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My question is: What do you make of Romain Grosjean?

He confuses me a bit. I think he may be very good but really can't tell. He reminds me a bit of Paul Di Resta in the way he talks himself up and openly courts the big teams, which is pretty disrespectful of his employers I think. But do the big teams have any interest? And now he's telling Jenson Button that he should step aside, which I think isn't very charming.

http://autoweek.com/article/formula-one ... ormula-one?

Me, I think he's ultimately pretty disposable among the many good and possibly great up and coming drivers. I might turn his opinion back on him: He's had his chance. Time to move aside.

He should keep his mouth shut about a fellow driver. Those comments reflect poorly on him.

And by the way, Grosjean is not some young up and coming driver. He's 28 years old and made his F1 debut back in 2009. I don't think he'll ever get a better seat than the one he has now. The Lotus in 2012 and 2013 was a brilliant car; very capable of winning races. He was beaten by Raikkonen convincingly and we've seen how Kimi matches up to a top tier driver.

Grosjean is not an elite level driver and I see no reason that Mercedes, Red Bull, Ferrari or McLaren would have any interest in signing him. His best bet is to hope that Lotus will build a winning car with that Merc engine next year. Even if he did get a drive with a top team, he would end up losing to the other driver.

I think Romain's talking too much.

His reputation has been finished by Alonso's trashing of Kimi. It was thought by some, rather misguidedly, that Grosjean was actually a very quick driver just erratic. It now looks more like not that quick at all yet he's still not a man you would trust with your car.

I think unless Lotus come up with something special he will do nothing too much in F1. I hardly see him getting anywhere near a top seat otherwise.

By telling Button to step aside, he's showing disrespect to Button, who's a much better driver & person as well.

Grosjean should pray that if Lotus is a good car next year, Maldonado doesn't kick his rear side because then his reputation will be further dented which he's trying to build since 2012.

LOL I actually liked Grosjean until he made that comment. Not anymore.

What a douche..he should focus on his own career instead of worrying about others.

I think all drivers understand that it is, and always will be, important to get the next generation of guys through. But by saying it is "time to move aside" makes it sound like JB is a total has-been and doesn't have the pace anymore. I do not believe that to be true. JB is still an excellent driver.

JB has had an excellent career. Race wins in multiple years and that all important championship to his name. If McLaren kept this year's line up then I'd guess in a 2 or 3 year period we'd see JB getting beaten. But for next year, I think JB will prove to be better than Kmag or Vandoorne would be. If JB wants to drive, there is no reason for him to step aside.

I'm surprised any driver has come out and said this actually. Given Grosjean hasn't had that much success too. I know an opinion is an opinion and if it comes from a guy with 3 races or a guy with 300 races and multiple championships it shouldn't change my view on what that opinion really means, it does seem odd. Especially given Grosjean a couple of years ago could have been utterly savaged by the other F1 drivers and no one was telling him to essentially leave F1. This is a guy who managed to crash so often at the start of races (and sometimes later on) that he got a race ban. Race bans have been pretty rare in the last decade or so.

There is an argument that if you get a guy in younger and give him more time etc then in the long run that will be of benefit to McLaren. Like I said, in 2 or 3 years time JB might be older and slower and less motivated. Older and Slower definitely do happen at some point. It's not stupid to play the long game and chose the younger driver to try and develop. But next year is a big year. And I think the short term is pretty important here.

Dash33 wrote: He confuses me a bit. I think he may be very good but really can't tell. He reminds me a bit of Paul Di Resta in the way he talks himself up and openly courts the big teams, which is pretty disrespectful of his employers I think. But do the big teams have any interest? And now he's telling Jenson Button that he should step aside, which I think isn't very charming.

Nail on the head. I don't know why he feels he is 'deserving' of a Ferrari or McLaren drive. He seems to be growing ever more bitter.

C'mon guys, this is sensationalist journalism. He does not say time to move aside, or I want Button out. His quote is:

"If I am not mistaken, Jenson has been in F1 for 15 seasons," Grosjean said. "I'm sorry if he goes, but we need fresh blood."

And it is 100% true. It doesn't mean he is not good enough, or he deserves to be dropped or anything else, other than stating the bleeding obvious fact that F1 is getting younger all the time. Guys like Verstappen & Kyvat are the potential future superstars of the sport. Jenson has won a WDC and he is a very competent driver, but it's not like he is going to get faster the older he becomes.

He is a strange one.

His second year I really believed he should have been banned from driving, he was that bad. But when he looked so good against Kimi in the same car, I thought he was good and even possibly WDC of the future.

Looking back, I now see it was because Kimi was crap and the lotus was very under rated.

My current assessment of him is - Average driver.

Which would I prefer to see stay in F1?


