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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2019 1:31 pm 
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Johnson wrote:
Albon matching Max in qualifying? Did Max have an engine? I know he did in Q1

Unrepresentative but Albon 48-35 Max in points after 5 races.

I'm not sure if Verstappen's engine problem continued as the grip through qualifying seemed to ramp up, they did start on a green track after all.

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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2019 1:32 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
Mercedes-Benz wrote:
Albon race pace was very slow and it looks unlikely he is going to trouble the top drivers. So I think he is just doing bare minimum of finishing ahead of the midfield teams.


I think he's done enough to be given a proper run next season. All things considered he's certainly done a lot better than Gasly.

I agree although conversely Gasly is impressing more in the STR, strange. :?

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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sat Oct 19, 2019 8:52 am 
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The other rookie is starting to improve now too. A glance at Kimi vs Giovinazzi first 5 and last 5 qualifying sessions.

Aus +0.400
Bah +1.004

Chi - N/A
Baku +0.081
Spain +0.786


Spa - N/A
Italy +0.002
Sing -0.161
Rus -0.803
Jap -0.104


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Mon Oct 21, 2019 11:57 am 
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Johnson wrote:
The other rookie is starting to improve now too. A glance at Kimi vs Giovinazzi first 5 and last 5 qualifying sessions.

Aus +0.400
Bah +1.004

Chi - N/A
Baku +0.081
Spain +0.786


Spa - N/A
Italy +0.002
Sing -0.161
Rus -0.803
Jap -0.104

The question is though how high a benchmark is Kimi?

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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Mon Oct 21, 2019 12:39 pm 
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pokerman wrote:
Johnson wrote:
The other rookie is starting to improve now too. A glance at Kimi vs Giovinazzi first 5 and last 5 qualifying sessions.

Aus +0.400
Bah +1.004

Chi - N/A
Baku +0.081
Spain +0.786


Spa - N/A
Italy +0.002
Sing -0.161
Rus -0.803
Jap -0.104

The question is though how high a benchmark is Kimi?


If he's performing at the same level as last season then beating him as a rookie is a very high accomplishment.

Given he's basically sat out two years we probably should have expected Giovinazzi to take time getting up to speed but now he has he seems to be at Kimi's level.


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Mon Oct 21, 2019 2:09 pm 
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Antonio is doing great although he has scored very few points. His problem is the race. I think he is usually some 20-30secs off Kimi.

sandman1347 wrote:
Mercedes-Benz wrote:
Albon race pace was very slow and it looks unlikely he is going to trouble the top drivers. So I think he is just doing bare minimum of finishing ahead of the midfield teams.

Nonsense. Albon has been solid. In case you didn't notice; Red Bull are off the pace. They can't match Ferrari or Mercedes. Alex has gotten the job done since joining the team and he has outscored Max in that time frame so far (extenuating circumstances I know). The most impressive thing he did was to match Max in qualifying at Suzuka. That's a proper F1 track and to be quick there shows that Alex has genuine speed. I think he's solidified himself as Red Bull's #2.


In qualifying he did great but he only finished 9.5secs ahead of Sainz and almost a min behind Bottas. Max was unfortunately taken out but I think he would have at the worst finished in the middle of Bottas and Albon.

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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Tue Oct 22, 2019 2:28 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
Johnson wrote:
The other rookie is starting to improve now too. A glance at Kimi vs Giovinazzi first 5 and last 5 qualifying sessions.

Aus +0.400
Bah +1.004

Chi - N/A
Baku +0.081
Spain +0.786


Spa - N/A
Italy +0.002
Sing -0.161
Rus -0.803
Jap -0.104

The question is though how high a benchmark is Kimi?


If he's performing at the same level as last season then beating him as a rookie is a very high accomplishment.

Given he's basically sat out two years we probably should have expected Giovinazzi to take time getting up to speed but now he has he seems to be at Kimi's level.

To beat him yes but he's not beating him, Kimi has been better.

