A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

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ElevenTenths
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A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by ElevenTenths »

Have to say this one looks better than the current car, nose violation notwithstanding. But are we really ready for this?


http://www.motorsport.com/f1/photo/user ... 772482&i=1

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SwedeForceOne
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by SwedeForceOne »

Looks kind of meh to me. Also, every other aspect of the car seems to have changed also, bigger rims, less wing elements and so on.

veffy
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by veffy »

I support the sport going in whatever direction it must to improve safety, but if/when closed cockpits does happen it will be somewhat of a shame for me.

There's something less 'intimate' (for lack of a better word) when you add cockpits. You can no longer see driver hand gestures and reactions to each other, and wet conditions become much less gritty as the driver sits dry.

These are just minor psychological aspects but will be something i miss if the day arrives.

Blinky McSquinty

Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by Blinky McSquinty »

This is a trend that has been going on for decades, to bury the driver more and more. In the beginning of Formula One, the drivers were very exposed, and obviously less safe. We could see their torsos, arms and heads, even the expressions on their faces.

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Over the years the drivers were placed lower in the chassis, full face helmets were used, there was a slow but definite trend.

Image

These days, all we get to see is their helmets and hands when they are turning. If we are very fortunate, at a night race when they have clear visors the in-camera may pick up their eyes. While some fans may resist and want to see the drivers, the truth is that we see so little of them, it really doesn't matter.

"I saw Hamilton drive, yea, all I saw was the top of his helmet, but I got to see him."

The bottom line is that we see so little of the drivers in the cars, going to the next small step makes sense if cockpits are a viable way to make it safer.

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wire2004
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by wire2004 »

No no no no no no no no no no no no no no.

Formula 1 from its very origins HSS been about open wheel and open cockpit racing.

Sorry I have to say this but.
There us a lot of people who are getting very out of hand and a bit carried away. Its getting a bit ridiculous with all this virtual safety car this. Closed cockpit that.
The simple fact of the matter is this.
Formula 1, as well as any Motorsport is dangerous. It always has been dangerous. It will always be dangerous. Sure. We have had a good bit of luck the past 20 years since senna and ratzenbergers death. But before senna and ratzenbergers death. We has 12 years since a death at a race and 8 years since any formula 1 death at all.

It proves safety had been getting better and was going in the right direction in the 80s.

I will spell it out very clearly so people get this point very clearly.
what happened to Jules bianchi was a freak accident.

Instead if watching formula 1. You may as well all go watch the world endurance championship. All go follow mark Webber. Because that is essentially what closed cockpits is.
Last edited by wire2004 on Mon Oct 13, 2014 3:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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TheOtherGuy
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by TheOtherGuy »

Open wheels are far more important to me than open cockpits are...
Image
"You mad, bro?"

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AngusWolfe
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by AngusWolfe »

The main thing that bothers me is the engine intake goes over the cover. How long will that take to get off in an emergency? There is no win-win scenario at the moment.
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Blinky McSquinty

Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by Blinky McSquinty »

wire2004 wrote:what happened to Jules bianchi was a freak accident.


All accidents are freak events that no one anticipates or has planned for. That is why we call them accidents.

wire2004
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by wire2004 »

Blinky McSquinty wrote:
wire2004 wrote:what happened to Jules bianchi was a freak accident.


All accidents are freak events that no one anticipates or has planned for. That is why we call them accidents.


Suitils was a accident. Simple every day crash in the conditions we have seen time and time again
Bianchi was a freak accident.. If you replayed bianchi's crash again and again. He will not crash as he had sine at suzuka.

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runningman67
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by runningman67 »

Don't like the Ferrari pic. Looks like a Hot Wheels car.

Zoue
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by Zoue »

TheOtherGuy wrote:Open wheels are far more important to me than open cockpits are...

