planetf1.com

It is currently Wed Oct 23, 2019 10:26 pm

All times are UTC


Forum rules


Please read the forum rules



Post new topic Reply to topic
Author Message
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:10 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:30 pm
Posts: 32842
sandman1347 wrote:
lucifers wrote:
what happened to Ferrari

Their only hope is that this is just not their circuit. If last year is anything to go by, they might be on it in Bahrain. If this gap persists through the second race we can start the 2020 threads because it's over.

Ferrari brought major upgrades to Bahrain last year.

_________________
PF1 Pick 10 Competition

2013: 5th Place
2014: Champion
2015: 3rd Place
2016: 4th Place

2017: 9th Place
2018: 7th place


Wins: Canada 2018, Abu Dhabi 2017
Podiums: (8)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:10 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:30 pm
Posts: 32842
mcdo wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
Embarrassing performance from Gasly.


Marko already making plans to replace him with Kvyat??????

Nah it would be Albon!

He out qualified Kvyat.

_________________
PF1 Pick 10 Competition

2013: 5th Place
2014: Champion
2015: 3rd Place
2016: 4th Place

2017: 9th Place
2018: 7th place


Wins: Canada 2018, Abu Dhabi 2017
Podiums: (8)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:14 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun May 25, 2008 7:55 pm
Posts: 6871
I was happy to see Max perform as well as he did. Lando was also brilliant. For a 19 year old in his first weekend he showed poise and pace. Every lap he did was solid.

Haas are possibly best of the rest and it's high time they started to consider bringing in better drivers. My gut feeling is that their car is very close to the Red Bull at the moment. Kimi did a great job in the Alfa as well and the Ferrari customers seem to have retained their superiority over Mercedes' customers.

I'm a bit baffled by Ferrari. They were not even close! I pointed out that this might be like last year where they just didn't perform well in Melbourne but then had the best car for the next three rounds. It doesn't feel like that though. They had the best winter. Things were going smoothly and the car seems a lot more planted than the Mercedes from the onboards. The thing I noticed though was that the Merc is noticeably more aggressive on turn-in. It bites hard and it looks like a handful to drive but sometimes that's what speed looks like.

Hamilton delivered yet again in the final lap and he's made an art form of that. Bottas, for me, was the man of the session though. He needed a strong start to the season and he got one. Very solid and easily out-performed the #2 drivers for both Ferrari and Red Bull. Mercedes look absolutely ferocious to start the year.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:15 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon May 31, 2010 10:02 am
Posts: 2189
Location: Far side of Koozebane
UnlikeUday wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
Embarrassing performance from Gasly.


Marko already making plans to replace him with Kvyat??????


Should be looking at replacing the strategist, not Gasly.

Gasly's not that bad a driver.

_________________
Races since last non RB, Merc, Ferrari winner (After Japan- 19) - 135 & counting.( Last win, Lotus, 17/3/13)

Non RB, Merc, Ferrari podiums won in Hybrid era - 351 trophies available, 24 won

2017 WCC CPTTC - Jalopy Racing (Herb & Me)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:16 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 12, 2012 2:53 pm
Posts: 7988
Location: Mumbai, India
Norris & Albon shining on their debuts.

_________________
Feel The Fourth


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:18 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2011 8:48 pm
Posts: 3274
Location: UK
Herb wrote:
Just a reminder Ferrari were 6 or 7 tenths off Mercedes last year, but still had at least the joint best car over the season.

One swallow does not a summer make...

:thumbup:

We'd have been looking at a very similar result this time last year if Bottas hadn't crashed.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:20 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun May 25, 2008 7:55 pm
Posts: 6871
On a side note; not too impressed with Leclerc in the end. Vettel bested him easily in Q3. It's just one race and he had a slow start last year too but I'd keep an eye on that. Not to put too much pressure on him. Vettel is a beast and a very experienced champion but I actually expected more from Charles.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:21 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:30 pm
Posts: 32842
UnlikeUday wrote:
Norris & Albon shining on their debuts.