I'm just balancing things out, early in the season he was rubbish and needed dropping now he's as good as Kimi, the reality is that it's been quite close in qualifying throughout the season, it's on race day were Kimi has been consistently better, in terms of qualifying I wouldn't put Kimi in the top 10.

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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:19 pm 
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Another shocker from Albon, barely outpacing Max who was on old tyres and he still hasn't beaten any of the top 5 in the WDC on merit when those drivers have had a trouble-free race. It was on here to beat at least one of them since the Red Bull was the car to have this weekend.

He couldn't even keep ahead of Hamilton when he made his first stop even though Leclerc could easily do so. Albon was ahead of Lewis, then pitted for fresh rubber at a track where the undercut works, and Lewis managed to do a long overcut on him. Really poor.


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:28 pm 
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Albon has a lot of work to do to be on the level of the other 5 drivers in the top 6 cars. And that's perhaps to be expected of a rookie, but that's no saying he'll ever quite be on even Bottas' level.


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:30 pm 
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I think it was decent performance 21secs off Hamilton and some 14secs from Charles. I think this was his best performance. But obviously RBR was really good here and probably the best car. IMO Max was the fastest driver this weekend and should have won the race had things gone his way. Since the summer break he is going through a rot. Albon is doing enough to be in RBR next year

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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:30 pm 
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It was funny to hear Brundle give Albon praise towards the end of the race when in reality Albon was awful.


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:32 pm 
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F1 Racer wrote:
It was funny to hear Brundle give Albon praise towards the end of the race when in reality Albon was awful.

Well he did outscore Verstappen again.

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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:32 pm 
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F1 Racer wrote:
It was funny to hear Brundle give Albon praise towards the end of the race when in reality Albon was awful.


Come on, in context it wasn't awful.


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:33 pm 
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Mercedes-Benz wrote:
I think it was decent performance 21secs off Hamilton and some 14secs from Charles. I think this was his best performance. But obviously RBR was really good here and probably the best car. IMO Max was the fastest driver this weekend and should have won the race had things gone his way. Since the summer break he is going through a rot. Albon is doing enough to be in RBR next year


Being 21 seconds off the lead when your car is better, that is bad.

He allowed Hamilton in a slower car to comfortably overcut him, that was seriously poor play there.

Albon will likely keep the RBR drive for next year due to a lack of options for Red Bull, and not because he is getting the drive on merit due to his speed and talent.


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:37 pm 
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F1 Racer wrote:
Mercedes-Benz wrote:
I think it was decent performance 21secs off Hamilton and some 14secs from Charles. I think this was his best performance. But obviously RBR was really good here and probably the best car. IMO Max was the fastest driver this weekend and should have won the race had things gone his way. Since the summer break he is going through a rot. Albon is doing enough to be in RBR next year


Being 21 seconds off the lead when your car is better, that is bad.

He allowed Hamilton in a slower car to comfortably overcut him, that was seriously poor play there.

Albon will likely keep the RBR drive for next year due to a lack of options for Red Bull, and not because he is getting the drive on merit due to his speed and talent.


For a guy in his debut year having changed teams mid season it was an OK effort.


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:40 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
F1 Racer wrote:
Mercedes-Benz wrote:
I think it was decent performance 21secs off Hamilton and some 14secs from Charles. I think this was his best performance. But obviously RBR was really good here and probably the best car. IMO Max was the fastest driver this weekend and should have won the race had things gone his way. Since the summer break he is going through a rot. Albon is doing enough to be in RBR next year


Being 21 seconds off the lead when your car is better, that is bad.

He allowed Hamilton in a slower car to comfortably overcut him, that was seriously poor play there.

Albon will likely keep the RBR drive for next year due to a lack of options for Red Bull, and not because he is getting the drive on merit due to his speed and talent.


For a guy in his debut year having changed teams mid season it was an OK effort.


He does have a very steep benchmark and learning curve. It just remains to be seen how much he can grow, but what encourages me is his willingness to mix it up and show quite accomplished racecraft wheel-to-wheel for one so inexperienced.