I tend to agree. As Blinky has said, what do we actually see of a driver anyway? I don't really have too much of a problem with closed cockpits as long as the single-seater open-wheeled formula is maintained

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James14
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by James14 »

I doubt the closed cockpit would have helped Jules in his accident. It would have helped Massa no doubt, but as mentioned in another thread the closed cockpit throws up a few problems as well.

Billy
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by Billy »

Blinky McSquinty wrote:The bottom line is that we see so little of the drivers in the cars, going to the next small step makes sense if cockpits are a viable way to make it safer.

You're wrong on this one, Blinky, just seeing that little bit of driver makes you feel you saw him so much more than you feel you "saw" Alan McNish, etc. It will change the feel of F1 entirely. There are other much less extreme ways to prevent exactly what happened at Suzuka, but of course there will always be a risk of death. I thought Grosjean should have been banned for nearly decapitating Alonso at Spa, but a scenario like that can happen at any race. I'd be curious to know how the drivers feel.

In any event, let's not pretend that putting a canopy over the driver would not be a HUGE change.

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jimmyj
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by jimmyj »

I prefer the open cockpit, even if it may present some additional safety risks. I like seeing (what little) I can of the drivers hands and so on.

Blinky McSquinty

Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by Blinky McSquinty »

Billy wrote:
Blinky McSquinty wrote:The bottom line is that we see so little of the drivers in the cars, going to the next small step makes sense if cockpits are a viable way to make it safer.

You're wrong on this one, Blinky, just seeing that little bit of driver makes you feel you saw him so much more than you feel you "saw" Alan McNish, etc. It will change the feel of F1 entirely. There are other much less extreme ways to prevent exactly what happened at Suzuka, but of course there will always be a risk of death. I thought Grosjean should have been banned for nearly decapitating Alonso at Spa, but a scenario like that can happen at any race. I'd be curious to know how the drivers feel.

In any event, let's not pretend that putting a canopy over the driver would not be a HUGE change.


It is a personal perception thing Billy, you feel different and I respect that. I was speaking from my viewpoint, and to me just seeing the helmet and gloves isn't that much.

I've been to a lot of races and to see the entire driver slow and close on the pre-race parade means a lot more to me and creates a much stronger impression in the "I saw him" personal perception.

Image

sandman1347
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by sandman1347 »

Lets spend more money and overhaul the cars yet again! Because no one has ever been killed in a closed cockpit race car right....

I wonder what happens when the first guy gets seriously hurt in a closed cockpit F1 car. Maybe we'll just have the drivers control the cars remotely like drone pilots.

Underviewer
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by Underviewer »

sandman1347 wrote:Lets spend more money and overhaul the cars yet again! Because no one has ever been killed in a closed cockpit race car right....

I wonder what happens when the first guy gets seriously hurt in a closed cockpit F1 car. Maybe we'll just have the drivers control the cars remotely like drone pilots.


I tend to agree. Drivers can still sustain fatal head injuries in closed cockpit cars. I would say people working in the pit lane are at the most risk of fatal injuries these days in F1. I know they banned reporters from the pit lane but you still see various people in there that you think would be in big trouble if something hit them or a car crashed.

funkymonkey
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by funkymonkey »

That is very very very old concept pic. I saw this during Massa accident days. It is that old.
But frankly closed cockpits dont bother me. It will also make cars go faster due to greatly reduced drag. And frankly it will make cars look lot better.
We can have quick release mechanism in the canopy. It can be done. But they have to work out the driver comfort and ventilation with closed cockpit.

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moby
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by moby »

Blinky McSquinty wrote:
Billy wrote:
Blinky McSquinty wrote:The bottom line is that we see so little of the drivers in the cars, going to the next small step makes sense if cockpits are a viable way to make it safer.

You're wrong on this one, Blinky, just seeing that little bit of driver makes you feel you saw him so much more than you feel you "saw" Alan McNish, etc. It will change the feel of F1 entirely. There are other much less extreme ways to prevent exactly what happened at Suzuka, but of course there will always be a risk of death. I thought Grosjean should have been banned for nearly decapitating Alonso at Spa, but a scenario like that can happen at any race. I'd be curious to know how the drivers feel.