All the Brit novices out qualified their teammates (I'm including Albon).

_________________
PF1 Pick 10 Competition

2013: 5th Place
2014: Champion
2015: 3rd Place
2016: 4th Place

2017: 9th Place
2018: 7th place


Wins: Canada 2018, Abu Dhabi 2017
Podiums: (8)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:26 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:30 pm
Posts: 32842
sandman1347 wrote:
On a side note; not too impressed with Leclerc in the end. Vettel bested him easily in Q3. It's just one race and he had a slow start last year too but I'd keep an eye on that. Not to put too much pressure on him. Vettel is a beast and a very experienced champion but I actually expected more from Charles.

Vettel is an elite driver.

_________________
PF1 Pick 10 Competition

2013: 5th Place
2014: Champion
2015: 3rd Place
2016: 4th Place

2017: 9th Place
2018: 7th place


Wins: Canada 2018, Abu Dhabi 2017
Podiums: (8)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:26 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2015 7:54 am
Posts: 2634
What is worrying is that Vettel said the car felt good, but Ferrari are still slower than Mercedes. At least last year there were clear problems with the car in Melbourne.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:28 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun May 25, 2008 7:55 pm
Posts: 6871
KingVoid wrote:
What is worrying is that Vettel said the car felt good, but Ferrari are still slower than Mercedes. At least last year there were clear problems with the car in Melbourne.

My gut tells me this is not like last year where Ferrari just didn't have it together for Australia. I hate to say it but this almost feels like 2014-2016.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:32 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:30 pm
Posts: 32842
sandman1347 wrote:
KingVoid wrote:
What is worrying is that Vettel said the car felt good, but Ferrari are still slower than Mercedes. At least last year there were clear problems with the car in Melbourne.

My gut tells me this is not like last year where Ferrari just didn't have it together for Australia. I hate to say it but this almost feels like 2014-2016.

I agree with what you say about last year but Melbourne itself is an unusual track which may be flattering Mercedes?

_________________
PF1 Pick 10 Competition

2013: 5th Place
2014: Champion
2015: 3rd Place
2016: 4th Place

2017: 9th Place
2018: 7th place


Wins: Canada 2018, Abu Dhabi 2017
Podiums: (8)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:35 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun May 25, 2008 7:55 pm
Posts: 6871
pokerman wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
KingVoid wrote:
What is worrying is that Vettel said the car felt good, but Ferrari are still slower than Mercedes. At least last year there were clear problems with the car in Melbourne.

My gut tells me this is not like last year where Ferrari just didn't have it together for Australia. I hate to say it but this almost feels like 2014-2016.

I agree with what you say about last year but Melbourne itself is an unusual track which may be flattering Mercedes?

That's possible. Bahrain is a strong circuit for Ferrari so we'll know by the end of the second race whether this year will be competitive.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:36 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 12, 2012 2:53 pm
Posts: 7988
Location: Mumbai, India
But when it comes to race, weren't Ferrari the best team when it came to race pace? With a good strategy, Vettel can still win provided he's atleast ahead of Bottas.

_________________
Feel The Fourth


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:38 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 12, 2012 2:53 pm
Posts: 7988
Location: Mumbai, India
Qualy done:

Image
Source - https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D1w0ciAWwAEQVQm.jpg:large

_________________
Feel The Fourth


Last edited by UnlikeUday on Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:39 am, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:38 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun May 25, 2008 7:55 pm
Posts: 6871
UnlikeUday wrote:
But when it comes to race, weren't Ferrari the best team when it came to race pace? With a good strategy, Vettel can still win provided he's atleast ahead of Bottas.