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:41 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
F1 Racer wrote:
Mercedes-Benz wrote:
I think it was decent performance 21secs off Hamilton and some 14secs from Charles. I think this was his best performance. But obviously RBR was really good here and probably the best car. IMO Max was the fastest driver this weekend and should have won the race had things gone his way. Since the summer break he is going through a rot. Albon is doing enough to be in RBR next year


Being 21 seconds off the lead when your car is better, that is bad.

He allowed Hamilton in a slower car to comfortably overcut him, that was seriously poor play there.

Albon will likely keep the RBR drive for next year due to a lack of options for Red Bull, and not because he is getting the drive on merit due to his speed and talent.


For a guy in his debut year having changed teams mid season it was an OK effort.


The excuses are starting to run out for him. He is still not getting closer to the pace, he qualified well off Max too. He has had almost 20 grand prix now, that is a good chunk of experience.


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:54 pm 
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F1 Racer wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
F1 Racer wrote:
Mercedes-Benz wrote:
I think it was decent performance 21secs off Hamilton and some 14secs from Charles. I think this was his best performance. But obviously RBR was really good here and probably the best car. IMO Max was the fastest driver this weekend and should have won the race had things gone his way. Since the summer break he is going through a rot. Albon is doing enough to be in RBR next year


Being 21 seconds off the lead when your car is better, that is bad.

He allowed Hamilton in a slower car to comfortably overcut him, that was seriously poor play there.

Albon will likely keep the RBR drive for next year due to a lack of options for Red Bull, and not because he is getting the drive on merit due to his speed and talent.


For a guy in his debut year having changed teams mid season it was an OK effort.


The excuses are starting to run out for him. He is still not getting closer to the pace, he qualified well off Max too. He has had almost 20 grand prix now, that is a good chunk of experience.


Hardly. This is his first time at this track.


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:55 pm 
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F1 Racer wrote:
Mercedes-Benz wrote:
I think it was decent performance 21secs off Hamilton and some 14secs from Charles. I think this was his best performance. But obviously RBR was really good here and probably the best car. IMO Max was the fastest driver this weekend and should have won the race had things gone his way. Since the summer break he is going through a rot. Albon is doing enough to be in RBR next year


Being 21 seconds off the lead when your car is better, that is bad.

He allowed Hamilton in a slower car to comfortably overcut him, that was seriously poor play there.

Albon will likely keep the RBR drive for next year due to a lack of options for Red Bull, and not because he is getting the drive on merit due to his speed and talent.


In Suzuka he was 1min behind Bottas and here he was 18secs only. Performance wise I think all the 3 top teams were on par. May be RBR were little better but I do not think anyone is expecting him to compete with the top guys already.

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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 10:04 pm 
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Mercedes-Benz wrote:
F1 Racer wrote:
Mercedes-Benz wrote:
I think it was decent performance 21secs off Hamilton and some 14secs from Charles. I think this was his best performance. But obviously RBR was really good here and probably the best car. IMO Max was the fastest driver this weekend and should have won the race had things gone his way. Since the summer break he is going through a rot. Albon is doing enough to be in RBR next year


Being 21 seconds off the lead when your car is better, that is bad.

He allowed Hamilton in a slower car to comfortably overcut him, that was seriously poor play there.

Albon will likely keep the RBR drive for next year due to a lack of options for Red Bull, and not because he is getting the drive on merit due to his speed and talent.


In Suzuka he was 1min behind Bottas and here he was 18secs only. Performance wise I think all the 3 top teams were on par. May be RBR were little better but I do not think anyone is expecting him to compete with the top guys already.


When do people expect him to start competing? Halfway through next season? He has had 7 races compared to Gasly's 11 races and by the time Gasly was dropped people were saying he had been given long enough.


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 10:06 pm 
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Invade wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
F1 Racer wrote:
Mercedes-Benz wrote:
I think it was decent performance 21secs off Hamilton and some 14secs from Charles. I think this was his best performance. But obviously RBR was really good here and probably the best car. IMO Max was the fastest driver this weekend and should have won the race had things gone his way. Since the summer break he is going through a rot. Albon is doing enough to be in RBR next year


Being 21 seconds off the lead when your car is better, that is bad.