In any event, let's not pretend that putting a canopy over the driver would not be a HUGE change.


It is a personal perception thing Billy, you feel different and I respect that. I was speaking from my viewpoint, and to me just seeing the helmet and gloves isn't that much.

I've been to a lot of races and to see the entire driver slow and close on the pre-race parade means a lot more to me and creates a much stronger impression in the "I saw him" personal perception.

Image


Why did I get the urge to draw a toothbrush mustache on that pic 8O

f1guyus
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by f1guyus »

And then it hit me. F1 would be the perfect place to test all this driverless car technology. Think about it, no more of those Prima-donna drivers. Using the money from those huge contracts they could build really fast cars. And if the driver is removed maybe they could put in a cool sound system that would play audio of those 10 and 12 cylinder cars from the 90's. It's a win-win.

Sarc/off

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Guia
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by Guia »

f1guyus wrote:And then it hit me. F1 would be the perfect place to test all this driverless car technology. Think about it, no more of those Prima-donna drivers. Using the money from those huge contracts they could build really fast cars. And if the driver is removed maybe they could put in a cool sound system that would play audio of those 10 and 12 cylinder cars from the 90's. It's a win-win.

Sarc/off

Unfortunate opening.

Nosebuckle
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by Nosebuckle »

I've got no conceptual problem with putting some sort of canopy on the cars, but I don't think one would've made much difference in Bianchi's crash. A canopy would have prevented Massa's incident, Henry Surtees', probably even some of Senna's injuries. The problem is that practically no canopy is going to meaningfully stop the force of hitting a tractor crane at 200 kmh. The left side of the car was obliterated; for all we know a cover could have exacerbated the impact.

I'd be quite concerned about a driver getting out of the car. Considering they already have to be able to to exit the car and reattach the steering wheel in I think something like 10 seconds, having to pop the top in addition could compromise some other important safety goals. It's certainly something to consider and I don't really think it appreciably detracts from the spirit of formula, particularly if it enhances safety.

Billy
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by Billy »

Blinky McSquinty wrote:
Billy wrote:
Blinky McSquinty wrote:The bottom line is that we see so little of the drivers in the cars, going to the next small step makes sense if cockpits are a viable way to make it safer.

You're wrong on this one, Blinky, just seeing that little bit of driver makes you feel you saw him so much more than you feel you "saw" Alan McNish, etc. It will change the feel of F1 entirely. There are other much less extreme ways to prevent exactly what happened at Suzuka, but of course there will always be a risk of death. I thought Grosjean should have been banned for nearly decapitating Alonso at Spa, but a scenario like that can happen at any race. I'd be curious to know how the drivers feel.

In any event, let's not pretend that putting a canopy over the driver would not be a HUGE change.


It is a personal perception thing Billy, you feel different and I respect that. I was speaking from my viewpoint, and to me just seeing the helmet and gloves isn't that much.

I've been to a lot of races and to see the entire driver slow and close on the pre-race parade means a lot more to me and creates a much stronger impression in the "I saw him" personal perception.

Image

Your point well-taken, but I guess my point is totally different, it's not how much you actually see the drivers, but instead how "with them" you feel, how much in their space. An open cockpit really gives you a feeling of being with them, much more with them than I've felt while watching a LeMans race, it's as if open cockpit racers are fighting on the street corner in front of you instead of far away on a race track.
As someone who drives an Aprilia, bad driving is pretty important to me. This whole comparison reminds me of when I tell people that talking on the phone while driving and using a handless headset is just as bad as using a hand-held phone -- the distraction isn't in using only one hand on the wheel, it's that your mind is elsewhere while you're talking, you're not even really looking at what's around you because you're in the world of the person you're talking to. Well, in some way I feel it's similar with watching an open cockpit, at those times I feel as if I'm in the driver's world so much more than when I'm watching a LeMans prototype -- it's hard to explain, but a very concrete difference nonetheless.
Anyways, you look at Coulthard/Wurtz or Grosjean/Alonso and you realize there are rare but unavoidable risks to open cockpits, so I can't say that canopies would be wrong, but I, at least, feel that we as spectators would be losing a lot. (I also preferred racing open cockpits to sedans when I raced, but the enjoyment difference wasn't as strong there!)