If you're referring to last year then no, not really. They just took advantage of the VSC. If not for that, Hamilton had the race in the bag last year.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:51 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 12, 2012 2:53 pm
Posts: 7988
Location: Mumbai, India
sandman1347 wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
But when it comes to race, weren't Ferrari the best team when it came to race pace? With a good strategy, Vettel can still win provided he's atleast ahead of Bottas.

If you're referring to last year then no, not really. They just took advantage of the VSC. If not for that, Hamilton had the race in the bag last year.


I'm referring to 2019.

_________________
Feel The Fourth


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:51 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2005 9:00 am
Posts: 49
I think I said after the first test session that Lewis will put 0.7 seconds between him and a Ferrari in W3 at Melbourne.

That is a massive gap. Last year Ferrari came into Melbourne knowing they didn’t have the package but this year I think they were quietly confident that they were ahead of Mercedes.

Ferrari race pace isn’t great too. Red Bull are quicker in race trim.

For Vettel, I think finishing on the podium should be considered a good result.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:53 am 
Offline

Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2012 4:13 pm
Posts: 16071
pokerman wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
pokerman wrote:
mikeyg123 wrote:
Perez is the 5th best driver out there at the moment.

Only a tenth quicker than Stroll? :?


And Hamilton has been out qualified by Bottas on occasion whats your point?

I'm wondering how you judge Perez has the 5th best driver?


I think he's currently better than all of the other proven drivers apart from 4? a judgement made from observing his performances over his career.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:55 am 
Offline

Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2012 4:13 pm
Posts: 16071
sandman1347 wrote:
On a side note; not too impressed with Leclerc in the end. Vettel bested him easily in Q3. It's just one race and he had a slow start last year too but I'd keep an eye on that. Not to put too much pressure on him. Vettel is a beast and a very experienced champion but I actually expected more from Charles.


I think you may need to be a bit fairer in your expectations.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:59 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Dec 04, 2011 3:21 pm
Posts: 2531
BlackMist wrote:
I think I said after the first test session that Lewis will put 0.7 seconds between him and a Ferrari in W3 at Melbourne.

That is a massive gap. Last year Ferrari came into Melbourne knowing they didn’t have the package but this year I think they were quietly confident that they were ahead of Mercedes.

Ferrari race pace isn’t great too. Red Bull are quicker in race trim.

For Vettel, I think finishing on the podium should be considered a good result.


100% they were quietly confident, they were very silly shocked during quali and they clearly thought they were ahead, I think they thought that they were around 0.5 ahead as well even, so basically are suddenly 1.2 seconds off where they thought they'd be. Seems they have been duped by Merc who has been really downplaying performance.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 8:01 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2014 10:15 am
Posts: 2031
mikeyg123 wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
On a side note; not too impressed with Leclerc in the end. Vettel bested him easily in Q3. It's just one race and he had a slow start last year too but I'd keep an eye on that. Not to put too much pressure on him. Vettel is a beast and a very experienced champion but I actually expected more from Charles.


I think you may need to be a bit fairer in your expectations.

Given how much hype Leclerc had and most expected him to clearly be better than Kimi, i think that fair. If we allow him time, he shouldn't be as highly rated as he is. I personally expected him to be no better than kimi for a good deal of this season, but think he will improve. At this moment in time, I think Bottas will be the strongest number 2 driver in the top 3 teams until some way through this season.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 8:01 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed May 27, 2015 7:11 pm
Posts: 771
UnlikeUday wrote:
sandman1347 wrote:
UnlikeUday wrote:
But when it comes to race, weren't Ferrari the best team when it came to race pace? With a good strategy, Vettel can still win provided he's atleast ahead of Bottas.

If you're referring to last year then no, not really. They just took advantage of the VSC. If not for that, Hamilton had the race in the bag last year.


I'm referring to 2019.


Not according to this?
https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/arti ... V5EfM.html

Quote:
RACE PACE

Red Bull boss Christian Horner conceded that the one-lap pace of the Mercedes in FP2 “looked pretty impressive” but added “the car looks stiff and difficult to drive, so whether that’s sustainable for a Grand Prix, I don’t know”. After digging into the data, it suggests it may well be...