No contest, Button

What the article fails to mention is that it has been based on a tweet. As you all may or may not know, tweets can only be 140 characters in length and it is very, very hard to put decent nuance in it. What Grosjean may simply have been willing to say, but could not accurately express due to size limits, is that he would be sorry to see Jensen go but on the other hand that there would be an upside to it - which isn't grossly offending at all.

In fact, afterwards there was a bit of lighthearted banter between JB and Grosjean which pretty much indicated some here are taking it way worse than JB did.

Romain later clarified with: "I've never said : time for @JensonButton to leave F1, he deserves his place! Just hard for young drivers to get a seat, only 20 available"
Then JB replied: "@RGrosjean you could always give up your seat mate for the youngsters!! #banter"
And JB retweeted this one: "@RGrosjean @JensonButton And of course he's an integral part of BUT, GRO, PER "

mds wrote: And JB retweeted this one: "@RGrosjean @JensonButton And of course he's an integral part of BUT, GRO, PER "

Covalent wrote:

mds wrote: And JB retweeted this one: "@RGrosjean @JensonButton And of course he's an integral part of BUT, GRO, PER "

BUT, RAI, PER was also mentioned

JMILAT wrote:I think Romain's talking too much.

His reputation has been finished by Alonso's trashing of Kimi. It was thought by some, rather misguidedly, that Grosjean was actually a very quick driver just erratic. It now looks more like not that quick at all yet he's still not a man you would trust with your car.

I think unless Lotus come up with something special he will do nothing too much in F1. I hardly see him getting anywhere near a top seat otherwise.

I don't agree. 2014 was such a big change in the regulations. Sometimes drivers don't perform as well in certain eras. This is not to make too many excuses for Kimi, he should have been closer to Alonso this year. But look at what has happened to Vettel. Or Mansell/Patrese and the active suspension cars, to name two.

Maybe 2014 has led some to reassess Grosjean's ability down a little, but I don't think his reputation is finished.

Jenson hasn't passed the age of 40 yet. If anyone should exit the party, that is RoGro or his unique teammate, not an extremely fit, veteran Champion who has a list of (Trulli, Sato, Villeneuve, Barrichello, Hamilton, Perez, Magnussen) beaten drivers list with points of championship. Shortly;

Show must go on

Grosjean never said Button should go.

mds wrote:What the article fails to mention is that it has been based on a tweet. As you all may or may not know, tweets can only be 140 characters in length and it is very, very hard to put decent nuance in it. What Grosjean may simply have been willing to say, but could not accurately express due to size limits, is that he would be sorry to see Jensen go but on the other hand that there would be an upside to it - which isn't grossly offending at all.

In fact, afterwards there was a bit of lighthearted banter between JB and Grosjean which pretty much indicated some here are taking it way worse than JB did.

Romain later clarified with: "I've never said : time for @JensonButton to leave F1, he deserves his place! Just hard for young drivers to get a seat, only 20 available"
Then JB replied: "@RGrosjean you could always give up your seat mate for the youngsters!! #banter"
And JB retweeted this one: "@RGrosjean @JensonButton And of course he's an integral part of BUT, GRO, PER "

i like rg , still think he looks like sid the sloth but hes a likeable character

As others have said, he never said Button should leave in the original comment and later clarified that was not his intention.

You should look for the actual quote, not just read the headlines.

backdoc wrote:C'mon guys, this is sensationalist journalism. He does not say time to move aside, or I want Button out. His quote is:

"If I am not mistaken, Jenson has been in F1 for 15 seasons," Grosjean said. "I'm sorry if he goes, but we need fresh blood."

And it is 100% true. It doesn't mean he is not good enough, or he deserves to be dropped or anything else, other than stating the bleeding obvious fact that F1 is getting younger all the time. Guys like Verstappen & Kyvat are the potential future superstars of the sport. Jenson has won a WDC and he is a very competent driver, but it's not like he is going to get faster the older he becomes.

Exactly. Far too many people read the headline and ignore the quote.

Grosjean is just looking out for his future move to Mclaren. With his manager Boullier as TP he must definetly see it as an option in the future.

Can we change the thread title as this is not what he said.

Given the youngest F1 driver is 17 and one can drive well into your 40s, one could stay in F1 as a driver for maybe 30 years so Jenson could be just in the middle of his career. I think Jenson could take a year out and then return to a top team once a spot is available.

I think Jenson has shown great strength this year after the sudden death of his father to lead McLaren back up the standings. Grosjean is entitled to his own opinions but Jenson is a WDC and I think all the fans want to see him compete with/against Alonso.

As others pointed out this is just taken out of context. Funny that it is Grosjean starting this. He was very loosely linked to McLaren because of Boullier so one might think he would bitter not to be considered for the McLaren drive. Maybe he is a little bit but I don't think he considers Jenson as has been or too old.
The F1 grid gets younger but very little of these youngsters actually have long careers in F1. That there not so many spots in F1 any more is one reason and youngsters are not given that much time any more unless they have some decent financial backing (Perez, Maldonado to name a few).