He allowed Hamilton in a slower car to comfortably overcut him, that was seriously poor play there.

Albon will likely keep the RBR drive for next year due to a lack of options for Red Bull, and not because he is getting the drive on merit due to his speed and talent.


For a guy in his debut year having changed teams mid season it was an OK effort.


He does have a very steep benchmark and learning curve. It just remains to be seen how much he can grow, but what encourages me is his willingness to mix it up and show quite accomplished racecraft wheel-to-wheel for one so inexperienced.


What wheel-to-wheel race craft? We have only seen him overtake midfield cars so far, where he has a substantial pace advantage over them of course,. He hasn't overtaken one of the top 5 on track with equal tyre life yet has he?


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 10:09 pm 
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F1 Racer wrote:
Mercedes-Benz wrote:
F1 Racer wrote:
Mercedes-Benz wrote:
I think it was decent performance 21secs off Hamilton and some 14secs from Charles. I think this was his best performance. But obviously RBR was really good here and probably the best car. IMO Max was the fastest driver this weekend and should have won the race had things gone his way. Since the summer break he is going through a rot. Albon is doing enough to be in RBR next year


Being 21 seconds off the lead when your car is better, that is bad.

He allowed Hamilton in a slower car to comfortably overcut him, that was seriously poor play there.

Albon will likely keep the RBR drive for next year due to a lack of options for Red Bull, and not because he is getting the drive on merit due to his speed and talent.


In Suzuka he was 1min behind Bottas and here he was 18secs only. Performance wise I think all the 3 top teams were on par. May be RBR were little better but I do not think anyone is expecting him to compete with the top guys already.


When do people expect him to start competing? Halfway through next season? He has had 7 races compared to Gasly's 11 races and by the time Gasly was dropped people were saying he had been given long enough.

Instead of going along with your pointlessly negative narrative, I'd prefer to point out that Albon has outscored Max 58-39 since joining the team...as a rookie...switching cars mid-season...just sayin.


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 10:09 pm 
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Mercedes-Benz wrote:
F1 Racer wrote:
Mercedes-Benz wrote:
I think it was decent performance 21secs off Hamilton and some 14secs from Charles. I think this was his best performance. But obviously RBR was really good here and probably the best car. IMO Max was the fastest driver this weekend and should have won the race had things gone his way. Since the summer break he is going through a rot. Albon is doing enough to be in RBR next year


Being 21 seconds off the lead when your car is better, that is bad.

He allowed Hamilton in a slower car to comfortably overcut him, that was seriously poor play there.

Albon will likely keep the RBR drive for next year due to a lack of options for Red Bull, and not because he is getting the drive on merit due to his speed and talent.


In Suzuka he was 1min behind Bottas and here he was 18secs only. Performance wise I think all the 3 top teams were on par. May be RBR were little better but I do not think anyone is expecting him to compete with the top guys already.


Albon has had how many races for Red Bull, 5 is it? Max has been at Red Bull since 2016.


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 10:09 pm 
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F1 Racer wrote:
What wheel-to-wheel race craft? We have only seen him overtake midfield cars so far, where he has a substantial pace advantage over them of course,. He hasn't overtaken one of the top 5 on track with equal tyre life yet has he?

Outside of lap one, how many other people have?

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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 10:23 pm 
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F1 Racer wrote:
Invade wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
F1 Racer wrote:
Mercedes-Benz wrote:
I think it was decent performance 21secs off Hamilton and some 14secs from Charles. I think this was his best performance. But obviously RBR was really good here and probably the best car. IMO Max was the fastest driver this weekend and should have won the race had things gone his way. Since the summer break he is going through a rot. Albon is doing enough to be in RBR next year


Being 21 seconds off the lead when your car is better, that is bad.

He allowed Hamilton in a slower car to comfortably overcut him, that was seriously poor play there.

Albon will likely keep the RBR drive for next year due to a lack of options for Red Bull, and not because he is getting the drive on merit due to his speed and talent.