Blinky McSquinty

Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by Blinky McSquinty »

Guys, we're starting to dip into the examination of Bianchi's accident, and it's causes. The accident isn't over and no conclusions have been drawn. Whether a closed cockpit would have helped in his situation is pure speculation at this time. Please, let's not go there, just stick to how fans perceive them.

As in all safety components, there would be situations where they were a benefit, in other situations they don't. Right now in a Formula One car the driver is physically protected in many directions. In the front, rear, and side there are crush-able structures, designed to absorb the energy of an impact. The car where the driver sits inside is a "survival cell", he is firmly strapped in by safety belts. It is mandatory to wear two shoulder straps, one abdominal strap and two straps between the legs. The sides of the survival cell are designed and must meet a penetration test, to keep something from punching through the side of the cockpit.

I have my perceptions, and in our exchange, Billy made good ones also. For some fans, if they cannot at least see something of a driver, then the disconnect is happening, they don't feel "connected" to the driver.

Do they make the cars look cool?
Does a closed cockpit disconnect you from feeling "connected" to the driver?

What's your opinion?

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hittheapex
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by hittheapex »

I believe Bianchi's accident wouldn't have happened were previous warnings about recovery vehicles from drivers and close calls e.g. Liuzzi Nurburgring 2007, acted upon. The crash structure was expected to perform against something it was not designed for, but hindsight is 20/20. And though we don't know if a canopy, roof, cage whatever the proposed solutions are, would have prevented Bianchi's injuries, there have been several other incidents in common race conditions that didn't involve recovery vehicles.

We had Wurz and Coulthard in 2007, Massa's accident at Hungary, Grosjean more recently at Spa, Alonso avoiding the tyre at Silverstone last year, one of Raikkonen's tyres flying across the circuit and narrowly missing drivers at Silverstone this year.

I do believe eventually that F1's run of luck for these type of accidents will run out. We don't know if that luck will run out next weekend or in 20 years time. If a solution can be found that doesn't run the risk of a driver becoming too hot, or even worse being trapped after an accident, it deserves serious consideration in my opinion.

Personally I am split on this because although I'm aware of the risks, so are the drivers and nobody is forcing them to go out there and compete. There are plenty of good closed cockpit drivers available. I enjoy seeing the drivers heads move as they check their mirrors when dicing, seeing their hands work the wheel.

But it should go without saying that I don't want to see any serious injuries or deaths that could have been prevented.
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WiredKiwi
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by WiredKiwi »

Blinky McSquinty wrote:
wire2004 wrote:what happened to Jules bianchi was a freak accident.


All accidents are freak events that no one anticipates or has planned for. That is why we call them accidents.


No it was not a freak accident. It was a repeat of an accident that has happened THREE times in the last 20 years (Brundle at Suzuka 94, Schumi at Brazil 03 and Luizzi at Germany 08). The only thing different is that this time a person is likely to pay for it with his career, and possibly even his life.

It was an accident, yes. But a preventable one that we had three warnings about in the form of minor accidents.

I am left wondering if we now have to wait until a driver loses his feet before we see the crash structure of the nose improved (Kimi at Silverstone this year and Kubica at Canada 2007).
Tous Avec Jules #17

chetan_rao
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by chetan_rao »

Serious discussions aside, we'll also probably need to get used to radio messages like "Hey! my A/C's not working. It's all fogging up in here. Where'd you say you put the bloody wiper and demister/defog buttons?"