Dash33 wrote:What do you make of Romain Grosjean?

I think he's about the same level as Joylon Palmer and the like. It took him four seasons to win GP2 with Renault backing. I don't rate him as a decent driver but he's on a similar level to Maldonado and Perez.

I think his comments about Jenson have some merit and I think he was pushed into making a comment. Either way through his driving or his personality, I couldn't care less if he was part of F1 or not.

F1Tyrant wrote: I think he's about the same level as Joylon Palmer and the like. It took him four seasons to win GP2 with Renault backing.

That's not exactly fair unless you expect people to win by only performing half a season in GP2. Grosjean had only two full seasons in GP2. Whereas Palmer didn't break into the top-10 until his third season, Grosjean placed fourth on his first try and also on his second where he only competed 6 out of 10 rounds.

I think he was pushed into making a comment.

... maybe you should read this thread.

I'm not sure why Jenson should move aside. He's not that old. There could be at least 5 more seasons in his F1 career given the opportunity.

There's more reasons for Jenson to be in F1 over Romain when you start listing them.

Man this is lame, he didn't use that tone against JB!

JMILAT wrote:............His reputation has been finished by Alonso's trashing of Kimi. It was thought by some, rather misguidedly, that Grosjean was actually a very quick driver just erratic. It now looks more like not that quick at all yet he's still not a man you would trust with your car.................

This
While impressed by his performance alongside Raikkonnen, even I didn't appreciate how lack lustre Kimi actually was. Bottom line - he's been driving around with the same engine as Ricciardo all season.

Now that Lotus will be using Mercedes/Petronas instead of Renault/Total there's no reason for him to have a seat and he should be moved aside for Button.

.

F1Tyrant wrote:

Dash33 wrote:What do you make of Romain Grosjean?

I think he's about the same level as Joylon Palmer and the like. It took him four seasons to win GP2 with Renault backing. I don't rate him as a decent driver but he's on a similar level to Maldonado and Perez.

I think his comments about Jenson have some merit and I think he was pushed into making a comment. Either way through his driving or his personality, I couldn't care less if he was part of F1 or not.

Grosjean probably has the best junior record of anybody in F1 bar Hamilton and Hulk. Yes I agree he is possibly on similar level to Perez. Another driver with a very good junior record and so far a very good F1 career.

moby wrote: But when he looked so good against Kimi in the same car, I thought he was good and even possibly WDC of the future.

He never looked so good vs Kimi. He improved second half of season but that's because Kimi was driving an old car, Romain was getting all the new updates etc. And by the way overall Kimi destoryed Romain in that season, when you look at the season as a whole.

He got Beat by Kimi, it says allot of where he is a driver, nothing special, just mediocre.

Jomox wrote:

moby wrote: But when he looked so good against Kimi in the same car, I thought he was good and even possibly WDC of the future.

He never looked so good vs Kimi. He improved second half of season but that's because Kimi was driving an old car, Romain was getting all the new updates etc. And by the way overall Kimi destoryed Romain in that season, when you look at the season as a whole.

He got Beat by Kimi, it says allot of where he is a driver, nothing special, just mediocre.

No, if I were picking a driver from the two of them in that year, I would have gone for Rogro.

I know Kimi finished with twice the points, but the cost of an improver v ex world champ is also huge, and only one of them was improving.

Dash33 wrote:My question is: What do you make of Romain Grosjean?

He confuses me a bit. I think he may be very good but really can't tell. He reminds me a bit of Paul Di Resta in the way he talks himself up and openly courts the big teams, which is pretty disrespectful of his employers I think. But do the big teams have any interest? And now he's telling Jenson Button that he should step aside, which I think isn't very charming.

http://autoweek.com/article/formula-one ... ormula-one?

Me, I think he's ultimately pretty disposable among the many good and possibly great up and coming drivers. I might turn his opinion back on him: He's had his chance. Time to move aside.

I wonder if he might say the same of Alonso in one or two years time?

I'm not entirely convinced of Grosjean, i think he had a very good car in 2012 and 2013, i would say the second best car in 2013, but only finished 8th and 7th in the WDC after being given several second chances.

I can understand his stance though in being quite happy for older/better drivers to be put out to grass.

mds wrote:

F1Tyrant wrote: I think he's about the same level as Joylon Palmer and the like. It took him four seasons to win GP2 with Renault backing.

That's not exactly fair unless you expect people to win by only performing half a season in GP2. Grosjean had only two full seasons in GP2. Whereas Palmer didn't break into the top-10 until his third season, Grosjean placed fourth on his first try and also on his second where he only competed 6 out of 10 rounds.

I think he was pushed into making a comment.

... maybe you should read this thread.

Yes that was a lazy appraisal of Grosjean's GP2 career, he was an immediate front runner and didn't need multiple seasons to prove himself like Palmer