Long-run pace deficit (seconds per lap)

1 Mercedes
2 Alfa Romeo +0.9s/lap
3= Red Bull +1.0s/lap
3= Ferrari +1.0s/lap
5 Racing Point +1.3s/lap
6= McLaren +1.4s/lap
6= Renault +1.4s/lap
6= Haas +1.4s/lap
9 Toro Rosso +1.5s/lap
10 Williams +3.4s/lap

Even Hamilton moved to downplay Mercedes’ pace, but the data suggested the W10 had pace across both soft and medium tyres as well as on one lap and long runs. Next best was Alfa Romeo. Obviously, Kimi Raikkonen didn’t give anything away, but the fact there were few complaints bodes well.

It’s unlikely they will have the pace to outqualify Ferrari and Red Bull, and with the latter two so close in terms in long-run pace, it’s likely they would lead the pack in terms of best of the rest.

From there, it’s pretty close between Racing Point, McLaren, Renault, Haas and Toro Rosso – as was the case in terms of one-lap pace. According to the data, Williams are way off and face the prospect of being lapped at least once, probably more, in Sunday’s race. No wonder Russell and team mate Robert Kubica were so downbeat.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 8:07 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 4:09 pm
Posts: 4419
Location: LONDON...!
mcdo wrote:
lucifers wrote:
what happened to Ferrari

They were miles off in Australia qualy last year too. And look how quickly that turned as the season wore on

The weird thing is their car looks so planted and the Merc twitchy.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 8:17 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2015 9:33 pm
Posts: 2405
Herb wrote:
Just a reminder Ferrari were 6 or 7 tenths off Mercedes last year, but still had at least the joint best car over the season.

One swallow does not a summer make...


True but it feels different to me, because last year Merc weren't really 6-7 tenths better but Vettel barely improved his performance with the extra Q3 power and put in a mediocre lap by his standards despite being generally faster than Kimi. Vettel barely improving his time made the gap look huge and Kimi just wasn't very quick. This year, Vettel made the expected gains in Q3 and put something together and is still 7 or so tenths behind the leading Merc, despite Hamilton probably not putting in a lap as good as in 2018. Now it just feels like Mercedes quickly extracted a lot of extra performance out of the car not through sandbagging in the second test as such but because they only tested their real car for 4 days and had way more to get out of it!

Also it seems like Mercedes were very focused on getting it right specifically for Australia and also that on such a circuit with so many medium speed and slower corners that they are simply superior, which is something that testing revealed should well be the case anyway. This does create a bit of an illusion and so I expect Ferrari to be much more competitive in qualifying in the following races but the actual gap itself in Melbourne feels far more real to me this time than it did last year.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 8:21 am 
Offline

Joined: Sat May 01, 2004 4:05 am
Posts: 361
Those last two days of testing for Ferrari were rough and judging their gap to Red Bull I think there is a little extra there to be extracted.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 8:48 am 
Offline

Joined: Sat Oct 14, 2017 1:19 pm
Posts: 563
The very specific nature of Melbourne and means it's a mugs game to draw too many conclusions. But I am a mug and I will.

There was a telling clip of Binotto shaking his head when he saw Hamilton's Q2 lap. A lap that was strong despite a mistake and traffic.

It doesn't mean they can't win tomorrow. This is a circuit where something often seems to go wrong for Hamilton.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 9:26 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue May 05, 2009 11:31 am
Posts: 7715
So Vettel was right calling the Merc's bullshit!