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moby
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by moby »

Thinking on this, if a car ends up partly ontop of another, and the driver has suspected head or spine damage, the driver of the lower car will have to sit there until all is well? Could be an hour or more. The blister would always take up that space while a driver can squeeze out.

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Amon
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by Amon »

It somehow looks like a crossbreed between a racecar and road car. I really don't think I want to see that. I mean there is lots of new things I got used too pretty quickly like the stepped and ant noses but a closed cockpit doesn't feel like F1 at all any more. Seeing the guys at least partly out of the car and the helmet clearly is part of the recognition and the fun.
F1 fan since 1989
Image

Arai_or_Nothing
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by Arai_or_Nothing »

This rendering is now several years old. It is a "rendering" a fan did in Photoshop.

It came about after Massa's accident, at around the time the FIA were fiddling around with the jet fighter canopy. There is no chance of this ever coming to light, even withstanding Jules' unfortunate accident. If we consider the extreme temperatures the drivers are subject to at a good amount of races, a closed canopy would be dangerous in that the helmets would have no ventilation and visors would fog over even before they took off on the formation lap. Sure they could vent the cockpit in some way, but that poses several challenges which raise costs and likely increase weight.

It's an interesting topic to chew the rag over, but not something I forsee yapping in F1 unless things go back to the frequency of major incidents like in the killer years.

number27
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by number27 »

That rendering reminds me a bit of the Matra P29 prototype from about 1986: Image

JMILAT
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by JMILAT »

It's somewhat highly unlikely that closed cockpit would have saved Jules. It seems his prolem was the sheer deceleration and this is always going to be a big problem in motor racing.

However its an obvious dangerous thing in F1 that the drivers head is really exposed. It was not just Massa, not long later a driver was killed in one of the lower categories when a tyre came off a car and landed on his head. We also only have to look at Schumacher in Abu Dhabi and Alonso in Spa to see this is an accident waiting to happen.

Therefore closed cockpits have to be seriously considered keeping the philosophy of F1 as much as possible. I just don't see it being worth a driver being killed for such a thing and had Schumacher or Alonso been hit it probably would be here already. And again like Jules hitting the tractor it's unlikely, its a bit freak but it's also just waiting to happen.

Fiki
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by Fiki »

This topic makes me wonder why formula cars are supposed to be open-wheel and open-cockpit. Was there a distinct reason for going that way? Mercedes competed with a full bodywork F1 car in Fangio's era (albeit with an open cockpit), so it appears the rules weren't always strict on that count.

As for the canopied Ferrari photoshop, I rather like it. But I wonder whether a semi-enclosed Canopy might not work just as well. They have already been brought up by other forum members.

A final thought about rain spray; Alain Prost wanted a solution to be found 32 years ago already. Why are we no further then where we find ourselves now? I'm all for rain races, provided vision for the drivers can be made acceptable.
Use every man after his desert, and who should scape whipping? Use them after your own honour and dignity.

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Billy
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by Billy »

JMILAT wrote:It's somewhat highly unlikely that closed cockpit would have saved Jules. It seems his prolem was the sheer deceleration and this is always going to be a big problem in motor racing.

However its an obvious dangerous thing in F1 that the drivers head is really exposed. It was not just Massa, not long later a driver was killed in one of the lower categories when a tyre came off a car and landed on his head. We also only have to look at Schumacher in Abu Dhabi and Alonso in Spa to see this is an accident waiting to happen.

Therefore closed cockpits have to be seriously considered keeping the philosophy of F1 as much as possible. I just don't see it being worth a driver being killed for such a thing and had Schumacher or Alonso been hit it probably would be here already. And again like Jules hitting the tractor it's unlikely, its a bit freak but it's also just waiting to happen.

