SwedeForceOne »

I predict 1:19:5 as fastest laptime when the Jerez test is over. What u guys think?

Bacus
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by Bacus »

It does seem it has some pace...just when Fernando left :lol:

(or like someone said, Vettel shows what Ferrari true pace is :-P )

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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by Exediron »

Warheart01 wrote:That Lotus is looking fantastic!
I was thinking the same thing - it's amazing how good it looks when you get a proper racing car's nose on it ;)
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by Warheart01 »

Exediron wrote:
Warheart01 wrote:That Lotus is looking fantastic!
I was thinking the same thing - it's amazing how good it looks when you get a proper racing car's nose on it ;)
:thumbup: :lol:

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Clarky
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by Clarky »

Vettel does a 1m20.984s

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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by Bacus »

here we go again, another Vettel era :lol:

M44
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by M44 »

Vettel goes and does a 1:20:9..

:-)

Like Newey said yesterday in an interview with Craig Slater (Sky Sports). The aero gains this year are minimal as the regulations don't allow the designers much freedom.. He said a lot of gains would be made via the chassis, which is interesting..

Does anybody have any information on whether Ferarri are running a different spec engine to Abu Dhabi? As it would appear that Mercedes is running similar spec just to gain aero data.

Either way, it's only testing. We will get reflections of true pace come Australia.. But at least Ferarri are looking a bit more competitive this year, and there car looks a million times better.

Although I think The Lotus looks gorgeous.

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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by Desert Storm »

From Autosport
09:53 The Red Bull has headed out without a front wing on. Either that, or it's covered with aero paint that makes it invisible...
Flexi wings? No sir, no wings to flex :-P

Uffman
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by Uffman »

Where there any red flags?

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mds
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by mds »

SwedeForceOne wrote:I predict 1:19:5 as fastest laptime when the Jerez test is over. What u guys think?
Doesn't seem out of reach at this point. Vettel has done a 1:20.9, he used medium tyres, and I don't think the Ferrari is anywhere near competitive with the W06.
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Clarky
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by Clarky »

Image

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Clarky
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by Clarky »

Uffman wrote:Where there any red flags?
I know of 1 late yesterday

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dizlexik
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by dizlexik »

SwedeForceOne wrote:I predict 1:19:5 as fastest laptime when the Jerez test is over. What u guys think?
I think 1:17 should be possible.
eeee

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mds
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by mds »

Just for reference, the last time that any decent F1 racing was done at Jerez (1997) the top qualifying time was 1:21.072 by Villeneuve in the Williams FW19.

edit: and of course by Frentzen and Schumacher (in the Ferrari F310B) as well :)
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by aftershocksinthebath »

Clarky wrote:Image
So Kvyat damaged the front wing this morning and they need to fly a new one out.

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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by Clarky »

Hamilton (Mercedes) 42
Nasr (Sauber) 33
Vettel (Ferrari) 31
Verstappen (Toro Rosso) 25
Bottas (Williams) 16
Kvyat (Red Bull) 7
Maldonado (Lotus) 6
Button (McLaren) 2

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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by backdoc »

aftershocksinthebath wrote:
Clarky wrote:Image
So Kvyat damaged the front wing this morning and they need to fly a new one out.

10:49 JONATHAN NOBLE has just been speaking to Red Bull team boss Christian Horner about the RB11 running without a front wing.

Kvyat damaged the only wing Red Bull has here at Jerez, so the team is carrying out very basic work that is can complete without one while a spare is flown out.

There's no guarantee that the new spare will make it to Spain in time to allow the team to do any more proper running today, so everyone at Red Bull is having to cross their fingers.

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dizlexik
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by dizlexik »

backdoc wrote:
aftershocksinthebath wrote:
Clarky wrote:Image
So Kvyat damaged the front wing this morning and they need to fly a new one out.

10:49 JONATHAN NOBLE has just been speaking to Red Bull team boss Christian Horner about the RB11 running without a front wing.

Kvyat damaged the only wing Red Bull has here at Jerez, so the team is carrying out very basic work that is can complete without one while a spare is flown out.

There's no guarantee that the new spare will make it to Spain in time to allow the team to do any more proper running today, so everyone at Red Bull is having to cross their fingers.

Not an ideal way to start your first day with your new employer!
So Red Bull brought no spare parts to Spain?
eeee

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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by Classic »

I can't believe any team would turn up to testing without a spare wing. It's the most likely thing to get damaged and ruins any aero data collected when ran without.

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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by RaggedMan »

Only brought one wing to the first test of the year? That makes no sense at all.

So many things can go wrong to cause a broken wing even when you're not pushing the car. Stupid.
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mds
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by mds »

Well, there was this rumor that they wouldn't make it to Jerez because they were very late in putting the car and its parts together. Maybe they simply didn't have time to make more than one front wing in time for Jerez.
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beastlymaiden
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by beastlymaiden »

That looks like an ant eater !!

Muzzyf1
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by Muzzyf1 »

I'm flabbergasted that Mclaren and Honda cannot get the engine running on all cylinders the thing is spluttering .

Really poor form tbh after a year in devolpment and abu dhabi test you'd think they could get it to at least run on all cylinders .
and to make it worse vettel is pounding around reeling off laptimes .

Alonso must be cursed no other explanation

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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by Tufty »

Muzzyf1 wrote:I'm flabbergasted that Mclaren and Honda cannot get the engine running on all cylinders the thing is spluttering .

Really poor form tbh after a year in devolpment and abu dhabi test you'd think they could get it to at least run on all cylinders .
and to make it worse vettel is pounding around reeling off laptimes .

Alonso must be cursed no other explanation
So they couldn't be intentionally reining it in for the sake of hiding some trick Honda has developed, or even a trick aero piece of McLaren's design?
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Muzzyf1
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Re: Jerez Testing

Post by Muzzyf1 »

Tufty wrote:
Muzzyf1 wrote:I'm flabbergasted that Mclaren and Honda cannot get the engine running on all cylinders the thing is spluttering .

Really poor form tbh after a year in devolpment and abu dhabi test you'd think they could get it to at least run on all cylinders .
and to make it worse vettel is pounding around reeling off laptimes .

Alonso must be cursed no other explanation
So they couldn't be intentionally reining it in for the sake of hiding some trick Honda has developed, or even a trick aero piece of McLaren's design?

No chance mate why would they turn up at the test ?

Its obvious they have serious issues .

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