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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:26 pm 
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Rockie wrote:
JN23 wrote:
What kind of penalty would Verstappen get? Just cancel the lap or a grid drop?


5 Place grid drop, like he got last year.


When was that?


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:27 pm 
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Redbull were silly there, Hamilton, Leclerc and Vettel did not beat the time why not tell him to abort the lap?


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:29 pm 
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Bottas' crash!


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:31 pm 
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Has anyone been able to see where the front right wheel on Bottas' car went. It seemed to simply vanish as he made contact. Can't tell if it stayed within the track somewhere or perhaps scarily went over the barriers!

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:36 pm 
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Not that reputable a site, but GPFans saying Max said in the press conference he knew about the crash, but shrugged off any concerns about safety. Protest from Binotto if true?


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:38 pm 
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I wish I was surprised about everyone moaning about Verstappen.

Not a peep when Bottas did it in Monza.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:39 pm 
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I think that if the G meter is triggered in qualifying then it should automatically trigger a red flag (and either double waved yellow, or VSC in the race). If a driver has had an accident to trigger it then it means another driver can have an accident at the same point - the difference being they will plough with a G force into another car.

With regards to how a driver who ignores a yellow flag on a hot lap should be dealt with, then the option can't be just 'delete the lap' - because otherwise every driver may as well not bother backing off. If the consequence they will receive it 'your lap time may be deleted' and nothing else then they may as well set it and then argue it. At worst, they are in the same position as if they backed off, at best they set a faster lap. The options could be either a grid drop, or the deletion of the fastest lap (with the illegal lap not counting)

Then comes all this nonsense about "he may not have seen the flag / we're watching it in slow motion" guff spouted by the Sky F1 team. We he would have seen the Mercedes buried in the barrier with a big plume of dust, and even if he didn't automatically assume it was a yellow flag it should have made him glance at the marshal post in anticipation of one.

Ultimately though, I don't really blame Max for his behaviour, even though I think in this case he's been a mindless idiot, it's the nature of sportspeople to test the limits of the game, and strategise accordingly. However, the sports governing body needs to grow a backbone, ESPECIALLY if they are now accomodating this 'harder racing' mentality. Harder racing only increases the chances of collisions and as a result drivers need to be strictly disciplined about when there are clear red lines about when they have to back out - and a driver buried in the barrier on a high G force collision zone is one such case.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:39 pm 
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JN23 wrote:
Rockie wrote:
JN23 wrote:
What kind of penalty would Verstappen get? Just cancel the lap or a grid drop?


5 Place grid drop, like he got last year.


When was that?


Mexico last year.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:39 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
I wish I was surprised about everyone moaning about Verstappen.

Not a peep when Bottas did it in Monza.

Actually there was quite a "peep" when he did it in Monza. Lot's of us talked about it.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:40 pm 
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Rockie wrote:
Redbull were silly there, Hamilton, Leclerc and Vettel did not beat the time why not tell him to abort the lap?

I think he was going for the track record. I think last year was painful for him so he wanted to completely erase it.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:42 pm 
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I think this shows it.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:44 pm 
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Rockie wrote:
JN23 wrote:
Rockie wrote:
JN23 wrote:
What kind of penalty would Verstappen get? Just cancel the lap or a grid drop?


5 Place grid drop, like he got last year.


When was that?


Mexico last year.


He didn't get a five place grid drop in Mexico last year.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:44 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
I wish I was surprised about everyone moaning about Verstappen.

Not a peep when Bottas did it in Monza.


Jog on mate.
I'd prefer a Max Pole to a Ferrari one but he can't put other drivers lives at risk like that.
Bottas is sat in the wall and he breaks the track record.
I'm fuming to be honest, and you just carry on with " it cus it's Max BS", seriously?


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:52 pm 
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JN23 wrote:
Rockie wrote:
JN23 wrote:
Rockie wrote:
JN23 wrote:
What kind of penalty would Verstappen get? Just cancel the lap or a grid drop?


5 Place grid drop, like he got last year.


When was that?


Mexico last year.


He didn't get a five place grid drop in Mexico last year.


Russia.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 7:54 pm 
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Laz_T800 wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
I wish I was surprised about everyone moaning about Verstappen.

Not a peep when Bottas did it in Monza.


Jog on mate.
I'd prefer a Max Pole to a Ferrari one but he can't put other drivers lives at risk like that.
Bottas is sat in the wall and he breaks the track record.
I'm fuming to be honest, and you just carry on with " it cus it's Max BS", seriously?


Did you say the same when Bottas did it at Monza?


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:02 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
Laz_T800 wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
I wish I was surprised about everyone moaning about Verstappen.

Not a peep when Bottas did it in Monza.


Jog on mate.
I'd prefer a Max Pole to a Ferrari one but he can't put other drivers lives at risk like that.
Bottas is sat in the wall and he breaks the track record.
I'm fuming to be honest, and you just carry on with " it cus it's Max BS", seriously?


Did you say the same when Bottas did it at Monza?