For a guy in his debut year having changed teams mid season it was an OK effort.


He does have a very steep benchmark and learning curve. It just remains to be seen how much he can grow, but what encourages me is his willingness to mix it up and show quite accomplished racecraft wheel-to-wheel for one so inexperienced.


What wheel-to-wheel race craft? We have only seen him overtake midfield cars so far, where he has a substantial pace advantage over them of course,. He hasn't overtaken one of the top 5 on track with equal tyre life yet has he?


Outside of lap 1 have any of the top 6 passed one another with equal tire life since Albon has been at Red Bull?


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 10:25 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
F1 Racer wrote:
Invade wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:

For a guy in his debut year having changed teams mid season it was an OK effort.


He does have a very steep benchmark and learning curve. It just remains to be seen how much he can grow, but what encourages me is his willingness to mix it up and show quite accomplished racecraft wheel-to-wheel for one so inexperienced.



Yes, Max passed VB today.
What wheel-to-wheel race craft? We have only seen him overtake midfield cars so far, where he has a substantial pace advantage over them of course,. He hasn't overtaken one of the top 5 on track with equal tyre life yet has he?


Outside of lap 1 have any of the top 6 passed one another with equal tire life since Albon has been at Red Bull?


Yes, Max passed VB today.


Last edited by F1 Racer on Sun Oct 27, 2019 10:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 10:26 pm 
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Option or Prime wrote:
Mercedes-Benz wrote:
F1 Racer wrote:
Mercedes-Benz wrote:
I think it was decent performance 21secs off Hamilton and some 14secs from Charles. I think this was his best performance. But obviously RBR was really good here and probably the best car. IMO Max was the fastest driver this weekend and should have won the race had things gone his way. Since the summer break he is going through a rot. Albon is doing enough to be in RBR next year


Being 21 seconds off the lead when your car is better, that is bad.

He allowed Hamilton in a slower car to comfortably overcut him, that was seriously poor play there.

Albon will likely keep the RBR drive for next year due to a lack of options for Red Bull, and not because he is getting the drive on merit due to his speed and talent.


In Suzuka he was 1min behind Bottas and here he was 18secs only. Performance wise I think all the 3 top teams were on par. May be RBR were little better but I do not think anyone is expecting him to compete with the top guys already.


Albon has had how many races for Red Bull, 5 is it? Max has been at Red Bull since 2016.


And Albon has outscored Verstappen during their time together with a measured approach to his driving


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 10:27 pm 
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F1 Racer wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
F1 Racer wrote:
Invade wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:

For a guy in his debut year having changed teams mid season it was an OK effort.


He does have a very steep benchmark and learning curve. It just remains to be seen how much he can grow, but what encourages me is his willingness to mix it up and show quite accomplished racecraft wheel-to-wheel for one so inexperienced.



Yes, Max passed VB today.
What wheel-to-wheel race craft? We have only seen him overtake midfield cars so far, where he has a substantial pace advantage over them of course,. He hasn't overtaken one of the top 5 on track with equal tyre life yet has he?


Outside of lap 1 have any of the top 6 passed one another with equal tire life since Albon has been at Red Bull?


Yes, Max passed VB today.


Not successfully.


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 10:29 pm 
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sandman1347 wrote:
F1 Racer wrote:
Mercedes-Benz wrote:

In Suzuka he was 1min behind Bottas and here he was 18secs only. Performance wise I think all the 3 top teams were on par. May be RBR were little better but I do not think anyone is expecting him to compete with the top guys already.


When do people expect him to start competing? Halfway through next season? He has had 7 races compared to Gasly's 11 races and by the time Gasly was dropped people were saying he had been given long enough.

Instead of going along with your pointlessly negative narrative, I'd prefer to point out that Albon has outscored Max 58-39 since joining the team...as a rookie...switching cars mid-season...just sayin.


It's not a negative narrative, it is the right narrative.

Albon's lack of pace is proving me correct so far. It is everyone else that is clinging to the idea that he will definitely turn this around at some point, given lots and lots of time. The results so far back me up.