It wasn't "a racer," it was Henry Surtees, son of motorcycling and F1 legend John Surtees. Imagine having made it through the most dangerous era in motorsports, winning championships, and then losing a son to a freak accident. (Please don't reply about how it's not "freak," it hardly ever happens, so I'm calling it that.)

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nixxxon
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by nixxxon »

This drawing is actually very old... I remember having seen it for ages. The drawer doesnt obviously have much knowledge of how the designs are supposed to be. Its more like a Sci-Fi racing movie car.

The Red Bull X1 (from Gran Turismo) would be a more precise and accurate thing.

Image

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Covalent
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by Covalent »

nixxxon wrote:This drawing is actually very old... I remember having seen it for ages. The drawer doesnt obviously have much knowledge of how the designs are supposed to be. Its more like a Sci-Fi racing movie car.

The Red Bull X1 (from Gran Turismo) would be a more precise and accurate thing.

Image

How is a Red Bull X1 a more precise and accurate version of a Ferrari F1 car with a cockpit than a Ferrari F1 car with a cockpit?

Zoue
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by Zoue »

Covalent wrote:
nixxxon wrote:This drawing is actually very old... I remember having seen it for ages. The drawer doesnt obviously have much knowledge of how the designs are supposed to be. Its more like a Sci-Fi racing movie car.

The Red Bull X1 (from Gran Turismo) would be a more precise and accurate thing.

Image

How is a Red Bull X1 a more precise and accurate version of a Ferrari F1 car with a cockpit than a Ferrari F1 car with a cockpit?

I'm only guessing here but I think I read somewhere that it was actually designed by Newey?

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nixxxon
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by nixxxon »

Yep, the X1 was designed by Newey, whereas the car in the OP is some "fantasy" from an artist made for fun I guess, doesnt look anything serious. I mean look at that weird nose, look at those strange sidepods and intakes...

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Blake
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by Blake »

No question the drawing of the Ferrari with closed cockpit would need some cleaning up, particularly in the area of the sidepods, but it would appear to be the most likely direction F1 would go if closed cockpits were mandated. In fact, I rather like it. Just because Newey designed the X1 doesn't mean it is automatically the direction to go, besides, who knows what expertise the artist of the Ferrari has, perhaps more than we know. Either way, the Ferrari does seem doable.

About the X1... is it a LeMans car or an F1 car. If one goes to enclosed cockpits and wheels, as we see in the X1 drawing, then aren't we pretty much at where the endurance cars are today anyway? There are already some who claim that the LeMans cars are more technically advanced than is F1. In some cases ... ie Audi... the front wheels almost appear to have enclosure "pods" as we see in the X1. Don't get me wrong, I am not opposed to "streamliner" F1 cars, quite the contrary, but how will they distinguish the two series?

As has been stated by others, I seriously doubt that an enclosed cockpit would have helped Bianchi in this case (unless the cover had some strong supportive elements like a roll-cage structure). That said, there have been many situations where it might have helped. I would love to see the engineering that would be involved in trying to come up with effective windshield wipers though!.

I saw it mentioned above, but any excuse to share a picture of this beautiful car is good for me... Having seen one of these in person several times (Indianapolis Motor Speedway Museum), I must say that is even more striking in person. The Mercedes W196 streamliner


Image

Image
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Covalent
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Re: A Closed Cockpit Ferrari - Very Nice...........

Post by Covalent »

nixxxon wrote:Yep, the X1 was designed by Newey, whereas the car in the OP is some "fantasy" from an artist made for fun I guess, doesnt look anything serious. I mean look at that weird nose, look at those strange sidepods and intakes...

I think my point was missed... The point was that the car in the OP was just supposed to be a version of an existing Ferrari F1 car with a closed cockpit, not a vision of how future F1 would look like if closed cockpits were allowed, not to mention what it would look like without any restrictions which is what the X1 is supposed to represent. The OP is an accurate depiction of the former, the X1 of the latter.

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