I know the answer you're after, but fear you wont get it. In fact, someone else has already told you it was discussed quite a bit at Monza.

But put that to one side. Do you agree that a driver should be able to set a fastest sector through a yellow flag with a driver sitting in a car just off the racing line? That's the bigger question here. I would hope you don't think it's acceptable. This isn't about a suitable penalty, just the fact that it was bloody dangerous and broke the yellow flag rules. That's the main point being discussed here.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:02 pm 
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FIA say no investigation as Verstappen slowed down in the mini sector.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:05 pm 
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Asphalt_World wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Laz_T800 wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
I wish I was surprised about everyone moaning about Verstappen.

Not a peep when Bottas did it in Monza.


Jog on mate.
I'd prefer a Max Pole to a Ferrari one but he can't put other drivers lives at risk like that.
Bottas is sat in the wall and he breaks the track record.
I'm fuming to be honest, and you just carry on with " it cus it's Max BS", seriously?


Did you say the same when Bottas did it at Monza?


I know the answer you're after, but fear you wont get it. In fact, someone else has already told you it was discussed quite a bit at Monza.

But put that to one side. Do you agree that a driver should be able to set a fastest sector through a yellow flag with a driver sitting in a car just off the racing line? That's the bigger question here. I would hope you don't think it's acceptable. This isn't about a suitable penalty, just the fact that it was bloody dangerous and broke the yellow flag rules. That's the main point being discussed here.



Perhaps on a drying track.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:09 pm 
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I wonder just how extensive the damage to Bottas' car is...

Hamilton might get it done again in Mexico after all.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:14 pm 
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Invade wrote:
I wonder just how extensive the damage to Bottas' car is...

Hamilton might get it done again in Mexico after all.

It's going to be a pitlane start due to a chassis change. I assume they'll throw in a new PU and gearbox too.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:15 pm 
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JN23 wrote:
FIA say no investigation as Verstappen slowed down in the mini sector.


Yet in the presser Max said he didn't. And Horner said there were no yellows when clearly there were. So that clears that all up then!


Last edited by shoot999 on Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:17 pm 
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shoot999 wrote:
JN23 wrote:
FIA say no investigation as Verstappen slowed down in the mini sector.


Yet in the presser Max said he didn't. Odd.


Indeed. Perhaps the he was slower on that lap in that mini sector than on his first lap and the FIA think that's enough but Max didn't actually lift but was just slower?

Either way, I think he's lucky not to get a penalty.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:21 pm 
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JN23 wrote:
shoot999 wrote:
JN23 wrote:
FIA say no investigation as Verstappen slowed down in the mini sector.


Yet in the presser Max said he didn't. Odd.


Indeed. Perhaps the he was slower on that lap in that mini sector than on his first lap and the FIA think that's enough but Max didn't actually lift but was just slower?

Either way, I think he's lucky not to get a penalty.

They were never going to give him a penalty. It's a continuation of this policy of capitulating to the crybabies after Canada.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:23 pm 
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No surprises there then, rules not applying to golden boy max - hope karma hits him hard tomorrow

Precedent now that you don't need to slow for DOUBLE yellows unless your surname doesn't start with V


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:31 pm 
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Max was so brazen with his comments in the presser that surely the FIA's eyebrows are raised. I doubt we've heard the last of this from an official perspective.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:36 pm 
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Andrew Benson wrote on twitter that the FIA are still looking at the data. That was posted at 21:28 UK time.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:36 pm 
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Asphalt_World wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Laz_T800 wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
I wish I was surprised about everyone moaning about Verstappen.

Not a peep when Bottas did it in Monza.


Jog on mate.
I'd prefer a Max Pole to a Ferrari one but he can't put other drivers lives at risk like that.
Bottas is sat in the wall and he breaks the track record.
I'm fuming to be honest, and you just carry on with " it cus it's Max BS", seriously?


Did you say the same when Bottas did it at Monza?


I know the answer you're after, but fear you wont get it. In fact, someone else has already told you it was discussed quite a bit at Monza.

But put that to one side. Do you agree that a driver should be able to set a fastest sector through a yellow flag with a driver sitting in a car just off the racing line? That's the bigger question here. I would hope you don't think it's acceptable. This isn't about a suitable penalty, just the fact that it was bloody dangerous and broke the yellow flag rules. That's the main point being discussed here.


Oh I think the lap should be stripped and an additional penalty applied .

But after Monza how can the stewards do that?


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:37 pm 
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Pest44 wrote:
I don’t think there was actually a yellow flag after Bottas crashed. Which is again poor from Masi

Yes there was.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:37 pm 
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FormulaFun wrote:
No surprises there then, rules not applying to golden boy max - hope karma hits him hard tomorrow

Precedent now that you don't need to slow for DOUBLE yellows unless your surname doesn't start with V


You didn't see Bottas do it in Monza then?