I didn't expect this gap to be honest, I thought it would be closer. Oh well, on to the race


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 9:29 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2015 9:33 pm
Posts: 2405
Given the car characteristics, Mercedes might reverse the trend at all their traditional weaker tracks. Apparently, the car is superb through lower speed corners.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 10:04 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2007 9:11 am
Posts: 922
*sigh*

Call me when other teams stand a chance in this sport.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 10:24 am 
Offline

Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2012 4:13 pm
Posts: 16071
Worth noting the gap to the midfield has closed massively. and Haas are actually closer to Ferrari than Ferrari are to Merc. That bodes well.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 10:26 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Oct 06, 2006 12:07 pm
Posts: 9835
mikeyg123 wrote:
Worth noting the gap to the midfield has closed massively. and Haas are actually closer to Ferrari than Ferrari are to Merc. That bodes well.

That bodes well for Mercedes.

_________________
Räikkönen - Vettel - Bottas
Thank you Nico - You´re the champ!

PF1 Pick 10 Competition 2016: CHAMPION (2 wins, 8 podiums)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 10:36 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu May 23, 2013 1:05 pm
Posts: 7944
I'll wait until Spain personally. We saw this last year too, whatever the reasons.

If Mercedes are genuinely that far ahead Hamilton is pretty shameless with how much he was lying in the run up to this event, for little to no reason, so I doubt today was a true reflection.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 11:09 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Dec 04, 2011 3:21 pm
Posts: 2531
Black_Flag_11 wrote:
I'll wait until Spain personally. We saw this last year too, whatever the reasons.

If Mercedes are genuinely that far ahead Hamilton is pretty shameless with how much he was lying in the run up to this event, for little to no reason, so I doubt today was a true reflection.


It's sport not a freaking crime scene there is no shame in lying


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 11:18 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 4:09 pm
Posts: 4419
Location: LONDON...!
Black_Flag_11 wrote:
I'll wait until Spain personally. We saw this last year too, whatever the reasons.

If Mercedes are genuinely that far ahead Hamilton is pretty shameless with how much he was lying in the run up to this event, for little to no reason, so I doubt today was a true reflection.

Really...???


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 11:27 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 12, 2012 2:53 pm
Posts: 7988
Location: Mumbai, India
Image
Source - www.imgur.com

Image
Source - www.imgur.com

_________________
Feel The Fourth


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 11:31 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Feb 06, 2012 8:42 am
Posts: 1031
Normality has resumed with Lewis 7th tenths faster than the competition after all the yearly hopes and hypes of them having some competition.
RBR did well to close the gap to Ferrari in qualy but serious strategy mistake with Gasly.
McLaren seems to be in the middle or better part of the mid field which as great for them, even better than Renault works team. Cyril complaining about B teams, he should be focused on beating his customer with a rookie driver. Awesome qualy by Noris. Hope the starting on used tires does not put him at too much of a disadvantage.
Leclerc did not seem his usual calm self at the post quali interview. Guess that's the pressure of driving a Ferrari


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 11:34 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2008 1:38 pm
Posts: 2567
Norris was star of the day! Very impressive!

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 11:35 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Oct 06, 2006 12:07 pm
Posts: 9835
So Williams don't even have the straight line speed going for them... in fact they're slowest of the bunch.

_________________
Räikkönen - Vettel - Bottas
Thank you Nico - You´re the champ!

PF1 Pick 10 Competition 2016: CHAMPION (2 wins, 8 podiums)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 11:38 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu May 23, 2013 1:05 pm
Posts: 7944
Clarky wrote:
Black_Flag_11 wrote:
I'll wait until Spain personally. We saw this last year too, whatever the reasons.

If Mercedes are genuinely that far ahead Hamilton is pretty shameless with how much he was lying in the run up to this event, for little to no reason, so I doubt today was a true reflection.

Really...???

Well yeah, if he said Mercedes were half a second behind and they are half a second ahead he would clearly be aware he was telling the media nonesence, the whole of Mercedes in fact.

So like I said I very much doubt that we saw a reflective showing today, I don't see why Mercedes would say that when it's so far off the truth.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic

All times are UTC


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group