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 10:29 pm 
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mikeyg123 wrote:
F1 Racer wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
F1 Racer wrote:


Yes, Max passed VB today.
What wheel-to-wheel race craft? We have only seen him overtake midfield cars so far, where he has a substantial pace advantage over them of course,. He hasn't overtaken one of the top 5 on track with equal tyre life yet has he?


Outside of lap 1 have any of the top 6 passed one another with equal tire life since Albon has been at Red Bull?


Yes, Max passed VB today.


Not successfully.


Only because VB crashed into him.


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 10:30 pm 
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FormulaFun wrote:
Option or Prime wrote:
Mercedes-Benz wrote:
In Suzuka he was 1min behind Bottas and here he was 18secs only. Performance wise I think all the 3 top teams were on par. May be RBR were little better but I do not think anyone is expecting him to compete with the top guys already.


Albon has had how many races for Red Bull, 5 is it? Max has been at Red Bull since 2016.


And Albon has outscored Verstappen during their time together with a measured approach to his driving


See Danny Ric. vs Danny Kyv. from 2015.


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 10:32 pm 
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I find it amazing how vociferously F1 Racer is pushing this "Albon's not good enough" narrative when Alex has performed better than Max since joining the team. Alex has more headroom for improvement than Max (this being his rookie year) and he has managed to do a better job these last few races of bringing home the points. No, he hasn't matched Max for pace but there aren't many who could hope to do that anyway. It's getting ridiculous.


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 10:44 pm 
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F1 Racer wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
F1 Racer wrote:
Mercedes-Benz wrote:
I think it was decent performance 21secs off Hamilton and some 14secs from Charles. I think this was his best performance. But obviously RBR was really good here and probably the best car. IMO Max was the fastest driver this weekend and should have won the race had things gone his way. Since the summer break he is going through a rot. Albon is doing enough to be in RBR next year


Being 21 seconds off the lead when your car is better, that is bad.

He allowed Hamilton in a slower car to comfortably overcut him, that was seriously poor play there.

Albon will likely keep the RBR drive for next year due to a lack of options for Red Bull, and not because he is getting the drive on merit due to his speed and talent.


For a guy in his debut year having changed teams mid season it was an OK effort.


The excuses are starting to run out for him. He is still not getting closer to the pace, he qualified well off Max too. He has had almost 20 grand prix now, that is a good chunk of experience.

Saying 'almost 20 Grands Prix' when it's actually 18 implies you're desperate to bring him down at any opportunity. Can't you just admit he's doing a solid job?

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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 10:53 pm 
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MistaVega23 wrote:
F1 Racer wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:

For a guy in his debut year having changed teams mid season it was an OK effort.


The excuses are starting to run out for him. He is still not getting closer to the pace, he qualified well off Max too. He has had almost 20 grand prix now, that is a good chunk of experience.

Saying 'almost 20 Grands Prix' when it's actually 18 implies you're desperate to bring him down at any opportunity. Can't you just admit he's doing a solid job?


18 is almost 20 right?


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 11:34 pm 
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sandman1347 wrote:
I find it amazing how vociferously F1 Racer is pushing this "Albon's not good enough" narrative when Alex has performed better than Max since joining the team. Alex has more headroom for improvement than Max (this being his rookie year) and he has managed to do a better job these last few races of bringing home the points. No, he hasn't matched Max for pace but there aren't many who could hope to do that anyway. It's getting ridiculous.

Have to fully agree with this. There is a good reason why they don’t normally put a rookie in a top team. Not only is he still raw he is forced to try and compete with the best in the sport as he is trying to find his feet. You would actually forgive Albon for making some foolish mistakes as he tries to make up for the pace deficit he will inevitably have against the other 5 at this stage in his career and having to get to grips with a new team. Max may have the pace but he is the one racking up the errors while albon keeps his head. Perhaps he won't reach the level of those he finds himself having to compete with but he's doing a solid job given the circumstances.