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:38 pm 
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JN23 wrote:
FormulaFun wrote:
Horner in damage limitation already - clearly there were yellows as everybody else slowed down


Yeah he says no yellows and that Hamilton didn't lift. Vettel says there was yellows.

Jack Aitken's view...


To be fair Hamilton was right behind Bottas.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:40 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
Asphalt_World wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Laz_T800 wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
I wish I was surprised about everyone moaning about Verstappen.

Not a peep when Bottas did it in Monza.


Jog on mate.
I'd prefer a Max Pole to a Ferrari one but he can't put other drivers lives at risk like that.
Bottas is sat in the wall and he breaks the track record.
I'm fuming to be honest, and you just carry on with " it cus it's Max BS", seriously?


Did you say the same when Bottas did it at Monza?


I know the answer you're after, but fear you wont get it. In fact, someone else has already told you it was discussed quite a bit at Monza.

But put that to one side. Do you agree that a driver should be able to set a fastest sector through a yellow flag with a driver sitting in a car just off the racing line? That's the bigger question here. I would hope you don't think it's acceptable. This isn't about a suitable penalty, just the fact that it was bloody dangerous and broke the yellow flag rules. That's the main point being discussed here.


Oh I think the lap should be stripped and an additional penalty applied .

But after Monza how can the stewards do that?


We can't let mistakes from any previous races, even if it was made at a race 7 days ago, get in the way of safety. A mistake in Monza must not allow drivers to get away with very unsafe driving at another event.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:41 pm 
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Stewards have now summoned Max to speak to them. Ignore that earlier post saying that there's nothing doing. It's still ongoing.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:42 pm 
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Autosport stating on their website that there's no case whilst journalists staining in the paddock are tweeting that they've actually seen him walking to the stewards.

What to believe?

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:44 pm 
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Surely the stewards have to look at the Vestappen yellow flag incident. They can not let that slide.

He clearly went purple and admitted to the press he didnt lift.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:46 pm 
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Asphalt_World wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Asphalt_World wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Laz_T800 wrote:

Jog on mate.
I'd prefer a Max Pole to a Ferrari one but he can't put other drivers lives at risk like that.
Bottas is sat in the wall and he breaks the track record.
I'm fuming to be honest, and you just carry on with " it cus it's Max BS", seriously?


Did you say the same when Bottas did it at Monza?


I know the answer you're after, but fear you wont get it. In fact, someone else has already told you it was discussed quite a bit at Monza.

But put that to one side. Do you agree that a driver should be able to set a fastest sector through a yellow flag with a driver sitting in a car just off the racing line? That's the bigger question here. I would hope you don't think it's acceptable. This isn't about a suitable penalty, just the fact that it was bloody dangerous and broke the yellow flag rules. That's the main point being discussed here.


Oh I think the lap should be stripped and an additional penalty applied .

But after Monza how can the stewards do that?


We can't let mistakes from any previous races, even if it was made at a race 7 days ago, get in the way of safety. A mistake in Monza must not allow drivers to get away with very unsafe driving at another event.


In a way I very much agree although it would certainly be very unfair on Verstappen.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:47 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
Asphalt_World wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Asphalt_World wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:

Did you say the same when Bottas did it at Monza?


I know the answer you're after, but fear you wont get it. In fact, someone else has already told you it was discussed quite a bit at Monza.

But put that to one side. Do you agree that a driver should be able to set a fastest sector through a yellow flag with a driver sitting in a car just off the racing line? That's the bigger question here. I would hope you don't think it's acceptable. This isn't about a suitable penalty, just the fact that it was bloody dangerous and broke the yellow flag rules. That's the main point being discussed here.


Oh I think the lap should be stripped and an additional penalty applied .

But after Monza how can the stewards do that?


We can't let mistakes from any previous races, even if it was made at a race 7 days ago, get in the way of safety. A mistake in Monza must not allow drivers to get away with very unsafe driving at another event.


In a way I very much agree although it would certainly be very unfair on Verstappen.


Yes, but I think it has to be done. I think they need to look at last corner data for all the cars that passed following the crash because a slower final sector doesn't mean they weren't flat through that corner.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:47 pm 
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Clarky wrote:
Surely the stewards have to look at the Vestappen yellow flag incident. They can not let that slide.

He clearly went purple and admitted to the press he didnt lift.

Bang to rights if you ask me.



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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:50 pm 
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He bloody entertaining for the sport but you have to wonder what his bosses are thinking when he makes comments like that in a press conference. Doesn't sound like he's got much common sense!

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:55 pm 
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Right. Just seen the summons and Max and boss have been called for 4.10pm. That's in about 15 minutes I think.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:56 pm 
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I suspect he keep his foot down because of when and where the incident took place, i.e. He thought drivers that had passed it would have a chance to complete their lap and take his pole.

It's the sort of thing that if left without any meaningful penalty seriously undermines the safety of those involved in or first attending an accident.

Even if there weren't yellow flags, the above video admitting he saw the accident and didn't back off passing it is pretty damning in my opinion.

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Last edited by wolfticket on Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:59 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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