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 1:25 am 
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WHoff78 wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
I find it amazing how vociferously F1 Racer is pushing this "Albon's not good enough" narrative when Alex has performed better than Max since joining the team. Alex has more headroom for improvement than Max (this being his rookie year) and he has managed to do a better job these last few races of bringing home the points. No, he hasn't matched Max for pace but there aren't many who could hope to do that anyway. It's getting ridiculous.

Have to fully agree with this. There is a good reason why they don’t normally put a rookie in a top team. Not only is he still raw he is forced to try and compete with the best in the sport as he is trying to find his feet. You would actually forgive Albon for making some foolish mistakes as he tries to make up for the pace deficit he will inevitably have against the other 5 at this stage in his career and having to get to grips with a new team. Max may have the pace but he is the one racking up the errors while albon keeps his head. Perhaps he won't reach the level of those he finds himself having to compete with but he's doing a solid job given the circumstances.


:thumbup:

To me he is the ideal number 2 to max, definitely slower, but ultimately does not embarrass himself and consistently able to put the car where it belongs. In addition he happens to be an above average overtaker. Raw pace is suspect so far but he has already matched Max once in qualifying, so maybe he will only get closer. Actually the closer he gets to Max, the worst that dynamic will be for Redbull imo.


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 1:53 am 
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kleefton wrote:
WHoff78 wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
I find it amazing how vociferously F1 Racer is pushing this "Albon's not good enough" narrative when Alex has performed better than Max since joining the team. Alex has more headroom for improvement than Max (this being his rookie year) and he has managed to do a better job these last few races of bringing home the points. No, he hasn't matched Max for pace but there aren't many who could hope to do that anyway. It's getting ridiculous.

Have to fully agree with this. There is a good reason why they don’t normally put a rookie in a top team. Not only is he still raw he is forced to try and compete with the best in the sport as he is trying to find his feet. You would actually forgive Albon for making some foolish mistakes as he tries to make up for the pace deficit he will inevitably have against the other 5 at this stage in his career and having to get to grips with a new team. Max may have the pace but he is the one racking up the errors while albon keeps his head. Perhaps he won't reach the level of those he finds himself having to compete with but he's doing a solid job given the circumstances.


:thumbup:

To me he is the ideal number 2 to max, definitely slower, but ultimately does not embarrass himself and consistently able to put the car where it belongs. In addition he happens to be an above average overtaker. Raw pace is suspect so far but he has already matched Max once in qualifying, so maybe he will only get closer. Actually the closer he gets to Max, the worst that dynamic will be for Redbull imo.


If he's putting the car where it belongs then how is his race pace suspect? Your post is a complete contradiction.

The reality is that he is not putting the car where it belongs, as Red Bull were fastest in Mexico, (as they were last season), so should have been having a 1-2 finish if their car was being put where it belongs. After Max's issues that came about mostly of his own making, the path should have been clear for Albon to win his first grand prix but he floundered again this weekend. At the very least he should have been in the mix with the top four cars but he fell away big time in the end and was not in contention at all.


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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 3:12 am 
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I think F1 Racer must be Pierre Gasly's Mum.

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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 6:12 am 
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Albon must be junk as he isn't matching or pushing a top tier talent in his first season!

All things considered, he is doing fine. He is doing far better than Gasly - whom I struggle to think of a driver promoted to a big team doing worse than.

Will Albon become a top tier driver - probably not - but he is competant enough and surely will only do better with a pre-season of development and testing under his belt.

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 Post subject: Re: Albon in, Gasly out
PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 9:10 am 
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Max won his first race with Red Bull and was in the mix from the beginning and he had about 25 grand prix under his belt at this point. Albon has had 18 grand prix and yet to put himself in the mix at all, (something that Christian Horner alluded to that he wanted from his second driver after watching a dismal display from Gasly in Hungary). The evidence so far suggests Albon is not able to do this.

I'm not expecting a Daniel Ricciardo level of performance but I would like to see a level that is perhaps only one tier down from DR. Instead Albon is looking two or three tiers down from DR right now.


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